Older Haas memory upgrade

Hi

I have searched through various old existing threads started regarding the haas memory upgrades on the older style machines but none of them have the answers i am looking for so i am hoping to create this thread and find out a bit more

My machine is a year 2000 haas VF0E

It has the 1 MEG memory option which i have exceeded a few times now and i would love to up it to 4, 8 or even the 16meg that was offered when the machine was new

Here is my processor board




So the board has 16 memory slots

2 are fitted currently and they are 512k each and are model number KM684000BLG-5L


Part No. KM684000BLG-5L
Maker SAMSUNG [Samsung semiconductor]
Description 512Kx8 bit Low Power CMOS Static RAM

Does anyone have info on how the machine works out its memory and addresses it? i have no clue about this stuff so am just browsing and scouring for info to see if this is even possible? if i had a spare board and just fitted more memory would it just work once fitted or is it a case of there being a lot more to it than that?

From what i have found on google haas used to swap out the processor board for a new 1 with more memory if required back in the day as they were not going to solder memory chips on site understandably, but what else may they of had to do?

I have emailed Haas uk (i live in the UK) and they basically just said they dont offer the upgrade anymore which i already knew and said all they can do is upgrade the entire control at a very great expense which is obviously not worth it

I did email back and say i totally understand its not supported anymore but could they or any of the older techs tell me if the only difference was the physical installed memory or was other upgrades to components and parameters required to go from 1meg to 4meg to 8meg to 16meg

Does anyone else have any insight or experiance on this

Thanks
Marc

Can't help with the upgrade, but why not just dnc/drip the larger programs

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

I'm (moderately) sure that it wasn't just a physical memory chip addition, but some access code that needed to be entered to get the machine to recognize the larger available memory. And I've no idea if it was a "universal" code, or keyed to the machine serial number.

Best bet is to try additional searching or hope that a old Haas tech on this site will chime in.

But yeah, look into drip feeding.

Ok so i got a call back from 1 of the older tech's from Haas uk

He was as helpful as he could be but said its hard to remember working on these that long ago and doing upgrades, but he was sure it was more than just the memory chips added and also said he thinks it involved firmware changes but cant for the life of him remember what and doesnt have any old procedure paperwork or guides for what needed doing

So it seems that for what it is worth this thread has ended before it began but nevermind, it was worth asking as while my boards were accesible i would of done it if it were simple but i cant risk it not working if things were to go wrong as it is my only machine

Thanks
Marc

I had a 95 vf2 with 4mb memory. It got noticeably slower after using a couple mb.

If you are handy with a PC, there are some options that way. I used a Linux PC with a home built DNC and samba setup.

Hi

Thanks for the reply’s,

Yes I do have a DNC set up that works fine,

It’s obviously not as good as a bigger main memory but still does the job

The main memory upgrade was not really a case of necessity more a case of it would be nice if it’s not too much bother

I also asked this same question on Facebook via the Haas operators page and the titans of cnc page and got mixed reply but a few people have commented saying the done it!

Some things that have been said regarding doing this yourself are listed below

*If the board has a memory address chip then it complicates things as the main processor will need to know where the memory is etc but if there is no address line chip then it’s a plug and play with regards the machine will just see the memory and use it regardless?

I’m not sure how you tell if you have an address line chip or not and I’ve never heard of it but it makes sense I suppose

*someone commented that they simple fitted 6 more 512k memory chips to the top line to create 4meg total

Wiped the BBU
(I don’t even know what a BBU is?)
Then went through the debug procedure and re initialisation procedure for the BBU and entire set up after saving there parameters and setting beforehand and then re entering the unlock for any options previously enabled along with the haas 800 hour unlock code

I’ve never heard of the Haas 800 hour unlock code? Can anybody shed any light on this?

I googled about the BBU procedure and found some info but no full step by step guide so not sure how easy that procedure is to find out in detail

Lastly I can’t find and details on the older classic control of how to save all your system set up and parameters and setting etc incase you have to re install and re initialise everything? I can find info for doing it to a new control but not the older classic control


If a few people have succeeded doing memory upgrades ranging from 215k up to 8meg then maybe there is hope yet to piece together a more detailed procedure.

In an ideal world I’d like to try it on a spare board so there’s no risk of me Ruining my board as I can’t afford to break the machine

Thanks
Marc

I have a '91 so this may not apply to yours. My processor board has rows marked as ROM, ROM/RAM and RAM. The ROM chips with the paper tape over them (UV erasable) are the operating system and the RAM are the read/write memory. It had one row of RAM chips. The ROM/RAM row was blank with three rows of ROM below that. There was one blank RAM row above the RAM chips. I bought the same part number (you have to be careful about the speed, the dash number is the speed grade) and soldered them into the blank row. The memory went from about 40K to 220K with no software changes.
You could solder in sockets for the RAM chips and load them with the same chips as you already have and try it. If it does not work then you can easily take them out again. Mine were about $8 each because they are obsolete.
It may fail to come up if the processor does not recognize the memory but it should not cause any damage..

I found the procedure for backing up all your machine parameters and settings etc on the older machines

I will hopefully try this later this week,

I am just waiting for my vector drive to be repaired Before I can power up again

Machine Data Backup (Mill 15.xx and lower and Lathe 8.xx and lower) - CHC

I have two old machines 96 and 97 VF-2s. The 96 has 1,042,880 bytes of memory but someone added a bunch of memory to the 95 as it reads 8,446,429 bytes. It has 160 programs that are stored on it and only uses 5% of its memory.

Would like more on the 96, but waiting to finds out how and get time to do it. I run a few long programs and the last one I did on the 96, I had to remove all of the other programs to load it.

Shame you do not know who done the upgrade on the other 1

If you figure it out, let us know, my older wife needs the same upgrade, except for my screw ups, she remembers them just like they were yesterday.

I suppose it could be I made a few yesterday, perhaps even today.

Damn it to hell, maybe I'm the one needing the upgrade.

kustomizer said:

Damn it to hell, maybe I'm the one needing the upgrade.

Click to expand...

If the wifey thinks the same, you got problems...

If I were you I'd learn how to drip feed and make chips. If you monkey around with the memory and procedures to recognise the memory, and something goes wrong. What are the chances of Haas UK coming to the rescue? 0.00000000% I bet.

Especially as it's your only machine, you'll be playing with Russian roulette trying to upgrade yourself.

It's always my memory that's at fault for Missues GC. I held off posting till I confer w/ an old colleague- The Haas memory addressing (at least as far as we knew/know) requires a PAL upgrade or reprogram to allow the additional memory to be added in. (address space mux/demx stuff from way back). It may also depend on the PROM software but it's been too long for his memory as well. :-) anyway- Other posts are right on... dripo-feed it and try to make some cash.

I was a Haas tech during that time and I have done a couple dozen memory/cpu upgrades. The cpu board was changed out complete because they were built and tested that way. There is no firmware, just the base software. Every machine from and VF0 to a VF10 used the same cpu board, and only became a 0,2,3 or a 10 when the board was Initialized with the Init(model number) command.
There were no option codes for the memory capacity, only the typical options like rigid tap, hi speed machining, macros etc.
If you can get your hands on some mem modules,and your soldering skills are up to the task, I bet you could add it to the main board and it would use it.
I'll ask a friend who was my service manager at the time and is more knowledgeable than me on main boards, but I'm pretty sure it does a module count on boot, just like your PC.
Perhaps try to find another main board to test with?

I checked with my old boss, he says they just added modules to the boards, no codes or software change needed.
I was tempted to try this myself, but in the last 15 years, I can only count on one hand the number of times I had
to offload my probe macros to make room for a big program. I have one Meg of memory.

Roamer

Thanks for that info

So I can get the memory chips for approx £10 and for someone to professionally install them is £20 each so cost is very cheap really

So from you and your old boss knowledge that’s all that is required and the board will automatically recognise the memory that’s been installed and address it correctly? No re initialisation or firmware messing required?

I want to give it a go but my only worry is if adding the memory was to mess something up and stop the machine from working etc

Decisions decisions

Really appreciate your input though

Thanks
Marc

I don't see how you can do this with the battery connected, if you do there is a high chance of shorting the backup power rail, so I'd definitely plan around a complete backup and restore.

I know, for such a low buck investment in components I'd like to give a shot too.
But, to my knowledge, it's never been done. I can only offer the info I have from a installer point of vue.
When we did memory upgrades, it was a fresh board from the factory, and it had no parameters or settings loaded.
When the board is powered on the first time, it has to be told that it's a VF(number), so this will have to be done.
It's not difficult, I think I still have my old service manual that describes the procedure. I remember it was done from debug mode,
and I can walk you thru that if you've never seen it.
Then you load all your saved settings and parameters. You will have to manually re enter the option codes, so make sure you have all of those written down.
The installer who set it up should have written them on the inside of the back door. I think your machine is also within the 200 hour control lock program,
so you may need to contact the HFO to get that. I think that was implemented it 98.
friesen makes a very good point as to the backup battery. If you remove that battery it will require the Initialize procedure to be done. I would definitely
remove that and do the Init.

I did not have to disconnect the battery when I added the memory. Mine uses the HM62256LP-10 chips. You can check the power supply on yours with a meter on pins 14 (lower right) and 28 (upper left).
By soldering in sockets the chips can be removed again if they cause a problem.
As a precaution when inserting the chips, get the lower right pin (ground) in first.
Jameco.com has these old chips.
Just saw your picture. Your chips are PDM41024LA10TSO, 10ns, SOJ (300 mil) package, low power, 5 volt. Your power pins are 16 (LL corner) and 32 (UR corner).
Here is the datasheet:
Datasheet Archive PDM41024LA10SO datasheet download