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OTish -- Linoleum as way liner?

John Garner

Titanium
Joined
Sep 1, 2004
Location
south SF Bay area, California
Good Afternoon, All --

Somewhere around thirty-five years ago, I was sitting on a bench in a local shopping mall reading Connelly's "Machine Tool Reconditioning" while waiting for my wife and daughters. An older man walking past approached me, asked if I repaired machine tools, and said that he had spent his entire working life rebuilding machines at what were almost certainly the largest industrial manufacturers in Sunnyvale.

We chatted for a few minutes, and I asked his thoughts on the use of wayliner materials such as Turcite B and Rulon. He whole-heartedly endorsed their use, and the commented that during WWII his employer experimented with the idea, using linoleum for the purpose.

He then told me that "desktop" linoleum, commonly used as a drawing-board surface, was better than flooring linoleum simply because it came in uniform colors, which made it easier to scrape.

After adding that modern wayliner materials were much longer lasting than the linoleum, he checked his watch and said that his wife was waiting so he really needed to get going.

I haven't seen or heard anything about linoleum as a wayliner since then, and I'm wondering if anyone else here has heard, read, or experienced such a practice.

John

I've not heard any references to using linoleum
 
...commented that during WWII his employer experimented with the idea, using linoleum for the purpose.

He then told me that "desktop" linoleum, commonly used as a drawing-board surface, was better than flooring linoleum simply because it came in uniform colors, which made it easier to scrape.

After adding that modern wayliner materials were much longer lasting than the linoleum,

Well.. there you have it. It inspired experiments. From which improvements were seen to be needed. Then sought. Then found.

Then further improved upon.

I don't see why anyone would have gone BACK to a less suitable material - certainly not NOW - just because it had helped START the development of better material.

The improvements were harldly minor ones. All of the modern way materials are many times better for the tasking. Even as to simply bonding them into place reliably.

Besides... IIRC my old chemistry, "desktop" linoleum uses mildly abrasive materials as "filler" to attain a measure of durability.

Might make a better lapping material or hone for a Barber's razor - or a draughtsman's frisket knife - than it does for slideway facing?

:D
 
"Linoleum" 60 years ago was a very different product than what you get today.
Flooring these days is not the same at all- its vinyl.
There is still one company, in Europe, Forbo, that still makes real linoleum for floors- which is a linseed oil based product that is mounted on real burlap.
Not what you want.

What he is calling "desktop linoleum" hasnt been made in 40 or 50 years, minimum.
Desk covers switched to a rubber product, for drafting tables, at least as long ago as the early 60s. I used to have a couple of drafting tables with the rubber covers, in light gray or light green. Its not a scrape-able product at all.

The old stuff he is talking about is a related product to the harder linoleum that is laminated to wood for making linocut prints in art class. But that material is made softer than what you want, as it is designed to be carved.
You could buy some of that, unmounted from plywood, and experiment, but its softer and will wear out much faster than turcite or rulon, which are much more wear and abrasive resistant.

During WW2, they made do with a lot of wacky substitutes, but very few of them were continued to be used after the real thing was available again. My guess is linoleum was one of those.
Richeson Unmounted Easy-to-Cut Linoleum | BLICK Art Materials
 
"Linoleum" 60 years ago was a very different product than what you get today.
Flooring these days is not the same at all- its vinyl.
There is still one company, in Europe, Forbo, that still makes real linoleum for floors- which is a linseed oil based product that is mounted on real burlap.
Not what you want.

What he is calling "desktop linoleum" hasnt been made in 40 or 50 years, minimum.
Desk covers switched to a rubber product, for drafting tables, at least as long ago as the early 60s. I used to have a couple of drafting tables with the rubber covers, in light gray or light green. Its not a scrape-able product at all.

The old stuff he is talking about is a related product to the harder linoleum that is laminated to wood for making linocut prints in art class. But that material is made softer than what you want, as it is designed to be carved.
You could buy some of that, unmounted from plywood, and experiment, but its softer and will wear out much faster than turcite or rulon, which are much more wear and abrasive resistant.

During WW2, they made do with a lot of wacky substitutes, but very few of them were continued to be used after the real thing was available again. My guess is linoleum was one of those.
Richeson Unmounted Easy-to-Cut Linoleum | BLICK Art Materials

The linoleum I recall was used by, but probably not MADE by, this outfit - a/the dominant supplier of military and civilian government metal desks of uncommon durability - they were often a full generation older than those who sat at them - and matching ugliness. The desks, not necessarily the staff:

Globe Wernicke - Wikipedia

Possible maker could be Olean Tile, later American Olean. One of their favorite fillers for its durability was a mineral called "Asbestos". Silica was also utilized.

Those could also contribute to making Turcite, Rulon, Moglice look like far the better deal?

:D
 
The first anti friction way liner I used was " Formica " - remember that ? The next thing to come along was " Ferrobestos ". That went out of fashion when people became concerned about the " bestos " element of the product. Fortunately " Shamban " came along with " Rulon ", " Turcite " etc.

Linoleum was never mentioned, I suspect it may have been too soft.

Regards Tyrone.
 
John, I’ve spent a fair amount of time visiting relatives in Sunnyvale but only started visiting in the early 1990’s. I know nothing about the industrial history of the area prior to that. (I do enjoy the fruit straight off the backyard tree every morning) What were the industrial companies you were referring to?

Regards,
L7
 
There were two large heavy equipment manufacturers in Sunnyvale.

Westinghouse Marine Division: It was originally the Hendy mining equipment company established in 1906. It latter made triple expansion steam engines in the second war along with torpedo launch tubes. After the war it produced steam turbines and gear boxes. They later became a builder of submarine missile launch tubes in the 1970's. Grumman bought what was left of the company. About 60% of the plant was torn down and converted into housing in the 1990's.


Lockheed Missiles and Space: The peak employment was 32 thousand. Its main business was billing the government by the hour. (see note below) In the mid 1990's the pentagon paid Lockheed 4.5 billion dollars to shut down the non productive portion of the business. Employment is now roughly 6000 employees. It's primary business is still billing the government by the hour. The extended facility acquired during the Star War years was sold off at a substantial profit. The remaining, 1950's era plant is still in use. The manufacturing portion of the plant was shut down.

The third major manufacturer was 10 miles away in Milpitas. It was a car assembly plant. It was torn down and converted into a shopping center in the 1980's.


NOTE: I needed a job and no one else would hire me after working at Lockheed Aircraft in Burbank . The 1930's portion of the Burbank facility was torn down and became the largest shopping center in the San Fernando valley. The 1940's and latter Burbank facility was torn down and became a office park.

The shopping centers provide free seating for old engineers to meet and discuss the good old days.
 
My Father used Industrial Formica right after WW2, In the 1970's the plastics companies up here in Minnesota started to sell it as Phenolic. We cross referenced it to Grade Linen Phenolic. A competitor used grade paper and it soaked up oil and coolants. We were hired to replace it with grade linen. We started to use Shambam Turcite in the 1980's I still put it one. I did the saddle of a lathe last November.
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There were two large heavy equipment manufacturers in Sunnyvale.

Westinghouse Marine Division: It was originally the Hendy mining equipment company established in 1906. It latter made triple expansion steam engines in the second war along with torpedo launch tubes. After the war it produced steam turbines and gear boxes. They later became a builder of submarine missile launch tubes in the 1970's. Grumman bought what was left of the company. About 60% of the plant was torn down and converted into housing in the 1990's.
Rob't, Westinghouse was doing transmissions at least through the 90's, had a couple of friends there and visited a few times. Their electronics maintenance guys were second to none, they'd pull controls off machines they were scrapping and put them on special projects, the head guy Cliff was ... well, sometimes I'd call him with an obscure question and he'd say "Go into the executive, at address F9EF change the instruction to 2000, then ..." off the top of his head. Made floppy drive interfaces for their controls on lunchtime. I don't mean at the serial port, I mean into the bowels of the control. Then change the exec. Those guys were sharp.

In fact, they had one new gear grinder from Germany under warranty. But when the mfg's field service came to do whatever, they wouldn't let him in to see what mods they'd made to the machine :) No idea how they worked that out ...

Pretty neat place at one time.
 
The first anti friction way liner I used was " Formica " - remember that ? The next thing to come along was " Ferrobestos ". That went out of fashion when people became concerned about the " bestos " element of the product. Fortunately " Shamban " came along with " Rulon ", " Turcite " etc.

Linoleum was never mentioned, I suspect it may have been too soft.

Regards Tyrone.

I remember dad gathering up a bunch of Formica counter top material from our house to take to work back in my early teens.. Used it on one of the half worn out machines to get it back in operation until it could be replaced... ten years later! Rulon and Tercite were still a few years away from being available. Dad used a lot of Micarta in machinery repairs, too.

Ken
 
The first anti friction way liner I used was " Formica " - remember that ?

When I read the original post, my first thought was, "he does not mean linoleum, he means Formica" (which here in Germany is called laminate, Formica is a brand name.) Formica was also widely used on writing desks and would make much more sense as way liner than linoleum.
 
Back to the Sunnyvale thing for a moment. As a freshly graduated mechanical engineer back n 1980, I interviewed at Westinghouse Marine Division for a position working on the MX missile project. I will NEVER forget that experience. Westinghouse had done all the missile launch simulations for the Polaris missile submarine launch tubes years before and they still had the facility intact from that. The plant tour of the machine shop was an absolute jaw dropping experience for a twenty something kid who loved all things mechanical. I still have visions of that 240" double station gear hobber with its own dedicated thermal enclosure. Nuf said
 








 
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