Pics of my Troyke rotary table rebuilt by Condor Machine Tool - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    Looks purdy!

    Did he rescrape the insides? Else its equivalent to rescraping a bridgeport table top & repainting but ignoring the ways (but maybe they were still in good shape?) IIRC troykes don't have a ball/roller bearing but just a plain bearing surface to hold center?

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heavey Metal View Post
    ''But as far as I'm concerned, painting the sides and (presumably) undersides of the T-slots is amateurish.''

    You need to look at the pictures before you make such coments (your own amateurism/ ignorance is showing)

    Good looking rebuild job
    Stephen is spot on, it is your ignorance of proper iron fill, smoothing and paint that is showing.

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    Rotary table on a CNC mill, yes......

    Several times I used a horizontal RT because it was the only way I could figure to "turn" some large bell shaped vacuum forming molds.

    The molds were larger diameter than my lathes would handle. We put the blanks on the RT and cut 90 degree segments of the bell and rotated to cut another 90 degrees. Using a radial cutting pattern it took forever (compared to a lathe), but did the job.

    IIRC, they were around 28" diameter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    Rotary table on a CNC mill, yes...
    Not sure if this was in reply to the OP or to my comment about the DMT-15 re CNC machines. I agree that rotary tables have many places on CNC mills, but the cross-slide feature of the rotary cross-slide table (like Troyke's DMT series) doesn't add much when you've got CNC control.

    An aside for those who haven't used the old-school rotary cross-slide table: The useful stack up is XY mill table, rotary axis, XY cross-slide. (The Palmgren tables that stack the rotary axis on top of the XY cross-slide are OK for a drill press, but useless for these techniques. You need a table that stacks XY on top of the rotary.) Main trick: Mill table position controls the radius of the cut. Cross-slide position controls where on the workpiece the cut is made. Take the cut using rotary motion. Secondary trick: Rotary position controls cut angle. Take the cut using cross-slide position. There are sequences of axis movements that will (for example) cut a polygon with radiused corners, moving only one axis at a time. You can even make the radius different on each corner, all with one setting of the work.

    Obviously, CNC control trumps both of those tricks, with three few axes to boot.

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  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milacron View Post
    Stephen is spot on, it is your ignorance of proper iron fill, smoothing and paint that is showing.
    Pretty might make a two bit used machine salesman money but makes no difference here in the real world

    Alignment and function is what makes me money.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heavey Metal View Post
    Pretty might make a two bit used machine salesman money but makes no difference here in the real world

    Alignment and function is what makes me money.
    While that is true, whether is is "pretty" or not is all we have to go on with those photos. Even the scrapings could be non functional for all we know...thus the comments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Milacron View Post
    While that is true, whether is is "pretty" or not is all we have to go on with those photos. Even the scrapings could be non functional for all we know...thus the comments.
    Wasnt going by the just the pictures was looking at the whole picture as i percieved it the rebuilders web site , equipment , equipment for sale , instruments for sale.
    Plus the look of the scrapeing all said to me this dude knows what he is doing (the rebuilder) the less than spectacular paint also showed that he realy cared .

  9. #28
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    ''But as far as I'm concerned, painting the sides and (presumably) undersides of the T-slots is amateurish.''

    You need to look at the pictures before you make such coments (your own amateurism/ ignorance is showing)
    Heavey- I've had my share of eye surgery these past 12 months, but I can see when someone slopped paint in a T-slot. It is amateurish. Even the owner does not like it because it interferes with smooth sliding of the T-nuts, and then it wads up and spalls out when they are tightened. It just does not look good & performs worse.

    Funny thing is, up there (quote above) you seem to be saying it (red paint in the slots) looks fine to you.

    Now down here:

    Pretty might make a two bit used machine salesman money but makes no difference here in the real world

    Alignment and function is what makes me money.
    It looks like you are agreeing with me after all? (go back and read my post that you criticise, about alignment and geometry)

    Kind of hard to tell what to make of this next one. It agrees with my point that the rebuilder might have saved the customer money by not obsessing on the paint. But then you take it a step farther?!? (as a general principle, the worse the paint the more the care?)

    Plus the look of the scrapeing all said to me this dude knows what he is doing (the rebuilder) the less than spectacular paint also showed that he realy cared .
    I like the looks of the scraping on that table and until proven otherwise believe that it was a quality mechanical rebuild and scraping job.

    However, since you made the professional point, as a public service please analyse and explain the methods to tell by looking how good a scraping job is. Identify key characteristics from looking at it, that it is the real deal, as a general principle. Also how to tell from looking at the outside, that the stacked tolerances & sliding features were attended to inside. I scrape a lot of stuff and have inspected a lot. I want to learn your accurate methods for discerning the real deal from a quick look at photos.

    Thanks!

    smt

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heavey Metal View Post
    Plus the look of the scrapeing all said to me this dude knows what he is doing (the rebuilder) the less than spectacular paint also showed that he realy cared .
    Uhhhh....rightt....

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    Quote Originally Posted by stephen thomas View Post
    I like the looks of the scraping on that table and until proven otherwise believe that it was a quality mechanical rebuild and scraping job.
    Stephen, take a look at the picture of the bottom again:
    http://i445.photobucket.com/albums/q...514_110917.jpg

    If it was a quality job, the contact surfaces would be scraped flat and parallel. The fact that they scraped the large stop collar on the bottom of the table sure makes me wonder, since that is not a bearing surface. Makes it look like decoration to me.

    -Dave

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    I think thsi si a very valid question,

    What sort of inspection did they do? did they check these parts against a master? Do they provide traceable run-out measurement?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rimcanyon View Post
    Stephen, take a look at the picture of the bottom again:
    http://i445.photobucket.com/albums/q...514_110917.jpg

    If it was a quality job, the contact surfaces would be scraped flat and parallel. The fact that they scraped the large stop collar on the bottom of the table sure makes me wonder, since that is not a bearing surface. Makes it look like decoration to me.

    -Dave
    Hah, you have a good point. My first look didn't see those other pics, just the top one, and I must admit that I wouldn't like the painted t-slots. So, it sure is prettied up with flaking. That said, I don't think anyone can tell how good the scraping was in a pic, although there are some red flags as I look closer. As another example, in the first picture, notice on the right side how the section that is almost on the right side has a bunch of ridges scraped in the surface, and if that was the case it would suggest that the plate had ridges in it when scraped flat. That would be very unusual wear, and especially in a single quadrant like that, doncha think?

    This pic:

    http://i445.photobucket.com/albums/q...514_110804.jpg

    The other thing that is odd about the picture of the bottom you posted a link to is that the area under the dial was not painted. That *might* suggest they didn't take the table apart to paint it, but possibly left the dial on the table and painted around it. Otherwise why would they have missed that area under the bottom side?

    I have to completely agree about your comments in regards to the stop collar on the bottom, *IF* that was scraped properly it would take a decent amount of time for flatness. It does look as if the surfaces may have been scraped to look nice but not scraped for flatness. If that was the case, what's the point?

  14. #33
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    Originally Posted by rimcanyon
    Stephen, take a look at the picture of the bottom again:
    http://i445.photobucket.com/albums/q...514_110917.jpg

    If it was a quality job, the contact surfaces would be scraped flat and parallel. The fact that they scraped the large stop collar on the bottom of the table sure makes me wonder, since that is not a bearing surface. Makes it look like decoration to me.

    -Dave
    Good point, Dave. I missed that picture. Funny to spend time detailing that nut where it seldom shows (only in vertical position) compared to less care in paint areas that show all the time. It may have needed skimmed to reduce height after the base was scraped, but scraping it is at least "interesting".

    As another issue, I do not know what the configuration of a Troyke table top is underneath. It could (most likely does)include a raised or separate boss in the casting that is the mating bearing surface. So the fact that primer or incomplete stripping is apparent in the visible area is another indication of less that first class cleaning and paint but does not immediately rule out attention to the bearing surfaces. It could still possibly have been scraped when apart. (under the rotating table edge)

    If this was scraped as a unit (not disassembled and each part scraped individually to establish and maintain parallel surfaces), then it may well work worse than it did beforehand with camming of the table surface to the base as the high side travels around as the table is cranked. I'd sure want some sort of test card. You can't just scrape the top of the table and the base in situ and expect it to come out ok. It won't. It is also possible to scrape it (top surface, in place) with attention to an indicator. I proabably would not do it that way because the bearings should be at least touched up; so it would generally be easier to do apart. & then you'd have to do the base the same way or risk a tilt.

    Heavey, how can we tell from the pictures to settle this?

    smt

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    Guys keep in mind the pics were taken with a samsung galaxy II smartphone. It takes pretty good pics but it's not an actual camera. Also photobucket resized the pics when I uploaded them. Gerry from Condor is going to be at the shop tomorrow to do a few repairs on one of my bridgeports, I'll get all the details then.

  16. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edster View Post
    Guys keep in mind the pics were taken with a samsung galaxy II smartphone. It takes pretty good pics but it's not an actual camera. Also photobucket resized the pics when I uploaded them. Gerry from Condor is going to be at the shop tomorrow to do a few repairs on one of my bridgeports, I'll get all the details then.
    So the paint looks even worse in real life ?

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    By the time you guys are done with poor ole Edsters rotab, he'll be too paranoid to use it.

  18. #37
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    Leave it to Milicron to shit on everyone's parade....a true sign of a sour ass life. This guy (OP) posted a pix of his recent find and as usual he was nitpicked to death. Who the hell cares about paint (other than numb-nuts) it's a beautiful and useful asset to anyone's shop.

    Stuart

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  20. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by atomarc View Post
    Leave it to Milicron to shit on everyone's parade....a true sign of a sour ass life. This guy (OP) posted a pix of his recent find and as usual he was nitpicked to death. Who the hell cares about paint (other than numb-nuts) it's a beautiful and useful asset to anyone's shop.
    Re read the thread and notice I didn't say a word until Stephen Thomas was attacked and I simply pointed out Stephen was actually correct. Somehow this morphs into only me as the villain and having a "sour ass life".....amazing...

  21. #39
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    I agree I dont like the painted T-slots. Everything else including the flake looks great. There must be something in the water in Texas because it seems like most people I have seen from Texas posting online seem like they want to get very defensive. Maybe its a manners thing.

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    Links to the pictures no longer work. Would love to see them if possible.


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