50% pay cut at CAT owned loco plant, still feel needed? - Page 3
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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by SRT Mike View Post

    But when we make laws that make it legal for a bunch of people to band together and hold a company hostage, that is the furthest thing from capitalism.

    .

    Sadly Capitalism seems to mean " the right to exploit people in communist countries and to bring our population to a similar level "

    My main argument here is that union or not, people in our trades should be paid a decent living wage, its a shame that it takes unions and threats of strikes to somehow manage to suck some extra $ out of those companies who only dream to see us live in a cardboard box if it cuts their costs and boosts profits. Even more shame that none of those companies would do anything without government hand outs and tax incentives.


    There's without doubt abuse from unions that got them their bad rep, greed is in nearly everyone and everything and some of them have been no better than the companies they were supposed to be protecting the workers from. It's also no surprised that the non union people get angry when they have to do the same work(or more..) for half the pay and no pension.

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  3. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwananew10K View Post
    "But when we make laws that make it legal for a bunch of people to band together and hold a company hostage, that is the furthest thing from capitalism"



    where are these laws? please someone tell me.
    and does it *have* to be a *bunch* of people?
    is one or two enough?


    Here we get another part of the picture of rep/con thinking.
    The rep/cons think that people who have a lot of money are BETTER PEOPLE. They deserve special treatment. They have power, because they have money. The average working man gets taken advantage by the "Better people" and the company the average man works at. The average man doesn't have any money for power, yet he can have NUMBERS (his fellow workers). The working people use their numbers as a union to balance out the one-sided system.
    Listening as rep/cons bitch, what they bitch about and what they DON'T appear to be pissed about (and VEHEMENTLY DEFEND) it becomes clear that they believe THIS...Owners, rich folks, etc...should be the only ones allowed to use their power to get/do what they want. Average Americans can have SOME of the SCRAPS if they are good and kiss the elite's ass.

    Jeff

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    Quote Originally Posted by dekoopman View Post
    "Amazing that Germany's strong unions haven't driven out all their industry and they're doing quite well compared to US of Greed"

    The German government (and France) do a very good job of protecting their industries by imposing high duties on imported manufactured goods.

    NO, NO, NOOOOOOO!!!!! I HAS TO BE ALLLLLLL THE UNION'S FAULT!!!!! (sarcasm)
    The failure of American politicians to do what is best for American mfg. (call it protectionism, that is NOT a dirty word!) is where most of the blame lies. Not all, but a good chunk.
    Right and left, rep. and dem. should at least be together on this point. Last time I checked, some of you right wingers were not in love with all things GUVMINT! A lot of "left-wingers" (dems) aren't either.

    Jeff

  5. #44
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    I can't take a position that is 100% pro-union or 100% against.

    When the first union started, it was needed, because the employers were raping the employees.

    Since then, there have been cases of the opposite.

    In the last decade, I have been an independent contractor at several union shops (doing work there, but not in the union).

    I saw more than one of those shops closed because of, imho, the union. I listened to guys talking about getting thru a day without doing anything, all while there are rumors that the plant is moving to Brazil. Rumors were true, I had to help relocate their machines to Brazil.

    Unions are good and bad, like all else. You need to look at it case by case.

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  7. #45
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    Screensnot, your comments are the most accurate (IMO) so far. The fault isn't all the unions', or all the bosses', or all the government's. In a perfect world, everybody would do the best they can to improve everybody's lot.

    1) The government should help protect our jobs and way of life by not allowing foreign "raiding" of our businesses.

    2) The unions should not protect the lazy/incompetent worker or demand wages not based on skill, education, and knowledge.

    3) The bosses should not try to maximize profit at the expense of the people who make profit possible.

    The reason none of the above are happening is GREED. Everybody wants to get rich overnight and live "Lifestyles of the Rich & Famous". It used to be the Europeans laughed at us because of this, now, it looks as if they are starting to contract the same disease they used to ridicule is about. If they continue on their present course they may catch up with us.

    Personally, I think we should concentrate on cleaning our own house and let everybody else worry about theirs.

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  9. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peddler View Post
    That isn't too shocking. Seeing that it is a foreign company building and hiring here that is. They seem to be breed the only business 'leaders' with enough balls and smarts build here. American business leaders seem to be nothing but paper pushers and chickenshits who can't see any further than the next quarters profit/loss statement.

    Look no further than the crap that they are taught in college and MBA school. I've never heard of anyone being taught about excellence and competitiveness in manufacturing and being loyal to the USA. All I've ever heard from these idiots that run big business is to let a bunch of Chinese deal with the problems.

    Jake

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  11. #47
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    Times like this you wonder if some politicians would like the power to confiscate the plant and contents from the owner.... And to be honest I could nearly agree with that sort of thinking...

    A 50% pay cut is just extreme and abusing the employees....

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    Quote Originally Posted by willbird View Post
    Just don't expect me to vote FOR the next tax levy that funds the stuff that pays Janitors $33 an hour. If a private company is so stupid as to allow a union to take hold, and they do not just close the doors and move to a right to work state...
    You were doing alright but just couldn't stop typing, could you?
    These 'train of consciousness' posts become very telling. Telling in that it proves to some of us that many Americans are simply led by the nose on what and how to think by the largest 'mainstream media' outlet on TV.

    I LIVE in a right to work state. It might come as a shock to you to find out that there is a serious unemployment problem down here. This, despite tens of thousands of non-union, average-Joe Americans DROPPING their wages voluntarily in order to try and save their jobs. Their jobs are gone as are their factories! For some unexplainable reason even the non-union folks down here couldn't compete with the slave-labor wages of the Communist Red Chinese.
    Although you may not realize it by toeing that partry line so loyally, you and your ilk are doing nothing but trying to drive our standard of living down to that of third world countries. You're doing a mighty fine job at it too I might add.
    Thank God for the U.S.A. your parents handed you. I am surprised and saddened that you won't at least TRY to return the favor for the next generation.

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  14. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Welden View Post
    I love your outrage over union janitors making a decent wage! So fuckin funny. Then you sit back while the military blows trillions overseas! Gotta proteck Merica frum all dem camel jocky terrorists! Gotta get da bad guys! Them somebitches flew planes inta da twin tars! Payback time. Putta boot up Sadams ass!

    Fuckin dip shit.
    typical union thug.

    And $30+ an hour for a job that employees from the sheltered workshop could do BETTER is a real laugh riot. And an asshat like you would have NO idea what I "sit back" and let happen.

    NONE of you fucksticks would pay $10 for a hamburger and $5 for fries so the burger flipper can make what your union pay rate is, or $10 a gallon for gasoline for the same reason. Or pay double the price for groceries so the bag boy can make $20 an hour, $30 an hour on Saturday, and $40 an hour on sunday. Stuff in the stores should be priced on a sliding scale...just double the price when an overpaid union thug is doing the shopping.

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    Quote Originally Posted by willbird View Post
    NONE of you fucksticks would pay $10 for a hamburger and $5 for fries so the burger flipper can make what your union pay rate is, or $10 a gallon for gasoline for the same reason. Or pay double the price for groceries so the bag boy can make $20 an hour, $30 an hour on Saturday, and $40 an hour on sunday. Stuff in the stores should be priced on a sliding scale...just double the price when an overpaid union thug is doing the shopping.
    Whine and cry all you want, bucko... your post sure the hell reads like a whole lot of, to put it in a term you are already very familiar with no doubt, 'class envy'!

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  17. #51
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    What percentage of U.S. workers (Mfg.) are unionized? Not REAL high, is it? Yet they are the most responsible for American mfg's decline? Tough sell to logical people.

    Jeff

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  19. #52
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    you see... first we have to drive down wages into povery levels... then we can point our fingers and say "you bums don`t even pay federal taxes!"

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  21. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdj View Post
    What percentage of U.S. workers (Mfg.) are unionized? Not REAL high, is it? Yet they are the most responsible for American mfg's decline? Tough sell to logical people.

    Jeff

    Yes sure..... The blame game comes out... I doubt any class could take most of the blame... All are to blame equally... Political, managerial and working...

    They all wanted the most they could get and stuff the rest....

  22. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by RC99 View Post

    A 50% pay cut is just extreme and abusing the employees....

    At a time when the profits ARE THERE!!! THAT certainly qualifies as abuse. Absolutely disgusting. Union or not. It should sicken ANYONE who hears about it.

    Jeff

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    Quote Originally Posted by jdj View Post
    At a time when the profits ARE THERE!!! THAT certainly qualifies as abuse. Absolutely disgusting. Union or not. It should sicken ANYONE who hears about it.

    Jeff
    Maybe they should strike?

    That would solve ALL of their problems. The they could sleep in, drink like fish and get paid.


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    Quote Originally Posted by John Welden View Post
    ...fuck face CEO that outsources everything and drives the company into the ground...
    Quote Originally Posted by John Welden View Post
    ...shit only goes one way! Those darn workers holding the companies hostage...typical dumb fuck conservative thinking.
    ...could you be any more fucking retarded?
    Quote Originally Posted by John Welden View Post
    ...so fuckin funny...Fuckin dip shit....
    John,

    Have you been skipping your anger management classes?

  25. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalltime View Post
    Maybe they should strike?

    That would solve ALL of their problems. The they could sleep in, drink like fish and get paid.


    Alrighty then, CEO troll! Not much other excuse for that view!

    Jeff

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    Quote Originally Posted by willbird View Post

    NONE of you fucksticks would pay $10 for a hamburger and $5 for fries so the burger flipper can make what your union pay rate is, or $10 a gallon for gasoline for the same reason. Or pay double the price for groceries so the bag boy can make $20 an hour, $30 an hour on Saturday, and $40 an hour on sunday. Stuff in the stores should be priced on a sliding scale...just double the price when an overpaid union thug is doing the shopping.
    But a cock faced piece of shit like you will HAPPILY get raped up the ass so Wall street bankers can make billions by scamming the system.

    Typical fucking retard conservative going after the little guy.

    Bust the unions and deregulate the finical sector!!!! YEAH! If we can just stop those union bastards and allow banks to do whatever they want, shit will be great!

    Lets see here, wealth concentration is at an all time high, big corporations are in the best shape they've ever been, BUT WAIT, UNIONS MUST BE STOPPED. A union guy making a decent wage is why the economy sucks for the 99%. If we could lower union wages and transfer that money to the top, everything would get better!!!! YES

    Fuck off.

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  28. #59
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    I would gladly pay more if the money went to the employee. When people do work for me I pay them well, I dont want them to be thinking here comes that cheap ass bastard, I want them to be thinkin we are going to Red Lobster tonight, I am going to stop working on this other cock smokers jobs and do Kevins. It works real well for me my welder cant wait for me to show up with work. The extra I pay him doesnt hurt me one bit. I wish the freaken world was unionized that way we wouldnt need to give foodstamps to people with jobs.

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  30. #60
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    Having been a janitor, I have a little perspective. You don't want the janitor making $33/hour? How about you clean up your fucking mess.

    And has been said in this thread before, I'd much rather that tax money go to pay someone who actually works for a living, then someone stealing from hard working folks.

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