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  1. #61
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    I saw an interesting piece on the PBS news hour last night. The host was talking with a reporter from the SF Chronicle about the blackouts, why they exist, and what is being done to end them. He said that in addition to the risk of falling wires there were standing dead trees that might blow down and touch the wires and that even after the weather threat ends it will take at least a day to inspect the wires before switching the power back on. This reporter, who has studied the situation said that if all the affected wires were laid end to end they would circle the globe.

    One point I would remind people of is that while being without power sucks being burned out of your home is worse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnctoolcat View Post
    So, California will be left with their bountiful agriculture economy, and as long as they can import enough low-labor Mexicans to pick the crops, they will do OK in that regard.
    There are two problems with that "bountiful" part.

    First-off, the soils were never actually all that great, and LOTS of water has always been needed. The advantage was that of "industrializing" ag earlier than some other states, having a mild / no winter, plus taking advantage of cheap shipping - reefer, then frozen - to cities all over the place.

    Secondly, much if not MOST of America actually has soil as good or BETTER. No longer does the majority of the produce in our Eastern markets come from California. Not for years, already. Mexico or South is "in there", along with several other US states, even Canada. Not much of an advantage to central or imperial valleys, nor even Napa wineries left in there, present-day, is there?

    Ergo, costs, taxes, various rules & regulations, "climate change", and deteriorating labour, soil, and water environment can migrate agro right back OUT of Kalifornikyah just as it migrated IN - same as any other type of industry.

    I don't expect CA to go "red", next election. But for hem's sake, can't y'all find a democrat or three can actually do yah more good than harm?

    Getting to where Mao Zedong for governor (as-had, ie. "long dead" is just fine..) - or return to Mexican control, AKA "oxymoron", overall - would actually be an improvement, if only because you could then CHANGE s**t more easily for sumthin' BETTER, yah?



    Not that getting agreement as to what "better" actually IS would be easy in a state
    with as many different political agendas and even more gender-identities than it has marginal wines.

    Too big to govern? Maybe CA should split itself into 2 or 3 - even 4 - states and let folks re-base to suit their outlook on life?

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    I have watched California grow and grow. It is a beautiful state and a place where innovators flow to.

    When high innovations and wonder weapons are the newest and best then economies of scale often do not apply otherwise California would long ago gone this route.

    At least it has never been the lowest cost place to live. Then again maybe California Dreaming is as real as the American dream because the same reasons can apply to the whole country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trueturning View Post
    Then again maybe California Dreaming is as real as the American dream because the same reasons can apply to the whole country.
    They can and they have, BUT.. the "dream" was kindness, generosity, and live-and-let-live tolerance - coupled with personal initiative. Not the parasitism of socialism and burdensome regulations imposed on the lives of others "just because we CAN".

    Case in point, my late Uncle. Migrated to California 1931. Top glass worker, native West Virginia, great mechanic, "Fronty Ford" era DIY 1920's dirt-track auto racer. Took three weeks, patching a Plymouth salvaged from scrap, long months working at making experimental X-Ray tubes and such for a wage before he'd saved bus fare to bring his wife West.

    He then hooked-up with kin from WBGVA- the Knotts family. Harold and his wife operated the lamp glass art trinket shop for over 30 years, "Knott's Berry Farm".

    During which, frugal as he was, he made wise investments...

    - Became Corning Glass' largest distributor West of the Mississippi off the back of buying pyrex rod by the railway boxcar load, re-selling even a few rods at a go to glass workers from South America to Canada at better prices than they could get on ten-case lots, directly.

    - developed a foot-pedal-operated control for their torches, prototyped in his garage on a Logan lathe.

    - bought fallow bean fields, $41 an acre 'til he owned about 2/3rds of what would become "Buena Park". Then began to sell it off.

    Kind man, personally frugal, but generous with his friends. A USEFUL "capitalist" as an eventual multi-millionaire, if you will. No vacuum-headed socialist as to government.

    That WAS the California spirit. Pragmatic, chasing better lives. Balancing work and play. But never vicious about either, nor expecting a "free lunch".

    Still there, I am sure, that spirit. Just increasingly buried in parasitic s**t.

    California - nor even the Americas - holds no patent on THAT malaise, either.

    Either we drain our respective swamps. Or they will continue to drain US!

    That's not a "Trump thing".

    Basic survival even trees and animals have to cope with.. or die of failing to do.

    PROHIBIT "politics as a profession"?. Conscript all-hands off a lottery-draw for a two year go, but only ONCE in a long-life?

    Term limits. One in Government. One in prison?

    I could make the case we'd be better served, prison term came FIRST, too!

    Mought sorta humble the arrogant f*****s, and "in advance", yah?

    Imagine... A. "Bee-Schiff" BS artist of the Bigger Lie, thinking himself Napoleon Bonaparte, master strategist of battle.... sharing a cell with heavier-bodied "Dee Jay Tee"... only to wake the sore and weeping morning after in his new role... chanelling Marie Josèphe Rose Tascher de La Pagerie!

    And BADLY so! Of course.

    You'd have to know New Yawkahs... and what they REALLY mean when they say "Trust me!"




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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    The host was talking with a reporter from the SF Chronicle about the blackouts,...
    Since you brought up the Comical ...

    PG&E diverted safety money for profit, bonuses - SFGate

    Of course, why the PUC didn't notice these things a long time ago is another question ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    They can and they have, BUT.. the "dream" was kindness, generosity, and live-and-let-live tolerance - coupled with personal initiative. Not the parasitism of socialism and burdensome regulations imposed on the lives of others "just because we CAN".

    Case in point, my late Uncle. Migrated to California 1931. Top glass worker, native West Virginia, great mechanic, "Fronty Ford" era DIY 1920's dirt-track auto racer. Took three weeks, patching a Plymouth salvaged from scrap, long months working at making experimental X-Ray tubes and such for a wage before he'd saved bus fare to bring his wife West.

    He then hooked-up with kin from WBGVA- the Knotts family. Harold and his wife operated the lamp glass art trinket shop for over 30 years, "Knott's Berry Farm".

    During which, frugal as he was, he made wise investments...

    - Became Corning Glass' largest distributor West of the Mississippi off the back of buying pyrex rod by the railway boxcar load, re-selling even a few rods at a go to glass workers from South America to Canada at better prices than they could get on ten-case lots, directly.

    - developed a foot-pedal-operated control for their torches, prototyped in his garage on a Logan lathe.

    - bought fallow bean fields, $41 an acre 'til he owned about 2/3rds of what would become "Buena Park". Then began to sell it off.

    Kind man, personally frugal, but generous with his friends. A USEFUL "capitalist" as an eventual multi-millionaire, if you will. No vacuum-headed socialist as to government.

    That WAS the California spirit. Pragmatic, chasing better lives. Balancing work and play. But never vicious about either, nor expecting a "free lunch".

    Still there, I am sure, that spirit. Just increasingly buried in parasitic s**t.

    California - nor even the Americas - holds no patent on THAT malaise, either.

    Either we drain our respective swamps. Or they will continue to drain US!

    That's not a "Trump thing".

    Basic survival even trees and animals have to cope with.. or die of failing to do.

    Term limits. One in Government. One in prison?

    I could make the case we'd be better served, prison term came FIRST, too!
    Sorta humbles the arrogant f*****s, yah?

    Yah.



    I like those kinds of experiences it is so much about Americans the good parts.
    I agree that is how California is supposed to be and I would guess a lot of people still are that way. They probably need space to grow free of all the needless hinderances.

    “ California - nor even the Americas - holds no patent on THAT malaise, either.”

    Then if it is patented let’s make some in China and perhaps they will take it from us.

  7. #67
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    Supported many farmers in past life with their radio comms and back in the 80's when the water system was used as designed things were hopping.

    System was designed for 5 year drought and when it was operated the way it was designed all was good in dry years.

    Non native fish and cities dropping treated water into the delta impact the bait fish more than pumping but that is another story that Trump is working on.

    Sheds 200 ft long x 60 ft wide were common by the gins for cotten seed.

    Tomato trucks by the hundreds during that season.

    Had a logging mill just up the road...all my customers.

    Forest fires did not last long as the forest was managed.

    Now farmers still are contractually required to pay for full water delivery but it get 10 or less percent sometimes.

    Past flood irrigation restored water tables but drip does not.

    No forest management makes the forest a tinderbox where in the past a spark may have started a fire that did not spread now we have the mess we have.

    Spark starts a fire true but poor forest management makes things so much worse.

    We had winds and power for many years and not until recently has things went south.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trueturning View Post
    “ California - nor even the Americas - holds no patent on THAT malaise, either.”

    Then if it is patented let’s make some in China and perhaps they will take it from us.
    ROFL! Think those folks are all obedient little communist robots?

    My late Father-in-law, lecturing me in Guangdonghua whilst jabbing his finger at one graphic after another, multi-sided kiosk, Sun Yat Sen Museum, PRC. Call my wife over to explain what he is on about.

    "Lo Dao is trying to tell you that NINE of the most recent THIRTEEN Chinese regime changes were instigated by the Han people, including the current one.

    And that any time another Emperor or Central Government gets it wrong, they are ready to do it all over AGAIN."

    See Hong Kong.

    Nearly all hands have relatives - close kin, not distant - the other side of the border, some only minutes away.

    The mountains are high, and few Emperors long slept easy.

    Whom is copying what, and from whence?

    Those folk might not understand "democracy" as we do, but gar-ron-tee one thing.

    Chinese sure TF understand two things:

    - "Seriously pissed-off populace".

    - "Badly outnumbered bannermen."

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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    ROFL! Think those folks are all obedient little communist robots?

    My late Father-in-law, lecturing me in Guangdonghua whilst jabbing his finger at one graphic after another, multi-sided kiosk, Sun Yat Sen Museum, PRC. Call my wife over to explain what he is on about.

    "Lo Dao is trying to tell you that NINE of the most recent THIRTEEN Chinese regime changes were instigated by the Han people, including the current one.

    And that any time another Emperor or Central Government gets it wrong, they are ready to do it all over AGAIN."

    See Hong Kong.

    Nearly all hands have relatives - close kin, not distant - the other side of the border, some only minutes away.

    The mountains are high, and few Emperors long slept easy.

    Whom is copying what, and from whence?

    Those folk might not understand "democracy" as we do, but gar-ron-tee one thing.

    Chinese sure TF understand two things:

    - "Seriously pissed-off populace".

    - "Badly outnumbered bannermen."
    Sorry I need some time to translate your English so I can understand. All due respect I still am not a expert in following your meaning. That said I really like to have to figure this out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    The Gov shouldnt own anything but thats another topic for discussion. Dont get me started on the rollercoaster of LA aka the highway.....

    I'm so glad I dont live in California.
    I used to live in California, I am glad I no longer live there.

    On the other hand I have been through Arkansas a half dozen times or so, stayed in the hotels and eaten in the restaurants. Granted it was all in proximity to I-40. I wouldn't want to live there either. I thought I had traveled back in time when they still had Jim Crow laws.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dualkit View Post
    I used to live in California, I am glad I no longer live there.

    On the other hand I have been through Arkansas a half dozen times or so, stayed in the hotels and eaten in the restaurants. Granted it was all in proximity to I-40. I wouldn't want to live there either. I thought I had traveled back in time when they still had Jim Crow laws.
    It's terrible here honestly. But not as bad as California.... Donate to the schools, make yourself well known in the community, employ people and pay more than any employer around you, make friends with political people and sheriffs and no problems will be had. It's work but I dont have to worry about the local gov digging in my pockets over everything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Quiring View Post
    We had winds and power for many years and not until recently has things went south.
    Not correct. We've had forest fires and various types of fire programs since the thirties, maybe even before. A guy I used to race against in the seventies was sponsored by a firm that made a fortune flying borate bombers out of Sacto. That was fifty years ago.

    The biggest difference is, there's twice as many people in the US now as there were fifty years ago. And California, jesus. Put a thousand rats in a cage built for fifty and this is what happens.

    The US could use a one-child policy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmanuelGoldstein View Post
    Not correct. We've had forest fires and various types of fire programs since the thirties, maybe even before. A guy I used to race against in the seventies was sponsored by a firm that made a fortune flying borate bombers out of Sacto. That was fifty years ago.

    The biggest difference is, there's twice as many people in the US now as there were fifty years ago. And California, jesus. Put a thousand rats in a cage built for fifty and this is what happens.

    The US could use a one-child policy.
    This is only a difference of experience one person to another. One is experiencing a unprecedented power outage and another has not experienced such and so they fall back on a better experience.

    Good point is very valid that population growth has grown larger than the infrastructure. California is likely has too high a population in reference to resources like power and water. It must be sustainable to support the population.

    I feel for the effect of these power outages. Here it would be very hot if we had the same thing. Plus we have high populations that are elderly and who use the electricity to stay alive. The man who died in California because he could not use his O2 concentrator is too dang sad.

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    Yes we always had fires but not like today.

    More people is not issue but more fuel is.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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    I thought the Tesla home battery back-up a good idea but it seems failing...

    The 10-kilowatt-hour option was marketed as a backup power supply capable of 500 cycles, at a price to installers of $3,500. Tesla was angling to sell the battery to consumers that want peace of mind in the event the grid goes down, like during another Superstorm Sandy. The problem is that the economics for a lithium-ion backup battery just aren’t that attractive.
    (Likely near $5k insalled IMHO)

    looks like California does not work that well.. perhaps good to close that down also..(Just kidding as there is good fishing there...)

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    Down in southern California that other big utility did not shut down their transmission lines. Started a little fire which has grown,due to the high winds, to 100,000 people under manditory evacuation.
    7,500 acres with 19% containment. 13 homes destroyed, 18 damaged.
    This makes PG&E look better doesn't it?
    Bill D.

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    It would have been a lot better if the information they were sending out was accurate and precise. "We are going to shut off your power on this day at this exact time for this length of time". They called us multiple times with false information. I shut the shop off Tuesday night and they didn't cut the real power until 10pm Wednesday.

    Anyone know how much a generator that will supply 500 Amps of 480 power for a couple days will cost me? Afraid this is going to be the new norm and we just got our first terrible taste of it. Probably cost me 1/3 of the generator cost being down for almost 2 days of production.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganbuck View Post
    I thought the Tesla home battery back-up a good idea but it seems failing...

    The 10-kilowatt-hour option was marketed as a backup power supply capable of 500 cycles, at a price to installers of $3,500. Tesla was angling to sell the battery to consumers that want peace of mind in the event the grid goes down, like during another Superstorm Sandy. The problem is that the economics for a lithium-ion backup battery just aren’t that attractive.
    (Likely near $5k insalled IMHO)

    looks like California does not work that well.. perhaps good to close that down also..(Just kidding as there is good fishing there...)
    And for an outage lasting a week or more a 10 kilowatt-hour battery is not nearly enough.

    Right now I'm sure that many with grid connected solar cells are getting a very unpleasant surprise - they don't work without the grid! It is possible to use a transfer switch and a generator where the solar cells will take much of the load off the generator during daytime but that depends on the contract. Depending on how the cells were sold the contract may only allow grid connection.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dstryr View Post
    It would have been a lot better if the information they were sending out was accurate and precise. "We are going to shut off your power on this day at this exact time for this length of time". They called us multiple times with false information. I shut the shop off Tuesday night and they didn't cut the real power until 10pm Wednesday.

    Anyone know how much a generator that will supply 500 Amps of 480 power for a couple days will cost me? Afraid this is going to be the new norm and we just got our first terrible taste of it. Probably cost me 1/3 of the generator cost being down for almost 2 days of production.

    Might be best to buy 2 of these.

    Honeywell HT15068KNAC

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    Last time I rented a generator of that size it was roughly $1000/week. The hard part is getting the generator on short notice. I would expect that with these PG&E outages, you'll have trouble finding the unit as there will be a lot of demand for generators. Also, you'll want to have your main panel setup to accept the electrical cables from the generator ahead of time. There are nice modular connectors on mobile generators but you'll most likely need electrician to deal with the main panel.


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