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  1. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by kustomizingkid View Post
    ...
    I also watched a friend bracket race his and run 11.31-11.32 every run, run after run after run.
    That is so very tight given that temp and others change over the night of racing. Your friend is awesome to do this all day long..
    Even with his slow car your friend must me very successful and into the win often if he can cut a light.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    That is so very tight given that temp and others change over the night of racing. Your friend is awesome to do this all day long..
    Even with his slow car your friend must me very successful and into the win often if he can cut a light.
    Go on youtube and watch some Tesla drag race videos... they are unbelievably consistent. They have an extremely sophisticated traction control and torque management system and it works very well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob
    So have you driven many high HP cars with a open diff? Why would you want a "posi" out back?
    Differential ? What's that ? If you want to go around a corner, just change the stagger


    (Worth a quick read for the youngsters out there ... )

    Rodger Ward Midget
    Last edited by EmanuelGoldstein; 01-28-2020 at 06:58 AM.

  4. #324
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    All this talk about traction control for IC vs electric is irrelevant (besides the fact EV is more controllable) to my original post because the point was that cars were available 20 years ago with lots of what we think is "modern" and can still compete with many much newer cars as safe, comfortable, and viable personal transportation. That was after some responses questioned my assertion that much of the stuff that makes new vehicles attractive is gadgetry such as built-in wifi and other connectivity. Much of the "driver assist" features are also gadgetry and neither needed nor wanted by many drivers. Are some basic functions handled better today? Yes, but in most cases not enough better to make 10-20 year old vehicles obsolete.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    All this talk about traction control for IC vs electric is irrelevant (besides the fact EV is more controllable) to my original post because the point was that cars were available 20 years ago with lots of what we think is "modern" and can still compete with many much newer cars as safe, comfortable, and viable personal transportation. That was after some responses questioned my assertion that much of the stuff that makes new vehicles attractive is gadgetry such as built-in wifi and other connectivity. Much of the "driver assist" features are also gadgetry and neither needed nor wanted by many drivers. Are some basic functions handled better today? Yes, but in most cases not enough better to make 10-20 year old vehicles obsolete.

    I would rather take a 60mph rollover in a 2020 Honda Accord than a 2000 F150. Period. They can compete in many ways, but not safety.

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  8. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    I would rather take a 60mph rollover in a 2020 Honda Accord than a 2000 F150. Period. They can compete in many ways, but not safety.
    That's not an even comparison.
    How about a 2000 f-150 versus a 2020 f-150 ?

  9. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    I would rather take a 60mph rollover in a 2020 Honda Accord than a 2000 F150. Period. They can compete in many ways, but not safety.
    You are supposed to keep the shiny side up and the dirty side down.

    I'd guess a good majority of people on the road are not "race car drivers". In these cases those assist features help a lot.
    I think it actually needed, used and wanted by many.
    Compare even a simple base corvette with all those features to a 30-40 year old one. So way different.
    Even road race motorcycles now have this "driver assist" on board and without it ..........

    Cars are sold to the public. Most performance and high dollar cars sold will go to people with money but with no driving skills.

    Not sure which one of the above I'd rather roll at bigger speed. I'm actually thinking the truck.
    For sure I like raw cars without computers, I like my wife in one using such.
    Bob

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  11. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post

    Cars are sold to the public. Most performance and high dollar cars sold will go to people with money but with no driving skills.

    Bob
    And that's rather sad that driving skills have deteriorated so much in our time. I grew up with people who truly enjoyed driving and took pride in driving skill. I drove manual transmission cars for years in all kinds of weather. I even for a while drove an HO Mustang in winter with snow tires. It was pretty limited on hills but on level ground I drove on plenty of snow and ice. A lot of people I know still don't want a car that brakes or steers itself but we're not the type to be bent over a gadget instead of concentrating on driving. IMO if modern kids grew up doing more physical things instead of being "connected" driving skills wouldn't be so rare. We grew up riding bicycles everywhere over all kinds of surfaces so when we upgraded to cars and motorbikes we already understood the physics of wheeled vehicles, sometimes after painful lessons on the bicycles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    And that's rather sad that driving skills have deteriorated so much in our time. I grew up with people who truly enjoyed driving and took pride in driving skill. I drove manual transmission cars for years in all kinds of weather. I even for a while drove an HO Mustang in winter with snow tires. It was pretty limited on hills but on level ground I drove on plenty of snow and ice. A lot of people I know still don't want a car that brakes or steers itself but we're not the type to be bent over a gadget instead of concentrating on driving. IMO if modern kids grew up doing more physical things instead of being "connected" driving skills wouldn't be so rare. We grew up riding bicycles everywhere over all kinds of surfaces so when we upgraded to cars and motorbikes we already understood the physics of wheeled vehicles, sometimes after painful lessons on the bicycles.

    OK, Boomer.hqdefault.jpg


    (I'm just poking at ya, btw.... I also think there is a serious lack of driving skills on the road today... But I don't know if I attribute it to the same things you do)

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    I hate all the telly ads where a car stops automatically for a child on a crossing etc,despite the young woman driver not paying attention,arguing with children in the back ,etc.The message is obviously...no need to drive safely...the car will do it for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    You are supposed to keep the shiny side up and the dirty side down.
    Better put a plastic St Danny Drinan on the dashboard of yer car



    Even road race motorcycles now have this "driver assist" on board and without it ..........
    Without it, you'd have Kenny with the front wheel in the air, the back sliding sideways, steering with his feet while banging off shifts and going around people on the outside. Or Cal going way too hot into the turn, then jamming the front wheel sideways to scrub off speed. Or Gene running a TZ screaming into a tight 180 way too fast, slamming on the front, letting his body fall forward to give traction to the front and let the rear come around 180* in a heartbeat, sit back to plant the rear then back on the gas hard coming out.

    Yeah. Not a fast parade, racing. Skill, talent, all that stuff

    Most performance and high dollar cars sold will go to people with money but with no driving skills.
    Around here, the Ferraris and Maseratis and Aston-Martins usually go to the hot 23 year old girlfriend. Usually they drive pretty sedate. When the thinks-he's-hot son gets one, it crashes and burns and kills all onboard. Kinda like that dickwad that crashed the Porsche in the US and blamed the car. (His remaindered wife did, anyhow)

    Not sure which one of the above I'd rather roll at bigger speed. I'm actually thinking the truck.
    Car is okay, even a light one. Just make sure it has a cage, form-fitting seat, nomex suit, helmet, four-point harness, and strap in tight. You can do aerial acrobatics that way and come out of it just dizzy.



    Real cars don't have a tranny or a clutch or a diff, much less ABS

    Joe Gibbs recalls NASCAR contract negotiations with Tony Stewart

    He'da fit right in in the olde dayes


    how about this instead of electric ?

    It Only Hurts When You Land

    They are environmentally correct, they burn alcohol

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  17. #332
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    I dunno, when you say things like' these drivers today' you kind of imply that drivers didn't used to suck. Well, they have always been bozos, always.

    'These kids today' drive poorly for different reasons than those of yesteryear, but they are no worse.

    Complaining that technology allows this is foolishness.

    For instance, the average stopping distance from 70mph is a good 50 feet lower than it was 30 years ago.

    Is this somehow a bad thing?

    manual vs auto?

    in 1970 something like 10 percent of the cars sold had a standard. And which 10 percent? muscle cars, sports cars and Beetles. They didn't get popular again until 1973. Still maybe 20 percent of cars sold. They didn't even require knowledge of it in the late 70s to get a license.

    The good ol days weren't so good.

    And a Tesla can out accelerate[out handle out stop] your big block 68 Vette

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  19. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post
    And a Tesla can out accelerate[out handle out stop] your big block 68 Vette
    Maybe we can coax Bottlebob out of retirement to find out

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    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post

    And a Tesla can out accelerate[out handle out stop] your big block 68 Vette
    Well that's a fair comparison (NOT)!

    A 2019 Tesla against a 1968 Corvette.

    How about comparing it with a 755 horsepower 2019 ZR1 Corvette?
    0-60 in 2.85 Seconds, 100 mph in Six Seconds Flat

    2019 Corvette ZR1 Does 0-60 in 2.85 Seconds, Hits 100 in Six Seconds Flat

    Even the base $60,000 Stingray model does 0-60 mph in only 3.8 seconds with the manual transmission, somewhat faster with the 8-speed automatic. While it's true that the Tesla Model S P100D has outperformed several powerful gas fueled cars in straight line drag tests it should be remembered that the Model S P100D is a $136,000 car.

    Hennessy Performance will soon be releasing the HPE1200 Supercharged engine upgrade for the new ZR1 Corvette. This engine produces 1,200 HP and 1,066 lb-ft of torque and promises 0-60 mph in 2.2 seconds, a 9.2-second quarter-mile time, and a top speed of more than 230 mph.

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  22. #335
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    Luddite scott, at it again, oh the good ole days, bullshit! You sound like a parrot 🦜.
    Peace& love at ya scoot.
    Gw

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    Well that's a fair comparison (NOT)!

    A 2019 Tesla against a 1968 Corvette.

    How about comparing it with a 755 horsepower 2019 ZR1 Corvette?
    0-60 in 2.85 Seconds, 100 mph in Six Seconds Flat

    2019 Corvette ZR1 Does 0-60 in 2.85 Seconds, Hits 100 in Six Seconds Flat

    Even the base $60,000 Stingray model does 0-60 mph in only 3.8 seconds with the manual transmission, somewhat faster with the 8-speed automatic. While it's true that the Tesla Model S P100D has outperformed several powerful gas fueled cars in straight line drag tests it should be remembered that the Model S P100D is a $136,000 car.

    Hennessy Performance will soon be releasing the HPE1200 Supercharged engine upgrade for the new ZR1 Corvette. This engine produces 1,200 HP and 1,066 lb-ft of torque and promises 0-60 mph in 2.2 seconds, a 9.2-second quarter-mile time, and a top speed of more than 230 mph.
    Yabutt !

    I don't want to doo any of those things.

    I want to commute to work each day, reliably, safely, economically.

    Lather, rinse repeat.

  24. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg White View Post
    Luddite scott, at it again, oh the good ole days, bullshit! You sound like a parrot ��.
    Peace& love at ya scoot.
    Gw
    How in hell do you read "good old days" out of comparing 2019 Corvette vs 2019 Tesla?

    Tesla has made some impressive technology but the race they are certain to lose is "gassing up" after lengthy periods of full throttle acceleration. The Corvette or any other high power gasoline-fueled vehicle would be underway again in a few minutes with a full "charge". Let me know when a Tesla wins the Cannonball Run.

    And this "luddite" probably knows a lot more about technology than a "libbite" like yourself after a lifetime working with it.

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  26. #338
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    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    Yabutt !

    I don't want to doo any of those things.

    I want to commute to work each day, reliably, safely, economically.

    Lather, rinse repeat.
    And you can do so in either a common IC vehicle or an EV, depending on which best fits your circumstances.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    Well that's a fair comparison (NOT)!

    A 2019 Tesla against a 1968 Corvette.

    How about comparing it with a 755 horsepower 2019 ZR1 Corvette?
    0-60 in 2.85 Seconds, 100 mph in Six Seconds Flat

    2019 Corvette ZR1 Does 0-60 in 2.85 Seconds, Hits 100 in Six Seconds Flat

    Even the base $60,000 Stingray model does 0-60 mph in only 3.8 seconds with the manual transmission, somewhat faster with the 8-speed automatic. While it's true that the Tesla Model S P100D has outperformed several powerful gas fueled cars in straight line drag tests it should be remembered that the Model S P100D is a $136,000 car.

    Hennessy Performance will soon be releasing the HPE1200 Supercharged engine upgrade for the new ZR1 Corvette. This engine produces 1,200 HP and 1,066 lb-ft of torque and promises 0-60 mph in 2.2 seconds, a 9.2-second quarter-mile time, and a top speed of more than 230 mph.
    Scott, the comparison is good ol days as viewed through rose colored glasses

    Oh, and....
    In a recent Motor Trend test, the Model S P100D hit 0-60 mph in 2.275507139 seconds using a new Easter egg mode called Ludicrous+

    just wait till plaid mode hits

    and its a sedan.....

    let's wait till the new Tesla Roadster hits and see how Hennessey stacks up then

  28. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post
    Scott, the comparison is good ol days as viewed through rose colored glasses

    Oh, and....
    In a recent Motor Trend test, the Model S P100D hit 0-60 mph in 2.275507139 seconds using a new Easter egg mode called Ludicrous+

    just wait till plaid mode hits

    and its a sedan.....

    let's wait till the new Tesla Roadster hits and see how Hennessey stacks up then
    Neither of these is exactly cheap but again, which fits your lifestyle better, IC or EV? I'm sticking with IC for now and foreseeable near future but with quicker charging and gas station-like charging facilities I might consider a BEV.

    And good old days weren't as bad as some would claim but I wouldn't trade a 2000 and up vehicle for an older era. I don't miss long warmups, long stopping distance and all the other drawbacks to simplicity. I don't plan to return to oil lamps either although I have some for emergencies.

    And where can you use all that power today without either an expensive ticket or even loss of license?


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