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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by lionelt View Post
    I considered buying a V-Rod, then borrowed a Ultra Classic from local Harley dealer, project Rushmore model I think?

    It just didn't feel right for me, ended up with a Triumph Rocket 3 Classic.

    But talking to a few Harley owners some of the older ones were not keen on the water-cooled models.

    My son had a Road King with an EVO motor and he always said that was the best motor, but I am not that familiar with HD.

    Here in the UK Triumph Motorcycle seem to be doing well.
    The Triumph story is an amazing one. They are indeed doing well after a hiatus. They have good management and good design.

    Obviously, there is a world of difference between a Harley Touring bike and a sport bike like a Triumph or any of the Big four Japanese and others. The main difference is riding position and the floorboards, plus a lot more weight.

    There really are two different worlds and the big touring bikes occupy one side with the sport units on the other. Like someone said "On bikes, there's an ass for every seat."

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by lionelt View Post
    ...But talking to a few Harley owners some of the older ones were not keen on the water-cooled models.
    Same way with 911 fans. Some of them are okay with a water cooled 911, others think they are an abomination.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newman109 View Post
    The Triumph story is an amazing one. They are indeed doing well after a hiatus. They have good management and good design.

    Obviously, there is a world of difference between a Harley Touring bike and a sport bike like a Triumph or any of the Big four Japanese and others. The main difference is riding position and the floorboards, plus a lot more weight.



    There really are two different worlds and the big touring bikes occupy one side with the sport units on the other. Like someone said "On bikes, there's an ass for every seat."
    The Rocket is unique, I had a couple of Sunbeams and a couple of Rockets.

    It took a long time for the British motorcycle manufacturing to get back on its feet with Triumph and Norton.

    With Triumph being out of production for a while that made it easier for Bloor to buy the company and introduce all new models.

    From what I have been told rightly or wrongly, Harley owners have been resistant to change?

    Hence the V rod and Buelli not being great selling models? Willing to stand corrected if I am wrong here.



    rocket3.jpg mysunbeam.jpg

  4. #64
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    While I was working for a Japanese car manufacturer, we had hired in a new engineer that interned with HD in WI and would tell us the stories how things got fixed.

    Leaking pipe?

    In the Japanese plant, anyone can grab a wrench to tighten the pipe and stop the leak.

    In HD (union, of course). Need to put in a work order to have the pipefitter deal with it. Anyone else caught fixing the leak can be reported. Week passes, pipefitter finally shows up to fix the problem.

    I've heard this similar issue from another friend that co-op'ed with HD in the KC plant over a decade ago.

    Doesn't seem very efficient.

    Doubt this attributed to the KC plant shutting down but doesn't help operations when a simple 30 second fix takes a week.

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    That ain’t nothin, did you hear aboot the welfare lady that had 4 gold Cadillac s?
    Ge

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  7. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by rbmgf7 View Post
    While I was working for a Japanese car manufacturer, we had hired in a new engineer that interned with HD in WI and would tell us the stories how things got fixed.

    Leaking pipe?

    In the Japanese plant, anyone can grab a wrench to tighten the pipe and stop the leak.

    In HD (union, of course). Need to put in a work order to have the pipefitter deal with it. Anyone else caught fixing the leak can be reported. Week passes, pipefitter finally shows up to fix the problem.

    I've heard this similar issue from another friend that co-op'ed with HD in the KC plant over a decade ago.

    Doesn't seem very efficient.

    Doubt this attributed to the KC plant shutting down but doesn't help operations when a simple 30 second fix takes a week.
    So anyone does every job ?

    When the coffee maker in the office quits, you want the secretary playing with the 13.38 kv line out front ?

    Tighten that pipe too much, it breaks (because it really needed re-sealed), plant goes dark.

    Yup "anyone can doo your job".

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    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    So anyone does every job ?

    When the coffee maker in the office quits, you want the secretary playing with the 13.38 kv line out front ?

    Tighten that pipe too much, it breaks (because it really needed re-sealed), plant goes dark.

    Yup "anyone can doo your job".

    So that fix must be so complicated, remind what 2-4yr degree is required to fix that again? When the little floaty in your toilet gets caught, you must call a plumber right? Far to complicated, so many moving parts!

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    Harley got big on the rising tide....now they can get small again as the tide goes out........nothing wrong with that..............I remember some years ago Cat nearly went bust......financial markets attributed Cats near miss to their failure to move away from the tristate area to the sunbelt zero union areas.....Now Cat have multiple factories in China .Anyone can fix the pipes there .

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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    Now Cat have multiple factories in China .Anyone can fix the pipes there .
    No way, Jose. Not a chance in hell a plant manager would let "anyone" fix the pipes in China. The results would be too awful to contemplate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmanuelGoldstein View Post
    No way, Jose. Not a chance in hell a plant manager would let "anyone" fix the pipes in China. The results would be too awful to contemplate.
    Angle grinder to get them apart, welder to put them back together. What could possibly go wrong????

    PDW

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    A handyman. A guy that knows a lot about many things.

    A specialist. A guy that knows a lot about little.

    An expert. A guy that know everything about nothing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PDW View Post
    Angle grinder to get them apart, welder to put them back together. What could possibly go wrong????

    PDW
    Depends if it is a gas line or a water/coolant line and if the line is actually turned off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy2 View Post
    Depends if it is a gas line or a water/coolant line and if the line is actually turned off.
    Details shmetails, let's get this done !

    The other thing they NEVER do in China is check their work. Plumber replaces a toilet and immediately leaves. (With the old carcass parked in the middle of the kitchen.) First flush floods the bathroom but hey now ! He's long gone ! Maybe can come back next week !

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    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    So anyone does every job ?

    When the coffee maker in the office quits, you want the secretary playing with the 13.38 kv line out front ?

    Tighten that pipe too much, it breaks (because it really needed re-sealed), plant goes dark.

    Yup "anyone can doo your job".
    I wasn't expecting someone to take that post so literal that they forgo common sense. Yes anyone as anyone on the floor, i.e. maintenance, engineering, production, facilities, or even an outgoing operator. A pipe leak is a pretty simple problem with a pretty simple solution. We're not troubleshooting high voltage lines. If a company can't efficiently fix a simple problem, well, it's already obvious.

    The ideology in anyone taking the effort to fix small problems is obviously working together to preserve OUR jobs instead of getting a specific person to fix a problem so they can preserve THEIR job.

    I have nothing against HD or labor unions. I've heard good things come from unions. There's a time and place for everything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg White View Post
    That ain’t nothin, did you hear aboot the welfare lady that had 4 gold Cadillac s?
    Ge
    Or, that big dude who was buying all those steaks with his food stamps. Darn I miss
    that asshole reagan. He must have had alzheimers a LONG time.

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    The market for your product shrinks while at the same time manufacturing efficiencies grow and at some point you no longer need the capacity, number of workers, and plants that you once had.
    It's pretty much as simple as that.
    Bob

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    Quote Originally Posted by rbmgf7 View Post
    I wasn't expecting someone to take that post so literal that they forgo common sense. Yes anyone as anyone on the floor, i.e. maintenance, engineering, production, facilities, or even an outgoing operator. A pipe leak is a pretty simple problem with a pretty simple solution. We're not troubleshooting high voltage lines. If a company can't efficiently fix a simple problem, well, it's already obvious.

    The ideology in anyone taking the effort to fix small problems is obviously working together to preserve OUR jobs instead of getting a specific person to fix a problem so they can preserve THEIR job.

    I have nothing against HD or labor unions. I've heard good things come from unions. There's a time and place for everything.
    A couple of days ago a machinist repaired the power cord on a grinder that I was going to do but did some other things first. I jokingly threatened to file a grievance. He related the time in a large airplane manufacturer that a handle on a lathe handwheel came loose. Any machinist can tighten a screw but they had to wait for a maintenance man because that was outside machinist's job description. The result was that the lathe sat idle for an entire shift.

    I have been a union member, a department head, and a business owner, so I have been on different sides. People just have to use some sense. We built one machine next to my desk in the engineering office because we were worried about sabotage. One of the workers came in to see me about something and saw the machine optically inspecting parts that were being done visually. He said "I think I'm going to be missing a few of my buddies." The reality was that I eliminated a dismal, boring job, production increased dramatically because of that and other improvements, and the additional revenue opened up new opportunities for the displaced workers. Nobody lost a job because of my automation.

    Bill

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  25. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by rbmgf7 View Post
    I wasn't expecting someone to take that post so literal that they forgo common sense. Yes anyone as anyone on the floor, i.e. maintenance, engineering, production, facilities, or even an outgoing operator. A pipe leak is a pretty simple problem with a pretty simple solution. We're not troubleshooting high voltage lines. If a company can't efficiently fix a simple problem, well, it's already obvious.

    The ideology in anyone taking the effort to fix small problems is obviously working together to preserve OUR jobs instead of getting a specific person to fix a problem so they can preserve THEIR job.

    I have nothing against HD or labor unions. I've heard good things come from unions. There's a time and place for everything.
    Your just changing your tune.

    "Variable integrity" is the disease from which you suffer.

    Also, plumbing and pipefitting doesn't deserve your respect ?
    As well any trades YOU are not a member of.....Hence the quote.
    Only your job deserves respect eh ?

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    Ive worked on projects with chinese contractors.....electricians ,refrigeration mechanics,pipefitters ,formworkers , concretors and machine operators had all picked up their trade simply as laborers working on jobsites....anyone left the site was easily replaced....I dont think you even need a drivers licence in China,certainly not a special licence for a truck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy2 View Post
    Depends if it is a gas line or a water/coolant line and if the line is actually turned off.
    I see that the sarcasm inherent in the phrase 'What could possibly go wrong?' passed over your head....

    PDW


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