Military has to buy from foreign nations

Could the USA fight another war like World War II? I don't think so because the parts and materials needed would have to be bought from the very enemies the USA would be fighting. I seriously doubt that the USA could even make enough combat boots for the infantry.

The industrial base and manufacturing for the U.S. military were necessarily intertwined. But following the end of the Cold War there has been a deliberate decomposition of U.S. industry, unprecedented in American history. There are a number of factors which have contributed to U.S. dependence on foreign trade, primarily with India and China, which has not only led to millions of U.S. manufacturing and engineering jobs permanently lost, but paints a grim picture for the long term stability of the U.S. military supply line.

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This quote is from an article in The Sierra Times

In WWII, the Allies bombed German ball bearing factories: The ball-bearing attack USAAF What is the difference between bombing a factory, and closing it up due to outsourcing? Bombed factories can be rebuilt. The people who built it and ran it are still there. But when you close the factory, the machinery gets sent away or sold, and the people leave or go with the factory. So closing a factory is more final that having it bombed.

In other news:
Eurocopter wins three billion $ contract to built helicopters for US Army.

In other news:
Eurocopter wins three billion $ contract to built helicopters for US Army.

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Which is good news if you work in US aerospace manufacturing:

The award of the contract will entail the creation of 200 jobs at Eurocopter’s Columbus facility in Mississippi, which is to undergo a major expansion to accommodate the program. Production of the UH-145 will gradually be transferred to Columbus, starting with partial assembly, followed by full assembly and subsequent U.S. manufacture of major subsystems.

Boris

"although flying a military helicopter with a french engine sounds very dodgey to me , one sign of trouble and the engine surrenders

One speed forward...three in reverse...

Just out of curiosity, all those lap tops, and computers that the military buys as COTS (Commercially available Off The Shelf) are any of them made here? Or any of the battle critical electronics for that matter?

Adam

Wonder if there are any hardware "back doors" into our government's computers, placed there by folks who want more information than the NYT or WSJ prints? Charles

How is anyone going to put a hardware back door into a computer made with an Intel or AMD or IBM chip that is made in the USA?

Most if not all the other chips in a PC or a Mac are standard chips sold world wide on the open market.

The only way to get a hardware back door is through an Application Specific Integrated Circuit. (ASIC) or a Field Programmable Gate Array (FPGA)

If those devices are used in sensitive applications then the structure and programing are under strict supervision. No average hacker is going to get even close to them.

hate to tell you, but more and more of those chips are made outside the US.

I'm not saying this is mission-critical, but I was contacted awhile back by an army purchasing agent who wanted to buy "silverware" for military mess halls...he was surprised that all were made in China. I was unable to find any American-made for him to buy.

Maybe none of us will go to war with each other because we have too many economic entanglements?! (Looking for a silver lining here...)

It's known fact that manufacturing ability was a key factor in allowing the Union to win the Civil War, and the US to win WWII. It's a good thing we have the likes of Al Gore and Hillary Clinton to defend our country, 'cause we sure won't be able to do it with any of the old methods.

Now then, are there any of you STILL buying Chinese goods????

And exactly how are you laying this on Hillary Clinton???!!!! (I know I'll be sorry I asked.)

And exactly how could I read your post without posting a Billary link????

http://orlingrabbe.com/lafarge.htm

We will never fight another war like World War 2.
So we dont need 2 million 5 ton trucks.
Or 100,000 propellor driven fighter planes.

We still manage to export more weapons than any other country.
And we are far from a war footing.
I cant imagine that we couldnt mobilize to build a whole lot more if we have to- right now, only one plant builds most individual types of military hardware- one Humvee factory, one Stryker plant, and so on. And most only work one shift.

I know of a hundred shops in my area that all could easily convert to building weapons, and are tooled up with better, more sophisticated equipment than huge factories had in WW2.
I could be turning out mortar tubes and airplane parts in my shop with about two weeks lead time, and could easily fit another 10 guys in.

With CNC equipment, the capacity of american manufacturing is amazing- there are huge fab and sheet metal and machine shops all over that are running one shift, making semi-useless stuff like hot tub heaters and fancy exhaust systems for "fast and furious" hot rod japanese cars.

If we really NEEDED to, we could make everything we needed right quicklike.

And besides, we already spend more on weapons than everybody else put together- where exactly is this great threat gonna come from?

The only plausible scenario I can think of where we might really be in trouble is Alien Invasion- ever read " Gust Front " by John Ringo?
If them Posleen come, then we might be in trouble.

I think the world is a "little bit pregnant" with WWIII right now.

Richard

"three billion dollars" Hell I used up three billion dollars worth of ball peen hammers during my 9 years in the Air Force.

Just kidding it was only 2.75 billion

Reis:

Your post is accurate. Who is going to get in a real shooting war with the country that already has the mostest and the bestest weapons?

You seem to have read "Superpower".

Our biggest problem is keeping lesser countries from getting into real shooting wars with each other, even if the USA has to do a bit of shooting in order to make it clear that our intent is serious.

Our next biggest problem is learning how to be the sole super power nation.

The shift from balance of power with the Soviet Union to the status of sole super power has happened only recently. All too many in government and the military haven't come to grips with the size and shape of the situation yet.

We screwed up the Iraqi campaign. The general wisdom now is that it was the wrong war at the wrong time.

I don't think that all is lost. The USA must get that mess straightened out, we will.

The best than anyone can hope for is the minimum of future screw ups and the quickest advances along the new learning curve.

Let us not be guilty of the most common sin of generals and admirals. Let's not plan to fight the last war.

The U.S. branches of the military may have the most and the best, but the I do not think the american public has the stomach for a fight. Any of you that doubt this should look at how soon we have forgotten september 11!

During the cold war the U.S. military had said they had the capablity to fight on two fronts. They can barely maintain one occupied country now!

Were fuel prices frozen during WWII?

We have not forgotten 9-11.

We knocked the stuffings out of the Taliban and Al Qada.

We have drawn down the resources of terrorist organizations world wide.

According to James Fallows of "The Atlantic Monthly" the USA has already won it's 'war on terror'. His article in the curent issue is well worth reading.

Let's not confuse the camapign in Iraq with our fight against terrorists who are bent on attacking the USA on it's home ground.

"Were fuel prices frozen during WWII?" is that a rhetorical question?

Gasoline was rationed as was a long list of everyday items from rubber to butter.

"Is this trip really necessary" was a commonly seen poster reminding the public to think twice before jumping in the car and taking off.

If we really had a world war, nobody would have a choice of whether they had the stomach for it or not- there would be a mandatory draft- in WW2 it was everybody up to 45.
There would be mandatory rationing of all kinds of stuff, jail sentances for black market trafficing of rationed goods, and there would be a War Production Board that would tell each company what they could and couldnt make, and exactly what tools and materials they were allowed to buy to make it, and how much they were allowed to charge for it.
All this, and more, happened during world war 2.

My point is that we are nowhere near needing that, nor is there any foreseeable war in the near future that would require it.
Boeing could double their cruise missile production without breaking a sweat- probably only need to hire a couple of hundred new guys.

We are never going to fight a war like world war 2 again, and we just dont need to worry about the chinese invading- how would they get here- swim across the Bering Straight?

Nope, they would set out in a couple of hundred ships, and they might make it out of sight of land before our existing submarines and aircraft carriers would sink em all.
No need for foreign ball bearings, or chinese made tupperware.
We are able to sink any navy on earth in about 2 days, right now.

Plus, the Chinese are way too smart to ever try that- the last time they attacked someone who wasnt their immediate land neighbor was when they attempted to invade Japan- in 1293.
And that was only because the Mongols had invaded China, and were running the place.

There is no country on earth that we would need to fight a land war with on the scale of world war 2. We have much more than the manufacturing capacity we would need to fight any war, or combination of wars, forseeable.
And if we really needed a 2 million man army, or a 5 million man army, we could just raise the pay scale, and we would have it. $50,000 a year for privates, and we would be at full strength in a year.

I looked into America's situation before every war. In the civil war (war of northern agression), both sides had almost no supplies. The north had a critical shortage of food and gunpowder. Both sides had no shoes and virtually every item needed was 'foraged' by the north and south.

The Spanish-American was found us again with almost nothing. We had no rifles. Trapdoor Springfields using 45-70-500 black powder was no match against turn bolt Mausers. Supplies were again 'foraged' and we found ourselves almost getting the stuffing knocked out of us because of poor equipment and scant supplies.

I have a book on the first world war, called Munitions Manufacture (Philadelphia District), and it paints a scene of no pencils, shoes, rifles, chemicals, tools, and anything else we needed. This book was written in 1921 and it is a basic treatise of military shortcomings. This book was a brag piece to say how we pulled miracles from our butts.

The second world war was a disaster. We started to ramp up four years before we got around to shooting. Our materials were short and what we made was generally shoddy. There were a few magnificent exceptions, but the guys that went ashore at Normandy had shoes made by sadistic morons. The next year most guys were still wearing those same boots with the toes sticking out.

The list goes on and on. America always burns all of the people that can make war material. We destroyed our transportation sector for every war and always murder any useful industry in peacetime. Why should we change now. I hear all our guidance magnets are made in China and all PC chips are now made in Singapore for the defense department. Did Beretta ever make one 9mm pistol here, or did we just pencil whip that requirement?

Don't worry. We can do what we always do. We will just throw boys at the enemy, until someone gets their act together. It worked in the past.

Charlie is so very right. I also recommend anyone to read "The Valor of Ignorance" for its insightful value.

Richard

"We will just throw boys at the enemy, until someone gets their act together".

That is the nature of war. It has never ever been any different.

Both sides do it, the ones who don't die win.