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  1. #1081
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcgyver View Post
    sigh. what do you think socialism is?

    The United States is not considered a socialist state. A link; Is America a socialist or capitalist country? - Quora

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    Quote Originally Posted by crazygoat View Post
    Yet when other members voice their opinion he tells them they are insulting( presumably to him). Even you must admit that Spinit has been heavy handed at times by banning people who don't agree with his views and deleting posts from the same. In that respect he has seemed to cool it from that here lately.
    You are insulting.

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    Types of governments: Are we moving from republic to oligarchy, maybe were already there. This short vid explains the different types of gov (even mentions socialism) in easy to understand language.
    YouTube

  4. #1084
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinit View Post
    The United States is not considered a socialist state. A link; Is America a socialist or capitalist country? - Quora
    I feel like a broken record. Socialism is what Russia was, a lot of China still is, Cuba almost all still is etc - think Mao and Lenin. What you think of as communism is a socialist state, communism is more about the political model, socialism describing the economic one. Perhaps you are confusing socialism with a social democracy, i.e. high tax high spend countries. There are elements of socialism is every country, i.e. roads or health care for many, but you label an economy by its predominate economic model. Pretty much every country you can think of, including Denmark, is a market based capitalist economy.

    Its important to get this right. Astoundingly there's ignorant masses out there wishing for the bloody thing (socialism) obvious to the fact that it produces the most tyrannical and economic failures in modern history.

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    that should be in the stickies Mac....heck, even I used to confuse them.

    i do not want socialism, however I do want a more efficient and transparent capitalism based system that encourages manufacturing and business in general.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinit View Post
    You are insulting.
    I give up! The last sentence of my post was a compliment to you. Yet you find that insulting?!

  9. #1087
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcgyver View Post
    I feel like a broken record. Socialism is what Russia was, a lot of China still is, Cuba almost all still is etc - think Mao and Lenin. What you think of as communism is a socialist state, communism is more about the political model, socialism describing the economic one. Perhaps you are confusing socialism with a social democracy, i.e. high tax high spend countries. There are elements of socialism is every country, i.e. roads or health care for many, but you label an economy by its predominate economic model. Pretty much every country you can think of, including Denmark, which is a market based capitalist economy.

    Its important to get this right. Astoundingly there's ignorant masses out there wishing for the bloody thing (socialism) obvious to the fact that it produces the most tyrannical and economic failures in modern history.
    Social Democracy.

  10. #1088
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinit View Post
    Social Democracy.
    AKA "mob rule by the looters."

    Call it what it is, same as you would use a micrometer.

    Or suffer a 100% scrap rate in due course. Proven history, Big Bang onward. Either one.

    The only place left to argue is over which of the alternatives as actually WORK have what degree of merit. Or not.

    That simple.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinit View Post
    Social Democracy.
    The main countries that have embraced social democracy are the Nordic countries. The United Nations published in 2018 a global report ranking the happiest countries in the world. The top five, in order, were (1) Finland, (2) Norway, (3) Denmark, (4) Iceland and (5) Switzerland.May 22, 2017

    What countries have social democracy? - Quora

    Social democracy - Wikipedia

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    Social Democracy.

    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    AKA "mob rule by the looters."
    Who "rules" the USA?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcgyver View Post
    sigh. what do you think socialism is?
    He doesn't think much and reads even less so asking him to provide a definition of socialism is like asking one of the Religious Right (caps intended) to provide a definition of pornography.

    "I'll know it when I see it".

    OBTW limited liability companies are a Govt artifice - hope he doesn't have one or is employed by one. Socialist you know....

    PDW

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderjet View Post
    As the moderator, he has every right to define his own role. . . .

    Flame on.
    Which is why the part you didn't quote said "My suggestion is that, as moderator, you might lighten up on calling members culprits and vaguely anti-American . . ."

    We have a choice, at every level from our hater-in-Chief to everyday communication, whether we want to focus on respecting or demeaning other points of view. I'm pointing out that this forum is devolving to narrow minded insults, even when they’re barely if at all merited.

    Yeah, we have a First Amendment right to be obnoxious, short of yelling "fire" in crowded theaters and all that. Whether or not individuals, and especially those who aspire to be moderators, want to exercise that right tells what kind of society we want to become.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinit View Post
    Social Democracy.
    Where in the dec of independence or any of the other documents is "democracy" mentioned?
    Please watch the vid in post #1094 for clarity

  16. #1094
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDW View Post
    OBTW limited liability companies are a Govt artifice - hope he doesn't have one or is employed by one. Socialist you know....

    PDW
    No, they are not. The liability is the same as it would be for a "real", not artificial person.

    The limitation is only on the pass-through of liability to the stakeholders, individually,

    Even that goes away if/as/when the artificial person AKA "body corporate" breaks the law. Commits an ultra vires act. At that point, the "corporate veil" is meant to be pierced, the corporation is stripped of it's artificial "body", same as if a live person were to be executed (to death, even!) since it is HARD (and costly..) to JAIL an artificial body.

    Which "jail' does exist. Operating under appointed receivers or other custodians. North American Philips (NORELCO) during the time, War Two, when Weird-Adolph's Germany held the parent firm in the Nederlands hostage is an example of a firm which had not done wrong, but needed to be protected from risk of being forced to do, going forward.

    Veil pierced, body corporate dissolved, the Executives and Directors for-sure, stockholders only maybe - who committed the illegal act(s) - or condoned such - become personally liable.

    So what is it that is wrong with this picture that it almost never actually WORKS that way?


    Simple enough. Governments and their regulators substitute their OWN greed for justice for their society.

    They'd rather FINE a truant bank or major industrial player and leave it INTACT and operational so they can keep-on fining it off the back of its next round of criminal behaviour going forward. Which they have thereby assured will take place.

    They almost NEVER put it down ONCE and jail the executives. Unless it is too small to "farm". Same as slaughtering lambs or calves for veal whilst keeping mama alive for milk or wool. No fear. Eventually, she, too will e eaten. If gone to gristle with age? Ground for pet food, then.

    So long as Governments choose to farm, then shear or milk the bad-actors, eat them down to hide and bone only a hundred and more years deferred? There will not be any shortage of offenders, repeat or new.

    That is not the failing of the concept of corporate structure. SOMEBODY always did and still does know the names among any "SA" - Society of the nameless.

    It is a failing of swift, fair, and impartial justice, enforcement side.

    Government corruption masquerading as crusading virtue when it is in fact the exact opposite.

    The only thing "social" about that is the revolving door of intellectual incest as regulatory and corporate counsel players periodically switch their VISIBLE roles.

    Devil will never take them off their field of play. Outmatched. They scare the living shit out of 'im.

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    For those of you that have been concerned with this subject;


    It is most likely that a trade deal won't be made. Deal with it, and quit complaining about it.

    Personally, I would prefer no trade deal, and it looks like Trump wants this as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by otrlt View Post
    It is most likely that a trade deal won't be made. Deal with it, and quit complaining about it.
    Same thing has been coming out of chopstick-land. Too much of it was low-margin, low-value-add, slim profits even if not also subsidized. Xi gets bigger tough-guy points by preventing than agreeing. The seekers of illicit info no longer have to even pretend to "play nice".

    .. no trade deal, and it looks like Trump wants this as well.
    Not so. He's enough of a "praise me" whore he'd LOVE a trade deal.

    Also enough of a pragmatist, damned-fool tweets or no, to realize he dare not fold on the IP transfer and pervasive implanted spying system vulnerability.

    BFD.

    I doubt factories once in China will come back to the USA. So far, they had already begun to re-locate to even lower-cost labour marts than China had grow up out of. All this has done is to speed that process up.

    Fewer new ones may LEAVE, OTOH, worried that China is but one of many where unexpected tariffs could hit.

    China's major concern wasn't high-tech. They CAN do as much of that as they actually NEED any time they care to spend the money rather than copy it cheaply or even "for free".

    It was secure foodstuffs even more than secure access to energy. They have that well covered, now. LATAM to Ukraine, etc.

    Both sides will survive just fine, may in the fullness of time learn to warily respect each other, "love" or never.

    China's governmental style will be hitting walls of its own making, not all of them economic, may start morphing into "something" different fairly soon.

    By Chinese standards for "soon", anyway.

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    I do not understand anything that you just posted

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    Quote Originally Posted by otrlt View Post
    I do not understand anything that you just posted
    Well... It wasn't in the contract specifications that you had to do, was it?

    So I just won't bill you for it.

    Fair enough?


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  22. #1099
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    No, they are not. The liability is the same as it would be for a "real", not artificial person.

    The limitation is only on the pass-through of liability to the stakeholders, individually
    A distinction without a difference.

    Before the GOVERNMENT passed laws limiting liability to subscribed capital (exceptions as you note) ALL companies were unlimited liability. See Elizabethan times for many, many examples of corporate bankruptcy flowing through to all the individual shareholders.

    So them GOVERNMENT LAWS that people like spinit decry as socialist - guess what - they shelter individuals from the consequences of going bankrupt (exceptions as noted). Socialism is great when it's used to keep hold of profits yet let the losses fall on others..... let's bring back unlimited liability for people like spinit, make him happy.

    Or perhaps he wouldn't like that idea, just the same as all the other hypocrites out there.

    PDW

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    Cease with the personal insults it does not generate any interest from me. Tariffs and trade are interesting.


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