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Thread: Recession?

  1. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcgyver View Post
    Its money squandered... except to extent one believes you need that many billions to keep invaders off your shores.
    It's even worse than that. If one believes the propaganda about "keep the sea lanes open" and "make the world safe for commerce", the US is paying for it while Germany, Japan, China, Korea, Vietnam and everywhere else are getting the benefits.

    Either it's a flat waste or even worse, it is paying for what should be a cost to competitors thereby making them more profitable and us poorer.

    We're stupid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmanuelGoldstein View Post
    Does anyone else remember Baghdad Bob ?
    Yeah, he kept telling everyone that nobody had a magic wand that could ever revive the US economy or bring manufacturing back.

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    I won't engage into the political BS that has been posted. What I will state; manufacturing in the US is doing quite well.

    As to the defence work that I noted, it is still a relatively small portion of what is happening. The vast majority of US manufacturing is non defence.

    For those that are defence contractors, I'm pleased that your doing well. Don't let these anti defence doves get you upset.

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    Quote Originally Posted by otrlt View Post
    Don't let these anti defence doves get you upset.
    Defence is of course important but just how much "defence" does any country need?

    Basically all that is needed are a few nuclear missiles and aggressors would know it's stupid to attack. US Defence certainly sounds better than what it really is. Now you'll regard that as "anti American" but if you're willing to pay the cost and use your huge military wisely then I have no problem with that. It's your money.

    OTOH think what just half of that could be used for and the USA would still have the most expensive military in the world.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmanuelGoldstein View Post

    Right, I forgfot about that. The 800 billion they spend every year just started. And it's a really intelligent way to piss away your resources, making shit that is 98% worthless.

    On this Remembrance Day, also don't forget which country sacrificed more soldiers than the UK and who spent more money than anyone to build the equipment required to make sure you're not all speaking German or Russian right now.

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    The only winners in any war are the boys that finance it, and they don't care too much who 'wins'.

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    For those that are defence contractors, I'm pleased that your doing well. Don't let these anti defence doves get you upset.
    Wouldn't dream of it.

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    technology change from internal combustion engines and pollution control devices on automobiles to electric vehicles using electronics rather than complex transmissions will have a Massive effect in next 10 years
    .
    this is similar to old film and chemicals photography changing to digital cameras in 99% of cellphones now. or complex production wide web film conveyance machines like printing presses using mechanical speed control gears and belts going to electronic speed control electric motor drives. or old vacuum televisions requiring frequent repair to solid state circuits in modern televisions lasting often over 20 years
    .
    technology change often catches up to industries who do not modernize. often theirs more profit in the old ways of manufacturing til consumer demands disappears. literally film photography is less than 2% of what it used to be 40 years ago. or like CNC machining being over 98% compared to manual machining.
    .
    all the big Auto manufacturers are planning big changes and most are converting to electric vehicles. effects in the economy will be massive cause automobile manufacturing effects almost everybody eventually.
    .
    literally in the next decade EACH year their will be millions of electric cars sold rather than internal combustion cars. 2 to 5% each year til like a decade later its 90 to 99% of cars sold are electric vehicles. thats means jobs effects or employment numbers. old photography companies they had yearly layoffs for decades as the business became less than 2% of what it used to be. as electric vehicles improve and prices comes down more will be sold just like digital cameras replaced film and chemical photography.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DMF_TomB View Post
    ... literally film photography is less than 2% of what it used to be 40 years ago..
    Ironic. Kodak invented the CCD camera, yet resisted selling any digital cameras because they would cut into their cash cow of
    traditional emulshion film.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jim rozen View Post
    Ironic. Kodak invented the CCD camera, yet resisted selling any digital cameras because they would cut into their cash cow of
    traditional emulshion film.
    .
    ironic Fuji doing much better than Kodak cause they invested in making many things becoming a bigger company not selling parts of the company.
    .
    Steve Jobs wasnt perfect much obviously Apple did much better with him than without him. Being able to predict future trends and having the ability to follow through with them rather than compromise to stock holders short term interest is difficult for any CEO. Tesla is another where Elon is being criticized every day but seems to be doing much better selling electric cars than anybody else.
    .
    but even Henry Ford had trouble changing with the times. he kept wanting to sell the Model T much longer than he should have
    .
    Auto industry and electric cars going to change the whole economy massively in the next decade

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    Quote Originally Posted by SND View Post
    On this Remembrance Day, also don't forget which country sacrificed more soldiers than the UK ...
    The Soviet Union ?

    p.s. "Remembrance Day" gag me with a fucking spoon. What a twit.

    Quote Originally Posted by jim rozen View Post
    Ironic. Kodak invented the CCD camera ...
    Can you get anything right ? No they did not.

    The CCD was invented at Bell Labs and made into cameras by JPL for the space program, in collaboration with Cal Tech in Pasadena. Fred Landauer and Jim Westphal. Fred was a good friend.

    http://calteches.library.caltech.edu/3648/1/Camera.pdf

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    First self-contained digital camera using CCDs was indeed done at Kodak:

    Steven Sasson - Wikipedia

    Granted they did not *invent* the CCD. But they were first out with the idea for a product. And as
    mentioned, deliberately did not move ahead with it, for fear of impinging on their film business.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jim rozen View Post
    Granted they did not *invent* the CCD.
    Exactly. What you said was wrong, as usual.

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    Just a data point- I called a truss shop today for some truss for a shop building.
    He is four-five weeks out on delivery.
    Said they are struggling to keep up with the incoming orders and are as busy as they have ever been.

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    You may be naive. Alot of shops even warn you now they are weeks out. The truth is not because they are overly busy, they are at the same rate of busy perhaps before recession, however they have NO F-ING WORKERS. They can't find blue collar help because the schools let everyone down and the factories are NOT raising wages. Almost EVERY money bobblehead talk guy on all the shows says this VERY thing. They are scratching their heads why companies are refusing to raise wages to get talent.

    In my opinion, it is because those of you that went through recessions and have been at this a long time...aren't fooled this time or taking risks. Hence why manufacturing sector is down and has been kinda down.

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    Generally regarded as the first digital camera by at least CNET: Photos: The history of the digital camera - CNET

    FWIW, decades ago I headed the board of judges for Management Roundtable's APEX (American Product EXcellence) Awards. Both Kodak and Polaroid submitted applications for pretty decent (for the time) consumer digital cameras. Actually designed, built, and sold around $1500. Technologically ahead of companies like Canon.

    And both development teams pretty much ran into a buzzsaw in companies (Kodak and Polaroid) dedicated to other technologies. This, long before Clayton Christensen and others talked about the innovators dilemma.

    It's only gotten worse with the "financialization" of so many of the largest US design and manufacturing companies. Why invent something and work your tail off to bring it to market when you can make so much money gaming the oil industry (Enron) or finance (pretty much the entire cast of characters in the 2008 great recession) or just stripping companies of assets and selling the carcasses (maybe half of private equity?). Similarly, entire industries now pretty much rely upon acquisitions rather than internal R&D for growth.

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    Naive.
    I have been in the work force longer than most commentators have been alive.
    The truss company I called is family owned and sent me the truss for my shop when I stood it up twenty years ago.
    I spoke with one of the sons in the business.
    He told me frankly what to expect from his company and why.
    I don’t and wouldn’t question his explanation.

    I advised someone recently to not trade ones politics in the markets.
    I’m not much interested in a opinion based on such views including my own.
    The mans busy in a truss shop in Maryland.
    I can’t say what it means about the future but right now he has work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EndlessWaltz View Post
    Hence why manufacturing sector is down and has been kinda down.
    Hello Endlessw,
    I'm sorry that your situation doesn't jive with the current trend. Manufacturing output is going to surprise many in the next year. Meanwhile, industrial production is humming along and will accelerate in 2020.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PeteM View Post
    Generally regarded as the first digital camera by at least CNET: Photos: The history of the digital camera - CNET

    FWIW, decades ago I headed the board of judges for Management Roundtable's APEX (American Product EXcellence) Awards. Both Kodak and Polaroid submitted applications for pretty decent (for the time) consumer digital cameras. Actually designed, built, and sold around $1500. Technologically ahead of companies like Canon.

    And both development teams pretty much ran into a buzzsaw in companies (Kodak and Polaroid) dedicated to other technologies. This, long before Clayton Christensen and others talked about the innovators dilemma.

    It's only gotten worse with the "financialization" of so many of the largest US design and manufacturing companies. Why invent something and work your tail off to bring it to market when you can make so much money gaming the oil industry (Enron) or finance (pretty much the entire cast of characters in the 2008 great recession) or just stripping companies of assets and selling the carcasses (maybe half of private equity?). Similarly, entire industries now pretty much rely upon acquisitions rather than internal R&D for growth.
    You forgot the weaponisation of patents, where you grab as many as you can regardless of their merit then sit on them producing no product, just so you can block competition.

    PDW

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