US Steel Cancels $1.5Billion Expansion Thanks To Bidenomics
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    Default US Steel Cancels $1.5Billion Expansion Thanks To Bidenomics

    Anyone see this story? Democrats Blamed After U.S. Steel Cancels $1.5B Project in Pennsylvania. You don't need to be a genius to foresee this happening when the USA jumps into the Paris accords that tax the crap out of US CO2 generation and allow China to emit at will would you expect anything different?

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    You blame them? I would run too...so much for 40/hr jobs...burger king here I come...Phil

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    Well, when you rely on Breitbart to pre-digest the news for you, I guess you'll accept anything they say.

    Or you could see that reality has a different view...

    Steel prices have tripled. Now Bank of America is sounding the alarm - CNN

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    If it from CNN its doggy dew, everyone knows that...Phil

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Montana View Post
    If it from CNN it doggy dew, everyone knows that...Phil
    Phil, phil, fill...

    You're Phil of it, if Dimbart is your main source of propaganda.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adammil1 View Post
    Sounds like a lotta whining. Interesting they did not mention the steel tarrifs.

    The moneymen are saying there is a big steel bubble and it is about to pop, causing a collapse in steel prices. It's all greek to me.

    US Steel stock is at $26 today.

    United States Steel Corporation (X : NYSE) Stock Price & News - Google Finance

    Nucor Corporation (NUE : NYSE) Stock Price & News - Google Finance

    Hot rolled coil on 4/29, $1500/ton

    US Midwest Domestic Hot-Rolled Coil Steel Futures Historical Prices - Investing.com


    Steel prices have tripled. Now Bank of America is sounding the alarm - CNN

    Some quotes:

    The pandemic brought the American steel industry to its knees last spring, forcing manufacturers to shut down production as they struggled to survive the imploding economy. But as the recovery got underway, mills were slow to resume production, and that created a massive steel shortage.

    Now, the reopening of the economy is driving a steel boom so strong that some are convinced it will end in tears.

    After bottoming out around $460 last year, US benchmark hot-rolled coil steel prices are now sitting at around $1,500 a ton, a record high that is nearly triple the 20-year average.

    Steel stocks are on fire. US Steel (X), which crashed to a record low last March amid bankruptcy fears, has skyrocketed 200% in just 12 months. Nucor (NUE) has spiked 76% this year alone.


    Phil Gibbs, director of metals equity research at KeyBanc Capital Markets, agreed that steel prices are at unsustainable levels.
    "This would be like $170-a-barrel oil. At some point, people will say, 'F this, I'm not going to drive, I will take the bus,'" Gibbs told CNN Business. "The correction will be very intense. It's just a matter of when and how it happens."

    Steel is just the latest shortage to hit the US economy as it recovers from a pandemic that scrambled supply chains and set off sharp shifts in demand.
    Everything from computer chips and lumber to chlorine and tanker truck drivers are in short supply. Manufacturers, restaurants and other businesses are also desperate for workers.

    Meanwhile, the International Energy Agency warned this week that there isn't enough copper, lithium and other raw earth minerals available to make global clean energy ambitions a reality. The world risks "running out of copper," Bank of America strategists said in a recent note to clients.

    The good news, for steel buyers at least, is that analysts say all of the US steel production capacity that was idled during the pandemic has returned.
    That's why Tanners said she's very confident the shortage will soon end, causing steel prices to collapse. History shows that steel stocks "tend to peak" a month or so before steel prices, Tanners wrote in her report.

    She said US Steel in particular is vulnerable to a commodity downturn because it has the most amount of debt and the greatest need to spend to upgrade its plants.

    If the Biden administration rolls back even just some of those tariffs, it would ease supply constraints and weigh on steel prices.

    Tanners thinks that is likely to happen in the next 12 months.
    "We are protecting an industry where there is scarcity and prices are almost triple historical averages," she said.

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    If you read the actual US Steel press release they talk about it being a changing world and that it is the carbon taxes and climate change regulations that play a big role in this decision. At the heart of Bidenomics lies the Paris accords which force the US to make major reductions in CO2 while allowing China to keep increasing theirs until 2040.

    While I am all for more wind and solar certain industries like steel making release tons of CO2. It is not too hard to figure out that to hit those ambitious reductions in CO2 lots of big facilities like this will likely need to move to China all as a part of Biden's "America Last" policies. Sad irony here is what candidate did the steel workers union endorse?

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    By the way here's the official press release. Status - www.ussteel.com. Its all about the carbon emissions. I just linked to the Breitbart article as sometimes you head in the sand liberals need to enjoy reading a different perspective you get from the Communist News Network.

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    You guys really enjoy buying into the Big Lie, don't you? Were you at the Capitol on 1/6/21?

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    Quote Originally Posted by adammil1 View Post
    By the way here's the official press release. Status - www.ussteel.com. I just linked to the Breitbart article as sometimes you head in the sand liberals need to enjoy reading a different perspective you get from the Communist News Network.

    Sent from my SM-J737V using Tapatalk
    Did you read the same press release I did?

    Do you think that $1.5b is being burned?

    No, it will be reinvested in different, and likely better for the world, projects.

    ---

    The suggestion that you linked to the Breitbart post because you think it actually adds useful context and not just because you read about it there first is... embarrassing. You don't need to be embarrassed yourself though, I'm embarrassed enough for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Milland View Post
    Well, when you rely on Breitbart to pre-digest the news for you, I guess you'll accept anything they say.

    Or you could see that reality has a different view...

    Steel prices have tripled. Now Bank of America is sounding the alarm - CNN
    Funny I wouldn’t consider getting any news from cnn. Their regurgitation is guaranteed to be of a left bent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mutiny View Post
    Did you read the same press release I did?

    Do you think that $1.5b is being burned?

    No, it will be reinvested in different, and likely better for the world, projects.

    ---

    The suggestion that you linked to the Breitbart post because you think it actually adds useful context and not just because you read about it there first is... embarrassing. You don't need to be embarrassed yourself though, I'm embarrassed enough for you.
    Yes I read the actual press release they have over 100million in machinery sitting there that they will reuse somewhere else likely in a country that isn't planning on taxing the crap out of CO2 emissions.

    By the way I actually saw the story first on Bing news where I read multiple sources.

    The problem that the environmentalists never seem to realize if you want to do what's best for the environment you really ought to make it easy to permit best in class manufacturing technologies locally and then enjoy the jobs that come with it. All the time letting the newer more efficient cleaner technology displace the older stuff.

    The alternative is you penalize the heck out of a company like this and next thing you know the plant goes up in China or Mexico or somewhere else with far less pollution controls and since CO2 is a global problem you actually make things much worse.

    How do you think US Steel is going to invest these funds if they're not going to do it in Pittsburgh and how will it really be better for the environment? Judging by their actions I bet that the 100+million of equipment in storage probably will be deployed somewhere other then here but who knows.

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    OH BOY...another 45 page thread of crazy talk, miscellaneous bullshit and conspiracy theories. I'm going to cancel my HBO subscription, get some popcorn and soda and watch the fur fly.

    The title of the thread was an instant tip off that it was in the toilet before it even got off the launchpad.

    Stuart

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    I think some are missing the point from multiple steel industry analysts.

    If I read it right, they say there is a short term shortage due to a spike in demand from portions of the economy restarting (despite mills being at max production). Then there will be a glut, this bubble will burst and prices will crash.

    US Steel probably sees those same forecasts, regardless of whichever boogeyman their marketing department wants to blame.

    Also, there were a number of major US Steel plant closures over the past three years (pre-covid) despite the tariffs on foreign steel. Who was the boogeyman then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Montana View Post
    You blame them? I would run too...so much for 40/hr jobs...burger king here I come...Phil
    Well Biden had the backing of the majority of the labor unions so I'm sure they have other work lined up for the dues paying workers. BTW---Maybe old news but GM and Ford announced changing locations of some manufacturing-- so no worry about made in Pittsburg steel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Montana View Post
    If it from CNN its doggy dew, everyone knows that...Phil
    But if it comes from trump you can hang on every lie. Who dresses you trump cult members?

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    Might help to step back and think through this.

    First, (where) is there demand for steel? Nearly three-quarters of domestic use is for construction (#1 by far) and transportation (most autos).

    Investments in infrastructure should help with demand in construction.

    Given that almost every major automaker has said (including GM and Ford) that their future is electric vehicles, we won't be needing much steel for autos without leadership in EVs. Even with Tesla, the world's largest plug-in supplier here in the US (and China), we have a tiny 2% share of EVs among cars sold and a small market. Plug-ins are nearly a 5% share of vehicle purchases in China and in a larger market. Even Tesla gets most of its car profits there - and that may be under threat given US-China relations. So, you'd think (along with the current administration) that we'd want to help US companies grab some leadership in this area?

    Second, how much is US demand growing - and how much new capacity is needed? Turns out that steel use tracks the economy both short-term and long-term. Terrible in the Great Recession. Terrible in the Great Pandemic. Rebounded after the Great Recession. Set to rebound in 2021-2022 as well. Longer-term, some of the articles above stress it's not going to grow gangbusters in the years ahead and today's high prices likely represent a bubble likely to burst. Particularly, because so many other countries are bringing back capacity at a fast clip, including China and India. So, anyone too late to enjoy the bubble is likely to find the bust. US Steel has been late to the game in terms of improvements for decades now - and also well behind in this cycle.

    Third, how much of this modestly-growing future demand is/was US Steel likely to get?
    Seems US Steel's judgment is "not much more than we already have the capacity to serve."

    Big-ego leaders like Stalin and Mao were keen on adding steel capacity and, recollection is, both managed to screw up along the way. Back in grad school, US Steel used to fund manufacturing research and helped make the US the world's number one steel supplier. So, that was cool. But that was also then.

    Now, US Steel is something like #27 steel supplier in the world. It no longer attracts our best and brightest engineers and researchers - or much investment capital either. Even a once-tiny U.S. niche supplier of high-quality steels, Nucor, is way ahead of them.

    Given that we really are seeing the huge formerly "hidden" costs of climate change, doesn't really seem our egos should be especially worried that the #27th steelmaker in the world doesn't really see itself as being able to profitably expand capacity without being able to pollute our environment along the way. Let's see - if you'll let us cause $10 billion of environmental damage, we can maybe send $5 billion to US Steel shareholders???

    One thing we might do to help the Nucor's of the world is to keep a steel tariff in place, based on the putative environmental costs of steel produced in, say, China or India vs. the USA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Glug View Post
    I think some are missing the point from multiple steel industry analysts.

    If I read it right, they say there is a short term shortage due to a spike in demand from portions of the economy restarting (despite mills being at max production). Then there will be a glut, this bubble will burst and prices will crash.

    US Steel probably sees those same forecasts, regardless of whichever boogeyman their marketing department wants to blame.

    Also, there were a number of major US Steel plant closures over the past three years (pre-covid) despite the tariffs on foreign steel. Who was the boogeyman then?
    Maybe I am wrong but i would think a 1.5 Billion plant expansion is something that is done with a much longer time horizon in mind than the market is overheating today best pump the brakes now.

    I would think that at a cost of about 20% of their entire market cap, this is really a bet that the company is trying to make for the next 30-40 yrs.

    If they like me see the climate change stuff as making it super expensive to make their product here in the USA while far less expensive for either them or their competitors to make the steel in other countries why would they invest here?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Glug View Post
    Sounds like a lotta whining. Interesting they did not mention the steel tarrifs.

    The moneymen are saying there is a big steel bubble and it is about to pop, causing a collapse in steel prices. It's all greek to me.

    US Steel stock is at $26 today.

    United States Steel Corporation (X : NYSE) Stock Price & News - Google Finance

    Nucor Corporation (NUE : NYSE) Stock Price & News - Google Finance

    Hot rolled coil on 4/29, $1500/ton

    US Midwest Domestic Hot-Rolled Coil Steel Futures Historical Prices - Investing.com


    Steel prices have tripled. Now Bank of America is sounding the alarm - CNN

    Some quotes:

    The pandemic brought the American steel industry to its knees last spring, forcing manufacturers to shut down production as they struggled to survive the imploding economy. But as the recovery got underway, mills were slow to resume production, and that created a massive steel shortage.

    Now, the reopening of the economy is driving a steel boom so strong that some are convinced it will end in tears.

    After bottoming out around $460 last year, US benchmark hot-rolled coil steel prices are now sitting at around $1,500 a ton, a record high that is nearly triple the 20-year average.

    Steel stocks are on fire. US Steel (X), which crashed to a record low last March amid bankruptcy fears, has skyrocketed 200% in just 12 months. Nucor (NUE) has spiked 76% this year alone.


    Phil Gibbs, director of metals equity research at KeyBanc Capital Markets, agreed that steel prices are at unsustainable levels.
    "This would be like $170-a-barrel oil. At some point, people will say, 'F this, I'm not going to drive, I will take the bus,'" Gibbs told CNN Business. "The correction will be very intense. It's just a matter of when and how it happens."

    Steel is just the latest shortage to hit the US economy as it recovers from a pandemic that scrambled supply chains and set off sharp shifts in demand.
    Everything from computer chips and lumber to chlorine and tanker truck drivers are in short supply. Manufacturers, restaurants and other businesses are also desperate for workers.

    Meanwhile, the International Energy Agency warned this week that there isn't enough copper, lithium and other raw earth minerals available to make global clean energy ambitions a reality. The world risks "running out of copper," Bank of America strategists said in a recent note to clients.

    The good news, for steel buyers at least, is that analysts say all of the US steel production capacity that was idled during the pandemic has returned.
    That's why Tanners said she's very confident the shortage will soon end, causing steel prices to collapse. History shows that steel stocks "tend to peak" a month or so before steel prices, Tanners wrote in her report.

    She said US Steel in particular is vulnerable to a commodity downturn because it has the most amount of debt and the greatest need to spend to upgrade its plants.

    If the Biden administration rolls back even just some of those tariffs, it would ease supply constraints and weigh on steel prices.

    Tanners thinks that is likely to happen in the next 12 months.
    "We are protecting an industry where there is scarcity and prices are almost triple historical averages," she said.
    I welcome high steel prices, listen... this means things are rolling. Most of us in Manufacturing have never seen what is happening now.

    This is a good time to cut metal, pass on the higher cost of the steel and add 50% of that cost and put in your pocket.

    Inflation, can be very profitable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adammil1 View Post
    Maybe I am wrong but i would think a 1.5 Billion plant expansion is something that is done with a much longer time horizon in mind than the market is overheating today best pump the brakes now.

    I would think that at a cost of about 20% of their entire market cap, this is really a bet that the company is trying to make for the next 30-40 yrs.

    If they like me see the climate change stuff as making it super expensive to make their product here in the USA while far less expensive for either them or their competitors to make the steel in other countries why would they invest here?

    Sent from my SM-J737V using Tapatalk
    Probably correct regarding the cost of meeting accelerated carbon reduction. Who knows, a new Administration could mean foreign trade changes. One article mentioned more stringent local environmental requirements on top of not having the ability to "decarb" the steel manufacturing fast enough.


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