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  1. #21
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    "Why are only Foreign companies investing in America?" I hate questions with false premises. "Yes or no, have you stopped beating your wife." Do you you mean to say that Google, Facebook, Apple, Genentech, Nucor, Twitter, Salesforce, etc., are not investing in the U.S.A.? Agree or disagree about what these companies do or make, but for sure they are investing in the good ol' USA. Just check the housing prices around here. Try finding a residential or commercial contractor. Try renting a crane. Try hiring the best trades labor. Try driving at rush hour. Those are all effects of local investment on a massive scale.

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    its like the $44/month internet and if new account its $25/month. i tell internet company you are basically paying me or encouraging me to cancel the internet and get it else where
    .
    same with tax breaks and tariff breaks. basically encouraging factories to move far away rather than stay where they are
    .
    i have seen warehouses torn down to save on taxes and then they keep stuff in the truck or tractor trailer back parked in the parking lot or stuff in factory spread out and called under consignment or being delivered to save on paying taxes. literally cheaper to import from Germany and under being delivered rather than made in usa and in a warehouse.

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    In Central Oregon there are huge solar farms going in all over. I thought "Cool. Someone is thinking." Until I found they are all owned by Chinese companies. WTF?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gobo View Post
    In Central Oregon there are huge solar farms going in all over. I thought "Cool. Someone is thinking." Until I found they are all owned by Chinese companies. WTF?
    I know China is quite advanced re solar technology but don't know how it is in the USA. If I was in Colorado I'd be asking myself "If the Chinese think it's a good idea why don't we do it?" OK the USA does it but should it be done much more?

    Solar Farms: What Are They and How Much Do They Cost? | EnergySage

    Photovoltaic power station - Wikipedia

    BBC - Future - How China's giant solar farms are transforming world energy

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    Quote Originally Posted by rklopp View Post
    "Why are only Foreign companies investing in America?" I hate questions with false premises. "Yes or no, have you stopped beating your wife." Do you you mean to say that Google, Facebook, Apple, Genentech, Nucor, Twitter, Salesforce, etc., are not investing in the U.S.A.? Agree or disagree about what these companies do or make, but for sure they are investing in the good ol' USA. Just check the housing prices around here. Try finding a residential or commercial contractor. Try renting a crane. Try hiring the best trades labor. Try driving at rush hour. Those are all effects of local investment on a massive scale.
    In my first sentence I said that "only" was an exaggeration, and my second sentence said "industrial projects".
    I am aware of the tech stuff- but its mostly tiltups full of computers. Not what I call "industry". Server Farms follow cheap electricity, and decent sized internet access. If we raise the power rates, a lot of the cloud server farms could move within a year.
    Similar to the aluminum smelters- we used to have close to a dozen of them in Washington and Oregon- and now, Iceland offers lower power prices, the Saudis are subsidizing their power, and we have one running right now in PNW.
    Of course, the other big factor with both server farms and aluminum is government subsidies- The big ramp up in US aluminum was due to WW2 and the Cold war. The big rampup in server farms was driven as much, if not more, by government use for surveilliance and NSA number crunching. Numbers are not public, but many sources believe that at various times since 2001, over half of US cloud and server capacity was being contracted for by the Federal Govt, mostly for semi-secret programs.

    Believe me, I am well aware of residential and commercial construction- I get many jobs from that sector, and Seattle, near where I live, has more cranes operating construction than any other city in the US.

    Oddly enough, the liberal, high tax state where I live has quite a bit of industrial growth- partly due to geography, but also due to access to educated employees and a good place to live. I live within 50 miles of 4 oil refineries, and 2 of them are foreign owned. We have seen Nucor update the steel mill in Seattle, and the construction of some new manufacturing plants as well.

    But for big scale manufacturing, a LOT of the dollars are from foreign companies. I am talking Auto, Steel, Petrochemicals, and so on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    But for big scale manufacturing, a LOT of the dollars are from foreign companies. I am talking Auto, Steel, Petrochemicals, and so on.
    If you had said "Investing in Manufacturing in the US" no one could have argued ...

    Apple doesn't invest in the US anyhow. All their money is tied up in the Double-Dutch Tax Dodge

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    Thank You for sharing such a useful information. We are expecting more from you

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    Why is only China investing in Africa and the new Silk Road?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Miguels244 View Post
    Why is only China investing in Africa and the new Silk Road?
    Because the US thinks bombing pharmaceutical factories in the Sudan makes us more friends ?

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    And, Ox recently let us know that, in July of last year, Amada bought Marvel saws. For now, they will still be built in Wisconsin...

    Amada Acquires Marvel Manufacturing Co., Inc. - Marvel Saws

    I cant help thinking that was not just a case of who will pay the most- I dont think its a coincidence that when Marvel decides to sell, they sell to one of the top 2 or 3 saw companies in the world, instead of to a bunch of rich kids in Connecticut who just push money around for a living.

    Still, Amada is japanese.
    And they put their money where their mouth is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    And, Ox recently let us know that, in July of last year, Amada bought Marvel saws. For now, they will still be built in Wisconsin...

    Amada Acquires Marvel Manufacturing Co., Inc. - Marvel Saws

    I cant help thinking that was not just a case of who will pay the most- I dont think its a coincidence that when Marvel decides to sell, they sell to one of the top 2 or 3 saw companies in the world, instead of to a bunch of rich kids in Connecticut who just push money around for a living.

    Still, Amada is japanese.
    And they put their money where their mouth is.
    My first thought is that Amada is in the same league as when Takeuchi Press took over Stolle.
    Good partnership.

    Hope so anyway.

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    Rich kids in Connecticut? Been to Hartford lately?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    And, Ox recently let us know that, in July of last year, Amada bought Marvel saws. For now, they will still be built in Wisconsin ...... I dont think its a coincidence that when Marvel decides to sell...
    First question that pops into my head is, "Why did they decide to sell at all ?"

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    Quote Originally Posted by adh2000 View Post
    Rich kids in Connecticut? Been to Hartford lately?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Not lately, but sure, I have been to Hartford. And, yes, its pretty hollowed out.
    But its also true that the "Gold Coast" of CT is the home of the global hedge fund industry.
    Connecticut's wealthy Gold Coast: where life is good, if you can afford it | US news | The Guardian

    obviously, homeless junkies in Hartford are not buying companies.
    but rich guys over on the other side of the state can, and do, it everyday.
    https://www.ft.com/content/3bffaf1c-...9-de94fa33a81e

    according to this, the top 2 hedge funds in the state manage $160 Billion and $106 Billion, respectively, but there are lots of small, 20 to 50 billion dollar firms, too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    according to this, the top 2 hedge funds in the state manipulate $160 Billion and skim $106 Billion, respectively, but there are lots of small, 20 to 50 billion dollar firms, too.
    There. Fixed that for you

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon B. Clarke View Post
    Probably just one of several examples but I think foreign companies tend to plan further ahead than US ones. China is "famous" for long term planning.

    When US companies invest abroad is it for a quick profit or long term planning? I know what I think but I don't know for sure.

    We have some of the largest US companies building (and investing) here in Denmark. As long as jobs are created it's regarded as good.

    Yah THINK?

    Most public US corporations of any size are slaves to the stock market. The top management knows this, and they know they have to produce good numbers on a day to day and week to week basis.

    The market however, is unreliable. Don't meet your goals, down goes the stock. Exceed your goals, down goes the stock, because there is less profit to be made in the next cycle, or so the market watchers think. The stock market is based on perceptions, not reality, yet these companies need to respond to it and get their numbers up.

    That sort of chasing of ghosts is not the way to make money and do well. Nor is it good for planning. A plan is expected to be implemented right now, and produce big returns soon. Otherwise it is a "failure", and those associated with it are at least "encouraged" to seek employment elsewhere.

    Then also, upper management is a bit of a scam. With the crazy salaries and benefits, some of these CEOs are being paid a grand or more to take a crap. Each one of them may be, due to salary, displacing anywhere from a couple dozen to a few thousand productive employees. But it is cheaper to pay the CEO and top staff a lot to manage a shell corp that only warehouses stuff and sells it, rather than to have to deal with actual production facilities and staff, which is all product specific.

    That way a new product is as easy as getting a new contract manufacturer, no need to spend more money on nasty old fashioned limited physical production plants.. Let someone else take that risk,

    Nobody can be worth that much to the corporation. The salaries etc are just what you have to pay to get a CEO who will sufficiently impress the stockholders so they feel they are getting a better stock. Joe Doakes may be 50x better as a manager, but your stock will be punished for hiring him. And, it is all about the stock price.

    "Increasing stockholder value", you know.....

    No, it is not ALL like that, but plenty enough IS.

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    Warren Buffet knows what a nonsense circus that is... his philosophy has worked out well for him, too bad most everyone else plays the game the other way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg White View Post
    anyone hear the NPR ditty yesterday aboot China investing in things in Africa?
    teaching the children in Sudan to speak Chinese?
    investing in up grading remote villages?
    the long term gain /
    Gw
    I suspect the countries they are sucking up to have rare minerals.

    metalmagpie

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    There are not only foreign companies investing in the U.S. today really. This has been pointed out already. Different countries invest in different countries for sure yet the overall economy of large countries with large economies (like the U.S.) dictate the whole market because without a market there should not be much produced to sell to the market. The U.S. is not a weak market in the world despite dis-tractors.

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    I remember reading in this interesting book more than twenty years ago that the U.S. state governors and officials who even then were appealing to Japanese companies to "invest" in their state, instead of some other state, were scornfully referred to by the Japanese as "the beggars".

    The Japanese were then spending an estimated 400 million dollars a year buying lobbyists and congressmen to get what they wanted in Washington; it seems they got it then, and they're certainly getting it now.

    Of course now China and Korea are in there bidding as well, which must be driving up the price of congressmen considerably!

    "Every man for himself" is perhaps acceptable when the ship is going down, but if it prevails before that, it can be the reason the ship goes down.

    Of course with one or two notable exceptions, politicians all over the Western World are selling out their nations in a similar way.

    For decades, while the US was ascendant, it made sense to pretend that "nationalism" and "mercantilism" were BAD THINGS, because when you're big and rich enough to control your neighbors you want them to buy into the pretense so the looting isn't as painful or as noticeable!

    But when the shoe is on the other foot...well, then you begin to see why the most successful industrial societies: Germany and Japan, and now Korea and China play by different rules.

    Economics is war by other means, as Bismarck said. To win a war, or even survive in one, you have to first know that you are at war, and then WORK TOGETHER to win - or at least not lose.


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