How to rate the cap. of two forklift on opposing sides of load - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    All the times I have ever done two forklift lifts is for big equipment, loading on the asphault parking lot. Skates would just sink into the blacktop and be stuck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    I used to do this all the time with the boss on the other fork,and he was always trying to "speed up",and you had to read his (tiny) mind,and keep up with what he was doing,or drop a million dollar load.He used to do the same with the crane,he would lift while you were rigging the slings to speed you up......no wonder he s a billionaire.
    Be a sore LONELY billionaire, he's actually that foolish as to do a half-assed job of equipment operator and put the hired help at risk into the deal. Doubt a proper crane operator is takin' on his duties in the boardroom, but yah gotta know "REAL riggers" [1] and BEDROOMS!



    [1]Do the impossible, fight for no reason, growl at their food, and f**k anything they can CATCH and get their legs around, motorcars, trams, and horses not immune, and the easy ones twice.

  4. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garwood View Post
    You can lift more than the combined capacity of both forklifts if they are opposing each other. Just comes down to skill of the operators.

    Biggest issue going down is the hydraulics get pretty touchy when you are way over capacity. You really don't want to "bounce" the load by letting go of the lever.

    Going up you have a similar issue where you need to throttle up pretty good and feather the hydraulics while staying in sync with a forklift you can't see.
    Hey the truck just showed up! Some one go find Dave in accounting. He is the other guy with a fork lift license.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  5. #24
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    Nevermind


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob F. View Post
    So you will have two forklifts with masts on blocks, with a large load sitting on the forks and then tilt the mast forward and back to get the blocks out?
    What that does is change the fulcrum of the forklift. All a forklift is, is a simple lever. The normal fulcrum of the forklift is center of the drive tires, which can be a foot or more behind the mast. By blocking the mast, you move the fulcrum closer to the load, right under the mast. This in turn gives the forklift counterweight a better mechanical advantage, allowing you to lift more weight without tipping.

    You can overload other components of the forklift doing this, and it only works to just lift the load straight up and pull the truck out form under the suspended load and set the load straight down, as you can't travel with blocks under the mast. It will work though, if you have no other choice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by m16ty View Post
    What that does is change the fulcrum of the forklift. All a forklift is, is a simple lever. The normal fulcrum of the forklift is center of the drive tires, which can be a foot or more behind the mast. By blocking the mast, you move the fulcrum closer to the load, right under the mast. This in turn gives the forklift counterweight a better mechanical advantage, allowing you to lift more weight without tipping.

    You can overload other components of the forklift doing this, and it only works to just lift the load straight up and pull the truck out form under the suspended load and set the load straight down, as you can't travel with blocks under the mast. It will work though, if you have no other choice.
    Thanks, that makes sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob F. View Post
    Thanks, that makes sense.
    It does, but not to forget that the principle gain is stability and easier and faster implementation than - for example - trying to add mass to the counterweight and remain fully mobile.

    All still "within bounded limits", even so.

    The gross limit on the hydraulic system - possibly also a range-amplifying chain - EG: direct lift capacity, nor the bending limit of the forks still "are whatever they are".

    One could make a case that both drivers would be well-served with some rented or scrounged video and communications gear so they could communicate directly and both "see" the same view of the load from - perhaps the end-point, both FL trucks, both sides of the load in view, not otherwise in direct sight of either operator.

    "Movie" stuff of that sort is cheap or already lying around, these days and could make "synchronizing" a lift almost automatic if they are on the ball as to keeping in close match to each other.

  9. #28
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    I loaded a CNC lahe once using the blocking under the mast methode
    The machine was 4.5 tons The truck 4 tons but the COG was too far out
    I could pull the lathe(which was on a skid) with the forklift into position helping a bit with a pallettruck
    Then blockes the mast with a piece of hardwood with some sheetmetal on top
    It went great
    Only the driver had to back out a couple of times to get the machine in like I wanted
    There are even forklifts with a hydraulic system to do just that

    Peter

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    Quote Originally Posted by johfoster View Post
    To change the topic of the thread. I have trouble seeing any situation were that blocking method would work and be practical. Once you block it you can no longer move the lift truck, and I do not see a situation were i can get under a load still having space to tilt far enough back/forth to block the mast. I also would not let anyone climb under the load to pull the blocks.

    What circumstances would you consider this method of lifting used?
    Ever forklift I've driven would pick more with the tilt cylinders than it would with the mast lift. So when picking a heavy load from a trailer, you would lift all the mast would do, and then pick the load with the tilt cylinders. This also puts the COG of the load much closer to the drive wheels (tipping point) with the load in the air than it will be when the forks are lowered. With this sort of pick the forklift will do a face plant before you ever get the load on the ground.

    So you pick the load, and back away from the trailer a little bit. The forks are still over the trailer, so no hazard of falling. Crib the bottom of the mast, working from the side. Now the truck pulls away and you can lower the load safely. Set the load on cribbing and you can get the forklift out from under the load. Now you have a load to heavy to pick, but its on the ground and the truck is gone. You now have plenty of time and more room to decide how you are going to handle the load.

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    If you're really into belt-and-suspenders, you can also chain the forklifts together at the bottom (on the ground, under the trailer) to keep them from 'flipping out', away from each other. Only helps if the load prevents the top of the lifts from moving toward each other. Doesn't change the danger from overloading things, of course.

    Using phones/video to coordinate things can help, but beware the latency involved. I've tried to hitch a trailer up using iPhones and FaceTime, and even that short delay, and having just one person involved, revealed the shortcomings of the plan.

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    Here are some pictures from around 12am last night getting our truck unloaded. What was supposed to be a dedicated flatbed had two airplane taxi vehicles on the back when it arrived, but we managed to make it happen still. (Albeit a bit more nerve racking) The truck driver was great, my friend with zero forklift experience was steady, and we got it off without incident.
    screenshot_20191007-103520_whatsapp.jpg
    img-20191007-wa0022.jpg

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  14. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by johfoster View Post
    Here are some pictures from around 12am last night getting our truck unloaded. What was supposed to be a dedicated flatbed had two airplane taxi vehicles on the back when it arrived, but we managed to make it happen still. (Albeit a bit more nerve racking) The truck driver was great, my friend with zero forklift experience was steady, and we got it off without incident.
    screenshot_20191007-103520_whatsapp.jpg
    img-20191007-wa0022.jpg
    Hmm.. NO FL experience, tired end of the day, shitty lighting, a *slightly* higher lift than was expected, and no problems? ...

    Y'all should mebbe hire-out as lawyers for Trump? Nah. Too much like a noisy form of suicide..

    Meanwhile ..can I git y'all lucky f**kers to go pick me out a coupla lottery tickets, each?


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    Quote Originally Posted by johfoster View Post
    To change the topic of the thread. I have trouble seeing any situation were that blocking method would work and be practical. Once you block it you can no longer move the lift truck, and I do not see a situation were i can get under a load still having space to tilt far enough back/forth to block the mast. I also would not let anyone climb under the load to pull the blocks.


    What circumstances would you consider this method of lifting used?
    That question is being actively avoided because clearly someone would have to crawl under the load to unblock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmead View Post
    That question is being actively avoided because clearly someone would have to crawl under the load to unblock.
    WTF "crawl"?

    Effing liberals have now banned rope because somebody with a case and a half of the "jaws" might want to HANG a politician the sensationalist media hasn't already got under the threat of it?

    Or just what?

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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    WTF "crawl"?

    Effing liberals have now banned rope because somebody with a case and a half of the "jaws" might want to HANG a politician the sensationalist media hasn't already got under the threat of it?

    Or just what?
    Politics and ropes aside, have you actually blocked the masts of both forkifts on a tandem lift?

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    Heh. Wait until the owner of the aircraft tugs sees these shots...

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmead View Post
    Politics and ropes aside, have you actually blocked the masts of both forkifts on a tandem lift?
    Nope. Used a 5 Ton recovery vehicle or 20-ton RT crane instead, mostly. "Tandem lift" was paired VTR-88's to git a dead M48 onto a draggin' wagon's lowboy. Done more often that we'd have wished the need of, too.

    Done plenty of mast foot blocking on ONE FL, though. Tilted and seasonally unstable soil thing, top layer of laterite like red-brown GREASE so tires and brakes might want to move unfavorably. Not so much a capacity boost. "Rainy season, RVN" thing, rather.

    Don't NEED a wedged fit. Tilt the mast a skosh, pull the rope, grillage comes to yah like an obedient puppy dog with no need of crawling under a load.

    Or did you think "First Logistical Command" was in the bizness of building log cabins in Canada's North Woods for eco-tourists .... 'stead of supplying a major war 24 by 7 with all manner of "stuff", boots to bulldozers, food to forklifts, napkins to napalm?

    That tank of yours was possibly a one-man, one winch or cordage-plus MHE vehicle unload, without need of a full lift, BTW. Why fly if it was not even eligible for "air miles"?

    Tank was FULL? Didn't seem so. Support rapidly emplaced for side slide, even single-handed, empty.
    Got other means if it WAS full, too.

    "When the only hammer you have is a PAIR of forklifts, the whole world looks like it needs a synchronized lift."


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    I told the driver at the first sign of unstability I was gonna call it off and he would just have to hang tight til the morning for a bigger lift truck. The tugs were not supposed to be on the trailer in the first place.

    For the record my friend helping merely worked the up down after I placed the lifts, and put him on the Hyster so he wouldn't be on the joystick control of the Nissan. I would trust a close friend who I know is intelligent and aware of his lack of skill over many others with lots of "experience".

    Yes Sunday at midnight is not ideal, but also in many ways better than monday morning with lots of traffic in the neighborhood. Thats why we did it then. It worked out. It probably wasn't as sketchy as it looked in the end.

    I did ponder who was gonna be on the hook for damages to the tugs in a worst case scenario. I figured the driver was just as much a party to the ordeal as us atleast. I am willing to consider risking damage to items if the situation calls for it. I knew we were all safe or I wouldv'e called it off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johfoster View Post
    I told the driver at the first sign of unstability I was gonna call it off and he would just have to hang tight til the morning for a bigger lift truck. The tugs were not supposed to be on the trailer in the first place.

    For the record my friend helping merely worked the up down after I placed the lifts, and put him on the Hyster so he wouldn't be on the joystick control of the Nissan. I would trust a close friend who I know is intelligent and aware of his lack of skill over many others with lots of "experience".

    Yes Sunday at midnight is not ideal, but also in many ways better than monday morning with lots of traffic in the neighborhood. Thats why we did it then. It worked out. It probably wasn't as sketchy as it looked in the end.

    I did ponder who was gonna be on the hook for damages to the tugs in a worst case scenario. I figured the driver was just as much a party to the ordeal as us atleast. I am willing to consider risking damage to items if the situation calls for it. I knew we were all safe or I wouldv'e called it off.
    Risk wasn't that high, as their own ROP cages wudda limited any damage from what "appears to be" a heavy-gage, but even so, thin-enough plate as could be classed as "sheet-metal" tank. THAT flat-sided critter you could have trashed and wracked rather badly, yes.

    Autobody shop skills, hammers and Bondo wouldn't easily get it back right for "looks", but there was no real risk it couldn't be easily patched to hold liquid, so...



    I'd have actually preferred to not lift it any more than to get timber under it so as to slide it off to the side, first step. Then deal with relocating it after the carrier was out of the zone and more space - and time - was to be had.

    One does any job with what you have, not what you WISH you had, so "good on yah".

    But do keep an ear open for other means as might also serve yah well, some other load, some other day.

    There's a whole universe of experience "right here on PM", some other members doing the damndest of the "hard stuff" as full-time professional riggers every day, all day, and for serious long years.

    More than fifty years since I've formally taught rigging, so nowadays I'm mostly a "note taker" and useful-cheat collector and hoarder on most of that useful lore.

    Always looking for the lazy man's tricks as have the least risk, lowest rise, least-costly equipment and krew, and most of all least WORK to them.

    Ask the members as recently got a 10EE motor. 10EE MG unit, or a Phase Perfect from me. Near-zero labour, even less risk, both ends.

    Bad form to break the goods, break the equipment, break skin... or even break a sweat!

    Need sumthin' done FAST? Ask a busy man.

    Need it done CHEAP? Ask a lazy man.

    Lazy, Iyam. And proud of it, thanks!



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