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Moving Van Norman Mill

MatthewL

Plastic
Joined
Jun 27, 2018
Location
Houston
I just bought a Van Norman No. 16 milling machine (2200 lbs). I don't have experience moving something this large, nor do I have any equipment. All I have is a capable car to pull a rented trailer. The machine is about a four hour drive from me. I called some wreckers, but they where asking about the same amount I paid for the machine. I was also considering buying a 2 ton capacity engine hoist and renting a Uhaul trailer, but I am not sure if this is the best idea. If anyone knows of any wreckers from Bertram, TX (near Austin) to Houston, TX that will do it fairly cheaply, let me know. Otherwise, I am looking for some recommendations on moving it myself.

Thanks.
 
Engine hoist may not reach high enough to lift onto a trailer.
A wrecker truck might charge $100 to set it on..also one can rent a tractor most any place.
it should be bolted to pallet to make the foot print larger. and secured with two (or more straps or chains).
2200 pounds is practically nothing but still drive like you have a hot coffee setting on the dash.
Good to have a co pilot along to watch out.
lift it straight up and move the trailer under..The same off loading.
Nice rounded topside on that machine so no sharp edges to strap over,but machines can slide under a strap just slung over.
so not a bad idea to sling it so holding it from topping, not just down.
 
Will seller load it? If so, then just get a wrecker to unload (usually +/-$100), or rent a forklift. If seller cannot load, maybe one of those drop deck trailers from an equipment rental yard. Good luck, play safe!

Edit: Care to expound more on the "capable car"? I hope its at least an SUV, small trailer stout enough to haul is going to weigh at least 1000 lbs + 2200 lbs= 3200 lbs guestimate.
 
You can move it. It would be easier if you didn't have to transport the engine hoist at the same time. Hopefully, being Texan, you drive a pickup truck and can carry the hoist in back.

I have moved a Bridgeport with an engine hoist. Here are some things to keep in mind. You must extend the legs fully, all 4, and tighten all bolts. Think every move through ahead of time before you leave home. Bring rope or a sling to rig the mill to the hook. You want minimum space between the mill and hook, so rig it close. Do not move the hoist even an inch with the mill in the air. The casters are only rated for the weight of the hoist. Lift it straight up and back the trailer under it. Make sure that the weight is placed so you have tongue weight. (More weight in front of the axle than behind.)

U-Haul open trailers are great. Their beds are nice and low. Use 10000 lb rated ratcheting straps to secure your load. Know what your trailer's tiedowns look like before you buy the straps. If you plan to strap over the knee, first lower it onto a block and then lock it first. An unsecured knee can work down which will loosen your strap. One strap pulling it backwards, another pulling it forwards, both straps pulling down.

Pick a dry day or get some of that saran-type plastic wrap and really wrap the machine before you strap it down.

You need a plan to move it into your shop once you get it home. A bucket full of short pieces of pipe and a long pry bar work well and safely, if slowly.

metalmagpie
 
dalmatiangirl61: It is an SUV. Seller does not have any suitable equipment to load it.

The mill is only 5' 8" tall with the motor. If I remove the motor it will be probably a foot shorter. I can probably get access to a pickup truck. Would it be discouraged to try and put the mill in the bed of a truck rather than a trailer? If I put it in a truck, I realize I will need to use a forklift or hire a wrecker. Right now, I think using a rented trailer and an engine hoist is best.
 
If motor is easy to pull then pull but then it should also be bolted to a pallet with two straps. figure how high you need to get over tire height. Doesn't hurt to set jack stands under rear to be safe until machine is centered for tongue weight. Pinch bar handy to move it about on trailer. Pipes for rollers and (6) 2x4x 6" for set-unders for moving it about trailer.


consider a 6' tall machine. a little free space over for the sling, and the height of trailer floor of perhaps 2 feet..just saying the engine hoist may not work..so you may need 8 or 9' lift.
A 1/16 and even near 1/8" edge can be too sharp for straps so some card board or something to protect straps..
 
dalmatiangirl61: It is an SUV. Seller does not have any suitable equipment to load it.

The mill is only 5' 8" tall with the motor. If I remove the motor it will be probably a foot shorter. I can probably get access to a pickup truck. Would it be discouraged to try and put the mill in the bed of a truck rather than a trailer? If I put it in a truck, I realize I will need to use a forklift or hire a wrecker. Right now, I think using a rented trailer and an engine hoist is best.

Skids are ALWAYS good. "Average" 1500-series pickup is prolly a far worse choice than a trailer. Sorry deck, poor payload, tall load sits too high, bed-box has poor attach points. And then it flexes.

I'd not go NEAR it with an "engine hoist", either. Not "best" at much of anything, not even hoisting engines!

Wrecker @ $100 to load onto trailer gets you off the PO's premises and onto the backhaul fastest, is worth the spend, both counts.

Find a used TIRE you can drop over the top of it and you have good tie-down points, all sides.

For the unload, I'd use a timber roadway blocked up on grillage, slide it rather than skate it. Skates or rollers just make it harder to safely control. Sliding or corner-walking works well at easily twice and more that modest mass.

A rigger (usta bee I cudn evin spael "rigger", but then I WERE one!) could ALSO single-handedly put it INTO even a non-drop-deck trailer working entirely from the base with nought but timber, bottle jack, grillage, and pry bar. Come-along optional.

Downside is that method is a tad time-consuming. Also risky if you aren't already well-used to doing stuff that way.

I do cheat with "many" skates and a pair of decent toe-jacks in me old age, but you can get the timber - or extra/supplemental - at pickup site from any Big Box, 7 days a week. First cut, their saw, is free, more cuts are cheap enough. Coupla sheets of galvanized, you can slide or corner-walk it across even very rough concrete and/or softwood timber.

Carry a hand "bow saw" rather than a power saw to make on-site and/or en-route "adjustments" so lack of a power outlet nor flat batteries are not an issue. Raggedy cuts are OK. You ain't makin' fine furniture nor framing a roof.

No "cardboard" BTW. Shit basically disintegrates into a lubricant in the rain, weren't much use even dry.

Five-buck recycled rubber doormats from the dollar store. Uncut, they'll find plenty of use once to-home. Money is tight ONE mat can be cut up for "many" pads with a box knife. Radiator-hose repair tape (water-resistant adhesive cousin of duct tape) to keep 'em in-place.

Put bungees on your ropes or flat-strap tie-downs to pull a side-strain so they don't flap and work loose.

Put LOTS of cordage AND bungees to keep a rain-tarp in-place. Count it a consumable, even so. The slipstream beats them all raggedy-ass.

CHECK ALL THIS S**T, early, then often. If mere movement down even a glass-smooth road CAN f**k sumthin' up? It will do, and more than once. Lybarger's Corollary applies.
 
Lot of good advice from Thermite, I think.

I once fetched a Bridgeport from 4 hours away with my Durango and a rented trailer that had a drop-down bed.

As I recall, we bolted it to 2x6s -- a better option than a pallet unless you plan on using a forklift to unload -- and rolled it out of the fellow's garage/shop on pipes. A Fairbanks lever dolly would be a good investment here. You may not use it often, but it's VERY handy when you need it. Boards wider than the base, of course, as wide as you can accommodate, and orient them perpendicular to the axis of the trailer for sideways stability. Add two more front to back if you are worried about sudden stops. I rolled the dice and did not, but I was very watchful of traffic in front. Anything you can do to block/strap/add friction to keep the base from shifting while on the trailer will help.

From the back of the trailer we slid it in with a come-along and strapped it down. Don't go up and over, go up and back down the same side, all sides. And take that heavy motor off if you can. It's probably one of those old cast iron monsters like I have on my VN #12.

Another thing, limit your crew to one extra person unless you have a bunch of professionals for friends. With 3 or more amateurs on a job like this there is always someone ready to dive in helpfully but stupidly and do something unexpected that will screw things up.

I was nervous all the way home, but nothing shifted.
 
The engine hoist will lift the machine, if you can rig it very close to the ram. Use straps under the ram on each side of the column to lift. Don't worry about the motor, it shouldn't cause you any problems. The issue with the engine hoist is not lifting, though... it's the fact that the spread on the legs is just barely enough to clear the base. You also won't have enough reach to place it on the trailer, as it is going to sit on the edge because the hoist will have to be practically all the way in for the weight. You will have to block under the trailer to prevent it tilting and then use a come along and/or pry bar to walk the machine to the center of the trailer for tiedown and hauling.

If you bolt it to a pallet, there is no way the hoist will go over the pallet, same for skids. Fortunately, a VN is not nearly as top heavy as a Bridge port so just drop the knee as far as it will go and run the saddle back to the column, center the table. Strap the hell out of it and the pallet/skids are not necessary. I have moved dozens of machines and never bolted to a pallet. I'm always more concerned with a pallet failing and dropping the machine.
 
QT sharp: [As I recall, we bolted it to 2x6s -- a better option than a pallet] good idea and something better than cardboard for sharp edges also good idea.
You might make brace of 2x4s so it might not go/fall forward with hard putting on the breaks..that is likely the way it might be in most danger.
I would tarp it then wrap with plastic roll wrap to insure things falling off might be caught.
 
I have moved several machines that size and found most engine hoists always have some issue either with being too short or the legs get in the way? What has worked for me was to get the machine on a pallet and just use a pallet jack. Easy to roll around and rated at more than the machine weight. The last bridgeport I moved we got one of those drop down deck trailers and a sheet of plywood and the machine rolled right on.
 
I have moved several machines that size and found most engine hoists always have some issue either with being too short or the legs get in the way? What has worked for me was to get the machine on a pallet and just use a pallet jack. Easy to roll around and rated at more than the machine weight. The last bridgeport I moved we got one of those drop down deck trailers and a sheet of plywood and the machine rolled right on.

Yep.
But if you use a normal trailer Absolutely crib the frame as you are loading and unloading unless you rent a forklift or crane.
Having the trailer wobbling around as you re moving the machine can be a bad thing.
I unloaded the Lehmann with a friend.
We strapped a steel beam to the roof joists then supported the ends with house jacks to hold the weight.
Backed the trailer under and picked the machine with two chainfalls.
Walked it into place with bars.

I gave up this time and hired some riggers.
For 1500 they showed up at at the sellers and loaded the lathe.
Then drove to the ware house and loaded the mill.
tHEN put both of them where I wanted them in the shop.

Worth every penny.
 
You want a wide and long timber-framed carriage-bolted base under it. Block it into the truck or screw it to a wooden trailer deck. Remove high heavy parts if you can. Lower the table down onto wood blocks to support it - don’t rely on the elevating screw and gib lock to hold it, as you may strip them.

Loading and unloading are the easy parts. Unless you’re going just around the corner, pay a lot of attention to how you secure the load.
 
Its just a one metric ton machine
don`t get too exited about it
A simple way to get it on a trailer is to use a tandem axle trailer
Remove the 2 wheels at the back Then the trailer will fall backwards
Make up a ramp Lined with sheetmetal perhaps if you have any
Then pull the machine up the ramp with a chain fall tied to the tongue
Keep the strap low at the base
With a decent floor 2200 lbs should be no problem
Make sure it is on 2 cross members minimum and strap it down
Then lift the trailer with 2 jacks and put the tires back on
Make sure you have enough weight on the tongue Better a bit too much as to little

i would not get it off the trailer in a reversed way like that
If possible I would use the way Micheal244 mentioned
2 House jacks underneeth the roof joints with a steel or wooden beam
You could also connect the roof joints to the structure of the building in any other way

Peter
 
I just bought a Van Norman No. 16 milling machine (2200 lbs). I don't have experience moving something this large, nor do I have any equipment. All I have is a capable car to pull a rented trailer. The machine is about a four hour drive from me. I called some wreckers, but they where asking about the same amount I paid for the machine. I was also considering buying a 2 ton capacity engine hoist and renting a Uhaul trailer, but I am not sure if this is the best idea. If anyone knows of any wreckers from Bertram, TX (near Austin) to Houston, TX that will do it fairly cheaply, let me know. Otherwise, I am looking for some recommendations on moving it myself.

Thanks.

Dont use an engine hoist.

THERE IS NO REASON TO LIFT THIS AT ALL. (assuming the mill on a concrete slab that you can back a trailer up to)

RENT A DROP DECK TRAILER. NOT A TILTING DECK, A DROP DECK. Cost me $45 to rent a few years ago.

All you need is a long prybar, some wood scraps, two 4x4's, and four or five piecse of 3/4" steel pipe (3ft long). A come-along is also handy.


Start by prying up one corner, stick a small piece of 1/2" plywood under the corner.
go to next corner, do the same.
do the remaining corners.
Now the mill is 1/2" off the ground.
Keep working your way around the base of the mill inserting thicker pieces of wood.
When you get up to 3-1/2", insert a 4x4 maybe 6' long under each side and lag bolt through the base to create two long skids. Cut an angle the ends of each 4x4 before inserting under the mill so the bottom edge wont catch on anything (like a ski)

So now you have a mill with a nice wide & stable base.
Use prybar and wood scraps to lift each corner of the skid again, this time just go up 1".
Slide pipes under.
You can now push the mill around by hand as it rolls easily on the pipes.
back up the trailer, lower it down to floor level, push mill on. You can use the prybar to scoot the mill around on the skids even without the pipe underneath. A come-along makes it easier to drag into final position on the trailer, but it can be done without.
I've done this many times, by myself, both loading and unloading 2200 pound mills and lathes
 
I have a trailer with a heavy duty ramp and I do pinch or roller a machine on and off up and down the ramp..but I also have a crank winch to keep taught so the machine might not get away..and the trailer on jack stands so it will not tip/tilt. Machines to 2500 or about are easy..

Still:
Lifting straight up, dropping straight down with not traveling the lifter and the machine,,,,but only moving the trailer under / or out is the safe way to load.
Traveling a machine it should be as close to the ground/floor as possible.... and nobody standing in the fall/tip/roll zone..
 
APD: I like your idea. I am still searching for a drop deck trailer rental in Houston, and I can't seem to find one yet.
The company called Sunstate Equipment has drop deck trailers, but they seem to only rent out to companies. I may call them tomorrow unless anyone verifies they do not rent to individuals.

I called a machinery mover to get a quote for just lifting the machine up and out of the trailer, but they wanted $900, so I figured there were probably better options. Should I call just regular towing companies?

Bridgeports seem to have a good spot to lift under the ram, but the Van Norman doesn't really have a ram that extends out on both sides. I didn't take any overall pictures, but here is one from the manual:
Screen Shot 2019-01-03 at 10.08.32 PM.jpg
Is there any recommendations for lifting the machine, whether it be with a forklift, a boom truck, or a tractor?

And, thank you all for the responses.
 
You can't see it in that dinky little picture, but the entire head of the machine, with motor, spindle head and overarm, slides fore and aft. That's the ram. There are typically two ram binders on the left side of the column, which are about 1/2 turn cam locks. On the larger 2x/3x machines, there's a rack-and-pinion that moves the ram, with crank shaft near the binders.

Slide the ram so it sticks out both fore and aft of the column. Lock the ram and lift the machine by the ram, with lift slings/forks placed adjacent to the column front and back. My #28A with oversized table runs close to 7000lb and that's how the riggers brought it into the shop. If you're using chains or forks, make sure to put some pieces of plywood to protect the sliding surfaces of the ram (and give better friction with forks). If you're using nylon slings, make sure to put some pieces of plywood or heavy canvas to protect the sling from the edges of the ram.

Now, if this machine has been used in one ram position for years, it may take some work to get the ram to move. When my machine arrived, it had ancient-oil stiction issues and a huge wad of chips clogging the rack. Breaking the ram loose was fairly easy, but it took the better part of two hours, moving the ram as far forward and as far backward as I could, scraping chips out from the rack with a long probe, before I got my ram fully freed up.
 
I will be picking the mill up this weekend, and I have decided to go with a drop deck trailer. I found this for rent near me:
Screen Shot 2019-01-08 at 8.51.34 PM.jpg
It looks different from most pictures of a drop deck trailer I have seen, but they claim it is. Also, I don't see any places to attach straps. Does it seem suitable? The same company has a different drop deck trailer:
Screen Shot 2019-01-08 at 8.56.35 PM.jpg
I would go with this one, except the only location that has it in stock is a few hours away from me.

Thanks.
 








 
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