Overhead crane brainstorming.
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    Default Overhead crane brainstorming.

    I have a friend that thought he had a job, so got a lot of 2" schedule 40 pipe. The job fell through, so we have some extra pipe that's not returnable. We were discussing what to do with it and the idea of an overhead crane came up. This is a would be used in a blacksmith forge, so it would only need to be 500-1000lbs. Basically just to make taking large peices from the forge to the triphammer to the table. Would this be possible? I see a lot of cranes using I beams, but maybe that could be just the trolley track? My thoughts are an under truss out of maybe ⅜" rod for strength. It would only be about 12' x 12'.

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    Sounds like square peg/round hole issue. Trade the pipe to somebody who had an I beam job fall through.

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    No worries........I made several from scffold tube,2" dia,and all pin jointed for easy moving........if you need a load carrying beam,simply fabricate a zig zag truss with pipe as the two chords...........I used to own a large shed ,all the framework and 100ft roof truss span were waterpipe made into zig zag trusses......Have a look at a 100ft crane boom.....lot thinner wall than you ve got.

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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    zig zag trusses
    That is classic right there. Is that a Australian thing or you just pull that out? That's great.

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    I think he pulled that one out of you know where they are called trusses there are several designs out there here is one.

    Warren Truss | Garrett's Bridges

    The crane will have to be designed by a engineer who calculates the loads and most likely puts it into a program for analysis and its quicker to do it that way.
    So investigate what a engineer will cost and your fab costs for the material you have if the engineer can get it to hold a decent load.

    Once he approves it then it can be tagged for safe working load and all is good but check your local laws just in case.

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    "Maybe" do as much math as you can and go heavy "overkill" on everything.

    When in doubt make it stronger and heavier.

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    I'm sorry, but I'm not paying an engineer. My brother is a mechanical engineer anyways. I know how to calculate loads, build things, and test things. The only difference between me and an engineer is they have BS. It's a thought that might be built. This would be built by guys that have had a career building suspended catwalks, as well as hand forged archways and railings and gates.

    I see a lot of I beam cranes, and I realise that's for a reason. Maybe a trade could happen, or another project. Maybe trusses could work. If they're too light, then we could build them stronger. I looked at the Whiting Crane Handbook, and there's a lot of good info in there. This would be more for efficiency than lifting hugely heavy things. Think a large bar in a forge easily taken out and moved to the anvil or triphammer. Or just holding something in position for welding. Or not waiting for someone to move something around the shop.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Street View Post
    I think he pulled that one out of you know where they are called trusses there are several designs out there here is one.

    Warren Truss | Garrett's Bridges

    The crane will have to be designed by a engineer who calculates the loads and most likely puts it into a program for analysis and its quicker to do it that way.
    So investigate what a engineer will cost and your fab costs for the material you have if the engineer can get it to hold a decent load.

    Once he approves it then it can be tagged for safe working load and all is good but check your local laws just in case.
    Lattice Girder is the popular term for these trusses.

    I built a pretty good size building from scratch and researched truss design extensively. How you construct them is largely dependent on how you make the weld connections. The geometric design is pretty basic. Equilateral triangles for the win. When you're building big trusses there are thousands of welds. To do it without turning the truss into a pretzel or having to re-position it 50 times is a big factor in the design.

    If you're building 12' who cares, build it as inefficient as you want. It's only a day or two of your time.

    I figured a week to build 120' of 40" tall lattice girder. Took me a month. But it's dead nuts straight.

    I think the problem with 2" pipe as chords in a crane bridge is you will have to build a lot of extra material into it to get enough lateral stability to be useful. A pretty light I-beam can do it no problem.

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    My first reply was flippant but for a crane as short and low capacity as you’re talking an I beam is the easy way out.

    An efficient beam could be built with pipe with one lower chord, two uppers (triangle point down) and a Warren truss. Then use a V shaped yoke running on upper chords to carry the hoist. Rotate similar beams 90* and you have your runways.

    Metric shit ton of fab work and you’d have to consider localized buckling where trolley wheels ride.

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    A bit like I wanted to put up a single 20x10 carport........needed professional town planning costing $2500,with an extra $600 council planning application fee,then needed a $600 licensed building surveyor to approve it,further council lodgement fee for the approved plans ,all for a carport costing $700......BS gone mad.......so I started with a shade cover,(legal),converted that to a rainproof cover,then put up the carport under the shade cover.Everthing outdoors is monitored by satellite pictures,and inspectors will arrive next day if you just put one up,and issue penalties and a demolition notice....Insanity or extortion?

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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    .Everthing outdoors is monitored by satellite pictures,and inspectors will arrive next day if you just put one up,and issue penalties and a demolition notice....Insanity or extortion?
    Not that I'm paranoid or anything, but THEY'RE EVERYWHERE, THEY'RE WATCHING!!!

    Used to could put up anything anywhere. Now it costs! & even your friends can turn you in!

    Actually some of it (rules) is for the better/safety issues etc. But some of it gets blown out of proportion!

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    You want to become paranoid.....engage the local council with town planning.....local council says......applications from landowners are unlikely to be in the preferred form,we consider engagement of a professional accredited with the council will be essential for the success of any application.

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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    A bit like I wanted to put up a single 20x10 carport........needed professional town planning costing $2500,with an extra $600 council planning application fee,then needed a $600 licensed building surveyor to approve it,further council lodgement fee for the approved plans ,all for a carport costing $700......BS gone mad.......so I started with a shade cover,(legal),converted that to a rainproof cover,then put up the carport under the shade cover.Everthing outdoors is monitored by satellite pictures,and inspectors will arrive next day if you just put one up,and issue penalties and a demolition notice....Insanity or extortion?
    Ok, so this is inside. I'm not sure how inspectors would know its in there. This is out in the country. You'd have to have someone that would see it being built and insist the town inspector comes over. This is possible, but a million in one chance.

    You do realize that towns don't have real time satellite imaging, right? Google updates every few years. Local building codes usually don't apply to non permanent buildings. So if you just had a carport that wasn't set into the ground, then you could argue it can be taken down at any time. I've seen this be done. I also used to work for a surveyor, so got to know building inspectors and talk about codes, as well as knowing a little just for the job.

    Your situation sounds like the town wanted money, and just found anything on the books they could use to get it out of you.

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    I'd like to get info on how to build this, not on the legalities of it being built. It seems possible for an overhead crane, but we've been looking at gantries. It would be possible to have a mobile one that could be taken apart. I'm taking the suggestions and we're both trying to come up with a good solution. But it could be a playground too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robbsclassics View Post
    I'd like to get info on how to build this, not on the legalities of it being built. It seems possible for an overhead crane, but we've been looking at gantries. It would be possible to have a mobile one that could be taken apart. I'm taking the suggestions and we're both trying to come up with a good solution. But it could be a playground too.
    Design of Welded Structures will probably get you where you need to go as far as design, then research a weld procedure to execute. 4:1 safety factor minimum, IE <9ksi stress st any point.

    If those terms dont mean anything to you, It's probably best to steer clear.

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    Quote Originally Posted by svs View Post
    Sounds like square peg/round hole issue. Trade the pipe to somebody who had an I beam job fall through.
    PM needs a means for General Milacron to grant battlefield promotion directly from "Hot Rolled" to "Diamond" class.

    Elegant solution. Brilliant, even!

    Carry on!

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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    A bit like I wanted to put up a single 20x10 carport........needed professional town planning costing $2500,with an extra $600 council planning application fee,then needed a $600 licensed building surveyor to approve it,further council lodgement fee for the approved plans ,all for a carport costing $700......BS gone mad.......so I started with a shade cover,(legal),converted that to a rainproof cover,then put up the carport under the shade cover.Everthing outdoors is monitored by satellite pictures,and inspectors will arrive next day if you just put one up,and issue penalties and a demolition notice....Insanity or extortion?
    Same here, Northern Virginia. Possible difference that I (anyone on Earth or in orbit, really) can view many years worth of the rather good and very frequent aerial shots of my own property (or anyone else's property) online.

    We even need a permit for a solar panel, roof OR ground mounted. But not for a skylight. Permit is required for a deck, but not for a gazebo - with a deck under it. No permit required for a gardening/storage type shed so long as 150 SF or under and temporary/portable. They DO rent some HUGE forklifts just down the road, so.. and "Oh, BTW" 150 SF "footprint" or under is OK even if it is two-storeys tall. Not always a good idea in an area subject to air-mass thunderstorms and high winds - often, the odd mini-tornado - once in a while.

    Mind.. State of Wisconsin, cheese an economic mainstay, there WAS, perhaps still IS an ordnance that required restaurants to serve a slice of cheese with any order of apple pie.

    Fortunately, I had first visited Australia in an era when a "fully licensed restaurant" would plunk
    down a sandwich not ordered when you ordered an ignorant beer. And charge for it. Of course. We had been warned not to EAT of it unless we HAD ordered a sandwich. The ones on the guard roster may have been on their fifteenth patron, that day.

    To the good, other regulations long on the books as to how, or how often, a wife was, or was not, meant to be horsewhipped have largely been left unenforced.

    At least since wimmin' adopted the use of aspirin for contraception.

    Meant to clench the aspirin tablet between the knees, and not let go of it, y'see.

    That part at least makes life more interesting. Guess regulations are a tad whimsical, after all?

    Go figure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robbsclassics View Post
    I'd like to get info on how to build this, not on the legalities of it being built. It seems possible for an overhead crane, but we've been looking at gantries. It would be possible to have a mobile one that could be taken apart. I'm taking the suggestions and we're both trying to come up with a good solution. But it could be a playground too.
    No idea if there might be an old-fashioned laundry/drycleaners in your local area, but if so, cast an eye on the rail all the bagged clothing is power-traversed about on.

    Working track was often a thick, rectangular flat bar for roller support, long axis vertical, chain for traverse.

    TOTAL mass of suspended clothing, end-to-end and tightly placed, is decidedly "non-trivial", and these rigs were once installed by the thousands, nationwide. (an Uncle was a drycleaner..)

    They do require proper support and such, but... on-site custom bending so as to follow curves is very easy compared to "I" beam or rounds, either one.

    You DID say "brainstorming"?

    Have you ever heard the term "The MIGHTY Wurlitzer"?

    Pipe organ, y'see.


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    you do not want round "tracks" v-wheels have a hard time with variances on width (no system self leveling like rail track/wheels). mono-rails like dry cleaners do not have the bridge issues.
    you could likely make runway truss out of 2" pipe, bottom flange too. top flange a channel to anchor track onto?

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    One time I bought some scrap stuff at a clearing sale,and included was some German made overhead crane "track",sort of like a oval pipe with a slot cut along the bottom,with the trolley running inside......Must have been expensive ,cause the guy who bought the crane hoist reckoned he owned it.......anyhoo ,I ended up with it ,cause at a auction,you never show weakness,but I have never done anything with it either. ....Think the I beam gantry came with it too......probably 6x6 universal beam......one of those swing around a post type of things.......point of this rant ,is you dont need I beam to run a girder monkey along,the rest of the frame could have been tube.


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