Shipping Accident with Fadal VMC20

robstah · Jan 19, 2015

Hey guys. My, what was mint condition, VMC20 showed up at the riggers this past Saturday. Today, I had the shipping company send me pictures of what looks like the machine tipping over on its side. I need to file a claim and need some advice on where to go from here. I've been told by a couple of service techs that the sheet metal might be impossible to find and replacing it might end up with the machine leaking. They say that the actual machine might be fine, and getting it checked out wouldn't be a bad idea. I'm just curious what someone would do in this situation, since it's my first CNC and I don't want the damage killing the value. Thanks!

Here's the link to the pictures:

VMC20 Shipping Issue - Imgur

broke · Jan 19, 2015

Send it back. I hope you didnt sign for it. You paid for a machine, not a machine that fell over.

moonlight machine · Jan 19, 2015

Send it back. The moron that chained it down needs dope slapped. I hope the trucking co has insurance.

robstah · Jan 19, 2015

yoke said:
Send it back. I hope you didnt sign for it. You paid for a machine, not a machine that fell over.

It's currently at rigging as we speak. The machine is used and a value of 10k set on it. It wasn't the seller's fault at all and the shipping company sent me a claims sheet to fill out. I'd prefer not to have the sheet metal smashed in at all, but where am I going to find another VMC20 like this one? This one apparently is upgraded, has a -5 CPU, new Baldor spindle drive, and a bunch of other goodies. Size and power wise, it's perfect for my garage (a little more travel would be nice, but gotta start somewhere) and the VMC20 is box way, which is way more rigid than the VMC15s floating around.

Jeremy · Jan 19, 2015

All sorts of possibly hidden pitfalls there. Why start off with a machine that is now suspect?

Sad...was a nice looking machine.

yardbird · Jan 19, 2015

WOW!! You could have years of headaches with this thing, it may never be right again. Sucks but you don't want this one...

Brent

robstah · Jan 19, 2015

Jeremy said:
All sorts of possibly hidden pitfalls there. Why start off with a machine that is now suspect?

Sad...was a nice looking machine.

It looked like an incredible machine and well taken care of by the previous owner/seller, who rebuilds Fadals. I have him in the loop on the matter as well and he doesn't seem too happy about it either.

I don't know how "sending it back" is going to accomplish anything at this point, unless it were to go back and get fully refurbished at this point. I have zero knowledge of the current condition of the table, head, drives, and electronics either. Apparently the rigging place is in mid move and doesn't have the ability to power the machine to get it checked out.

broke · Jan 19, 2015

Could the machine be scrapped so you get your money back and the seller is compensated? The rigger is the one who should be footing the bill. If you accept that machine you are accepting all of the issues that their negligence has created.

Jeremy · Jan 19, 2015

"Sending it back" implies you getting a full refund and buying a completely different machine, and starting out on the right foot instead of with a basket-o-potential-problems.

robstah · Jan 19, 2015

yoke said:
Could the machine be scrapped so you get your money back and the seller is compensated? The rigger is the one who should be footing the bill. If you accept that machine you are accepting all of the issues that their negligence has created.

The seller is already paid in full at this point.

My problem is finding a replacement. Like I said, its got what I could only consider about 8k worth of replacements and control upgrades in it.

Speedie · Jan 19, 2015

It depends on who took care of shipping. If it was you then your stuck with a claim. If not then the seller is stuck with you. The trucker obviously did not know how to strap that machine down and ran the chains down the sides AND didn't put the machine on with any 4x4s. If it were my trailer I wouldn't allow that machine to be put on a flat deck without dunnage. I would be asking the rigger on the other end for their insurance, the truck driver and the company you or the reseller insured the freight with.

It could be a total loss. You may be able to go after the driver, rigger and also get the freight insurance. Freight insurance may subjugate the loss with the driver in court. Or the rigger.

Speedie · Jan 19, 2015

robstah said:
The seller is already paid in full at this point.

My problem is finding a replacement. Like I said, its got what I could only consider about 8k worth of replacements and control upgrades in it.

Maybe you could buy it back from the insurance for $3K

allloutmx · Jan 19, 2015

The images of the professionals standing on the back of the rig looking at the machine.... priceless. Thank you for sharing and sorry about your situation. Hope it all works out for you

Zahnrad Kopf · Jan 19, 2015

Woo. Uh oh. My sincere condolences. I hope that you might find something of value in this - http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...-insurance-company-destroying-machine-246333/ Hopefully it is not too little, too late. I always hope that someone will read these before they purchase and ship. If only I had! Good luck. Hopefully, you can find a replacement and they'll be cool enough to allow you to yank the control and goodies off the old one.

EDIT - Just saw the pics. Your pics look a LOT like my own did. If nothing was moved before pics, then it appears very obvious that it was never really rigged properly. On the flip side, it really doesn't look all that bad. You might just get off easy, here. Do keep us informed.

gbent · Jan 19, 2015

Thats bad. I'm sorry for the hassles you are going to have.

Based on what I see there, I doubt if the machine was hurt in the roll forward. However, it may have been hurt seriously when they set it back upright, as I'm guessing they just put a fork under the front and tipped it backward. Looking at the base, that machine looks like a pita to handle. What does the book say about proper lifting and rigging?

That machine was cross chained. It didn't work out very well. The trouble is inertia works through the center of mass, and there were no chains acting anywhere close to through the center of mass. The chains just tripped the load so it would tip over.

Speedie · Jan 19, 2015

Book says to use bars through the HUGE SQUARE SLOTS running through the casting

motion guru · Jan 19, 2015

Reminds me of the "cross chained" "DOT approved" bla bla bla BS post we had a few weeks back.

Confident incompetence is to be feared.

Milacron · Jan 19, 2015

It's hard to say without seeing it in real life but if on air ride trailer, my impression is that it could be ok with some sheet metal straightening. Photos of it upright in rigger warehouse would be more enlightening. I tipped over a Makino FNC60 VMC once in similar fashion, and it didn't hurt anything. But then it didn't ride down the road in that situation....

robstah · Jan 19, 2015

Well, it looks like rigging signed for it and didn't mention damage on the bill of laden. Looks like I might be in for a bumpy ride.

david n · Jan 19, 2015

robstah said:
Well, it looks like rigging signed for it and didn't mention damage on the bill of laden. Looks like I might be in for a bumpy ride.

Well that sucks right thar......................

Shipping Accident with Fadal VMC20

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