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Value of Mazak schematics?

dbreeze

Plastic
Joined
Jan 24, 2019
Location
WNC, USA
I'm hoping to get an idea of what reverse engineered schematics might be worth out there. I've done several for my own use in troubleshooting Mazak drives/controls, mainly the SF-PW/SE-PW power supplies for FR-SF/FR-SE drives, and some other stuff. I'm currently working on the TR-23D control board for the TRA series of drives.
I'm using the GEDA schematic editor( gEDA Project's Homepage ) and would likely send paper prints of my work. If the digital files ever get out in the wild it would be game over I suspect. I'm no great expert at this yet, but I do use these myself as a bench tech for Scott Pruett of MSB Machine Tool Repair here in Swannanoa NC.

Give me some advice/feedback fellers, is this something any of you might be interested in?
 
I'm hoping to get an idea of what reverse engineered schematics might be worth out there. I've done several for my own use in troubleshooting Mazak drives/controls, mainly the SF-PW/SE-PW power supplies for FR-SF/FR-SE drives, and some other stuff. I'm currently working on the TR-23D control board for the TRA series of drives.
I'm using the GEDA schematic editor( gEDA Project's Homepage ) and would likely send paper prints of my work. If the digital files ever get out in the wild it would be game over I suspect. I'm no great expert at this yet, but I do use these myself as a bench tech for Scott Pruett of MSB Machine Tool Repair here in Swannanoa NC.

Give me some advice/feedback fellers, is this something any of you might be interested in?

what you gonna do about those custom made PCB modules covered with black compound? Nobody knows what is inside them, unless you have a leak from Mitsubishi development group.

Best way to approach this madness will be a retrofit, new (cheap)servo motor + new (cheap) servo amplifier + interface adapter ( any PIC controller that can take Mitsubishi data protocol for these 10000000 years old TRA boxes, and convert it into different one) . Here you have new Servo, Servo Amplifier and what you need is a software to talk to NC control. Now, old Mitsubishi is very very slow machine, you dont have to chase speed, just to make sure you send data in and out correctly). Now idea of reverse engineering is transformed into idea of a scrambler , that you connect to communication line and learn how to interface new hardware. And that is more fun then spending hours of tracing PCB tracks ( specially on multi layers PCB board ).

Or better solution is to file a law case against Mitsubishi Corporation, with any powerful Government, to release blue prints for old units that they do not support, will not support, repair or exchange, and put thousandths of customers into dependency of pure luck to buy a replacement on Ebay . IF that is not the case , then I am not a lawyer anymore.

That is far more realistic approach, as it can be ruled out by anti-monopoly law in any given time.
 
I know there are a couple of us that would be interested In all 3 of those if the price is reasonable and they work

What is a reasonable price is my question. What I have done so far works for my troubleshooting work, I can make no more claim to accuracy/completeness than that.
 
Certainly there will be some sealed hybrid modules that will likely remain "black boxes", but I do have access to some hybrid modules that are not sealed such as the DK434 gate drivers used on SE-I01 and some other Mitsubishi PCB's. Unmarked/unknown components are always an issue, but some indication of their function can be gained from their position in the overall circuitry. My work at least shows all connections to these components so Vcc/Gnd/input/output can be determined.

I am not a lawyer, nor do I have any hope of finding the resources needed to take on large corporations, but I agree with the sentiment that they are holding us hostage by denying access to the info needed to properly maintain these old machines.
 
Certainly there will be some sealed hybrid modules that will likely remain "black boxes", but I do have access to some hybrid modules that are not sealed such as the DK434 gate drivers used on SE-I01 and some other Mitsubishi PCB's.

There is a full circuit for DK434 in FR-SE manual. ;)More interesting would be DK456 or BKO-C1877 inner circuit.
 
Certainly there will be some sealed hybrid modules that will likely remain "black boxes", but I do have access to some hybrid modules that are not sealed such as the DK434 gate drivers used on SE-I01 and some other Mitsubishi PCB's. Unmarked/unknown components are always an issue, but some indication of their function can be gained from their position in the overall circuitry. My work at least shows all connections to these components so Vcc/Gnd/input/output can be determined.

I am not a lawyer, nor do I have any hope of finding the resources needed to take on large corporations, but I agree with the sentiment that they are holding us hostage by denying access to the info needed to properly maintain these old machines.

the only way to fight Mitsubishi is not reverse engineering but a civil court. Like BMW in Germany, it leaked its software and everybody is happy, no one is going against it;)
 
the only way to fight Mitsubishi is not reverse engineering but a civil court. Like BMW in Germany, it leaked its software and everybody is happy, no one is going against it;) Mitsubishi people must to be reminded that healthy competition is a way to progress, unlike unhealthy one is a way towards dictatorship .

my message was too short so I write it here
 
There is a full circuit for DK434 in FR-SE manual. ;)More interesting would be DK456 or BKO-C1877 inner circuit.

True, not the best example but it was the first to pop in my head since I just finished a unit that had some reman'd DK434's without the coating. There are methods to get get the coatings off most of these hybrids but you risk removing any part # labels also. It is what it is...

The best schematics I have fairly complete now would be SF-PW's in a couple of variations, SE-PW, QX084, and some PD21 power supplies. I have some others "under construction". I'm just trying to get a feel for whether or not reverse-engineering this stuff would be worth pursuing to keep me and my dog fed... :)
 
You can source the DK434's and DK456's on Ebay --- usually come from Asia...and also the power modules can be purchased new there as well.

The diagrams and schematics would certainly be helpful, but at this point in the age of these older Mazak's, what we need is a plug-and-play retrofit solution for the spindle and servo drives.

MEAU does offer a package to substitute "MDS-" spindle drives for the older FR-SE and FR-SF drives, but are way, way high on their pricing!

And I'm not sure if they have ever offered MDS- retrofits for the original TRA- and MR- servo drives or not...??

ToolCat
 
Circuit Diagram

Hi, I am interested about your drawings. Please email me about it.My email: [email protected]
Thank,

GS

I'm hoping to get an idea of what reverse engineered schematics might be worth out there. I've done several for my own use in troubleshooting Mazak drives/controls, mainly the SF-PW/SE-PW power supplies for FR-SF/FR-SE drives, and some other stuff. I'm currently working on the TR-23D control board for the TRA series of drives.
I'm using the GEDA schematic editor( gEDA Project's Homepage ) and would likely send paper prints of my work. If the digital files ever get out in the wild it would be game over I suspect. I'm no great expert at this yet, but I do use these myself as a bench tech for Scott Pruett of MSB Machine Tool Repair here in Swannanoa NC.

Give me some advice/feedback fellers, is this something any of you might be interested in?
 
Day call me dbreeze. I know this post is old but I would love to get my hands on a schematic for the QX084.Sent you a conversation about it. Please reply. pay pal , venmo , I'll overnight the cash , etc.
 








 
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