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Thread: B&A Precision

  1. #5341
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    Seems like it would be a hassle to climb up on the rack to use the bandsaw!

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    Wheelie
    Are the haas rocket launching swarf screws swapable - can you move it to come out the other side?
    Does this help in any way - free up space?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails capture.jpg  

  4. #5343
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Finsta View Post
    Odd to hear you say that - TH400s are pretty much indestructible if prepped properly (including an SFI case if needed), and there are tons of aftermarket gear sets for them. 2.10 is a really popular option to give a better 1/2 split. Hell, the new hotness right now are second gear leave and 2-speed TH400s.

    Other than being heavy, they really don't have downsides that haven't been fixed by the aftermarket.

    If you really want indestructible, go to a Lenco with a Bruno drive!

    BTW great seeing the workload through the shop on Instagram!
    My comment was more tongue in cheek Mopar/Chevy bantering than it was serious. I know TH400's are decent.
    It is true I am not a Chevy tranny fan. And, I am a huge fan of the TF727 and all its decedents.
    And, I have no clue what is out there aftermarket for Chevy tranny's.
    I do know a guy can easily build a 727 to be just as strong as anything short of a full on ala-cart glide. They are crazy tough.
    All my TH experience comes from 25ish years ago, and a bunch of broke ass farm-boys playing in the mud back in PA.
    There was one constant: Chevy guys were always smoking transmissions. Where Dodge guys almost never had tranny issues. 727's are bomb proof.
    More than once I saw guys with big power 454's and 38" plus boggers spin the drive lugs right out of the case in TH400's.
    That is one of the things I like about the 727. The case supports the pump, sprag, and rear output. That's it.
    If you run a bolt-in sprag, and roller output support (with manual VB). The case is pretty damn tough.
    You will see the occasional servo blow the top of its bore off the case. But, that, and spinning press-in sprags, are really the only case failures you will see.

    I mean, C'mon! 48RE's, which are basically a 727, when built/tuned properly will live reliably behind a 2000lb/ft Cummins for pete's sake!
    Try that with a TH400, LOL

    Machtek7's comment kinda caught me off guard. And, I figured it was just a little ribbing between Chevy/Dodge guys. Which I am cool with
    Last edited by wheelieking71; 01-19-2020 at 02:38 PM.

  5. #5344
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbter View Post
    Wheelie
    Are the haas rocket launching swarf screws swapable - can you move it to come out the other side?
    Does this help in any way - free up space?
    No, the chutes are not reversible. I wish they were!
    And, no, that doesn't really help. And, you blocked the rear man door, LOL.
    I am also not entertaining the idea of moving the coolant station. Because: plumbing, and it is lagged to the floor. It works there.

    The top two VF2's stay put. And, the new VF2 goes right there on the bottom because:
    If you guys remember in the very beginning of this shop, I had a third VF2 sitting there.

    17966703_1550898078277256_8289491725775812884_o.jpg

    Remember. I have to factor the amount of work involved in to this whole project as well.
    I did not move the knife-box, or air-drop when I pulled that VF2 out and parked the big-fat-haas there.
    So, pulling the big-fat-haas, and parking another VF2 there will be very simple.
    As will shuffling the Bro and Lathe. The conduit and wire going to the Bro now will work (I'll need to shorten about 5').
    The lathe will need to be about 15' longer. But, I have enough #6 squirreled away for that.
    The only materials I need to buy will be to come out of the main panel, and wrap around to the new big-fat-haas location (about 100').

    So, I will have basically zero down-time for the two existing VF2's. The new VF2 will be running the day it lands.
    I'll be able to have the Brother going the day after that. And, the big-fat-haas done over the weekend.
    I only have one lathe job right now. And, it will be done before this goes down. So, no rush there.

    On reversing the chip chutes: the conveyor on the Brother IS reversible. And, it is flipped from its current config in that drawing.

    Here is the only pic I have showing the current layout:

    20171219_202519.jpg

    You have to look for the lathe (behind the Bro). In the very beginning, when it was just three VF2's and the lathe, the layout was great.
    Then, came the big-fat-haas. It is where it is because it was easy. It's not a bad spot for it. But, its not great either.
    Then the Brother. It is where it is because, it was the only place I could put it! LOL. And, it is a terrible spot.
    Then there is the pallet rack. All the space to the left of the Brother is basically left wide open so I can get to the rack with Pit-Stop.
    This is a huge waste of valuable space. And, really quite stupid on my part putting the pallet rack there in the first place.
    I have a knack for learning my lessons the hard way! LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidScott View Post
    It looks like a lot of walking to service each machine, how long are your normal cycle times? At least for the VF2s. My shop is 14'x19' so I don't have your problems, no matter what there isn't much walking.
    Well, there are 4 vises in every mill for a reason! LOL
    Typically 15~30 minute cycles. Sometimes longer. Occasionally there is no way around the super quick operation that will keep a guy tied to a machine.
    And, the actual physical location of a machine will sometimes dictate what job goes in it.
    But, for the next 3 or so months at least, the middle VF2 and the new VF2 will have 4'ths in them. And, those cycles are pretty long.

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  8. #5346
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Finsta View Post
    Odd to hear you say that - TH400s are pretty much indestructible if prepped properly (including an SFI case if needed), and there are tons of aftermarket gear sets for them. 2.10 is a really popular option to give a better 1/2 split. Hell, the new hotness right now are second gear leave and 2-speed TH400s.

    Other than being heavy, they really don't have downsides that haven't been fixed by the aftermarket.

    If you really want indestructible, go to a Lenco with a Bruno drive!

    BTW great seeing the workload through the shop on Instagram!
    Put a Cummins in front of a TH400 or a 4L80E (ODTH400). You can shred it's guts out before you leave the driveway if you try. I'm not just a backyard guy talking shit about this. Been there more times than I can count with every dollar you can throw at big name trans builders trying to make them work. They suck at handling torque.

    A Dodge RH or RE variant is not very great when it leaves dodge, but take the time to go through it correctly (firm up shifts) and it will handle absolutely anything you can throw at it. full locked 3-4 shifts with twins and towing. And it will do that for a hundred thousand or more.

    IMO, the best quality of the TH400/4L80E's is parts are dirt cheap and they made a ton of them. Just don't put 600 lb/ft through one of them cuz it won't go through it. It'll end up in the cornflakes and glitter in the pan.

    On shop layout, I made dozens of cad layouts that didn't work. I ended up just moving things again and again and again over a week until I found the magic layout.

    I don't know if you need it or not, but I find a have to have a big open area inside a big door for "flex space" that I can use for whatever then clean it up to bare floor when I'm done. I built a big shop and had like 15' by 15' of open area and I was pretty pissed because it wasn't enough space to do anything. Couldn't even turn the forklift around in it. After that week of tetrissing the machines I was able to get more space around everything and get 30 by 35' wide open area inside my door.

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  10. #5347
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garwood View Post
    Put a Cummins in front of a TH400 or a 4L80E (ODTH400). You can shred it's guts out before you leave the driveway if you try. I'm not just a backyard guy talking shit about this. Been there more times than I can count with every dollar you can throw at big name trans builders trying to make them work. They suck at handling torque.

    A Dodge RH or RE variant is not very great when it leaves dodge, but take the time to go through it correctly (firm up shifts) and it will handle absolutely anything you can throw at it. full locked 3-4 shifts with twins and towing. And it will do that for a hundred thousand or more.

    IMO, the best quality of the TH400/4L80E's is parts are dirt cheap and they made a ton of them. Just don't put 600 lb/ft through one of them cuz it won't go through it. It'll end up in the cornflakes and glitter in the pan.

    On shop layout, I made dozens of cad layouts that didn't work. I ended up just moving things again and again and again over a week until I found the magic layout.

    I don't know if you need it or not, but I find a have to have a big open area inside a big door for "flex space" that I can use for whatever then clean it up to bare floor when I'm done. I built a big shop and had like 15' by 15' of open area and I was pretty pissed because it wasn't enough space to do anything. Couldn't even turn the forklift around in it. After that week of tetrissing the machines I was able to get more space around everything and get 30 by 35' wide open area inside my door.
    That is pretty much what I was saying about TH400's LOL!
    Dodge tranny's get a bad rap. But, if ever there was an un-justified bad-rap? That is it! Like you said, the 48RE is very strong. And, not far removed from a 727.
    I think it is very, very funny, that: Cummins guys all rejoiced when Dodge introduced the 68RFE.
    Now, a few years later, there is a big market for swapping a 48RE in place of the 68RFE! So ironically funny!

    And, yea, there is a "flex space". The area just inside the 12ft wide roll-up (bottom left).
    And, pretty much everything that is not a machine-tool is on casters.

  11. #5348
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    Any reason not to turn the BFH 90 degrees, so the front faces the VF2s and move the tool building station? The pallet station would then be near the Brother loading station and the HAAS controls would all be facing eachother. I don't like the pallet station against the wall and the control facing towards the rear of the shop. Where possible you should combine "keepout" areas among machines to save space; one machine's keepout is occupying another machine's keepout. The proposed BFH location should also reduce your electrical costs because it's closer to the original location.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Perry Harrington View Post
    Any reason not to turn the BFH 90 degrees, so the front faces the VF2s and move the tool building station? The pallet station would then be near the Brother loading station and the HAAS controls would all be facing eachother. I don't like the pallet station against the wall and the control facing towards the rear of the shop. Where possible you should combine "keepout" areas among machines to save space; one machine's keepout is occupying another machine's keepout. The proposed BFH location should also reduce your electrical costs because it's closer to the original location.
    The only reason I don't like that is: After I leave enough room to walk between the BFH control and the VF2 table, the BFH is blocking half the 12' door. That is the main door I use for everything. It is bad enough the pallet rack is going to block over a foot of that entrance. The BFH electrical cabinet would block about 4 feet. I need to have one large open space. And, that is it.

    I'll flip it down there tomorrow morning when I get back out to the shop, and get real dimensions. If it doesn't block the door, it could work. But, if it blocks the door, it is a no go. It would not only be cheaper to run power. It would be way easier! The uni-strut is pretty busy in one spot in particular. And I have not thought of a good solution for that issue yet that wouldn't look hack. In that position, I would totally avoid having to deal with that issue.


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