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Thread: Haimer repair?

  1. #21
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    Sorry about that I thought it might be nice to have all of the repair info in the same place. I deleted it.

    Andy

    Quote Originally Posted by atomarc View Post
    Hey Andy...how about starting your own thread as you have a different brand with a different problem..I was hoping to get help on my question.

    Regarding my question..it's not the broken tip that's the problem and I haven't found any thread that deals with anything more than a dial case adjustment for 'nul' or a procedure to zero the device on it's mounting stub. These are not the issue. Both tasters had their probe broken in a direct downward move which now, when a new probe is installed results in a error of about .002 when taking a reading from either side or front to back. 'Z' reads right on the nose.

    Stuart

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomarc View Post
    I'm going to dredge this thread back up because I have successfully mashed two brand new tasters into my vise in a 'Z' axis crash and now they no longer read accurately...a very expensive screw up for sure.

    I have taken them apart and seen no obvious damage, but have not disassembled the little geared clock mechanism for fear of shit flying all over.

    In a 'Z' axis crash, does anyone know what exactly is knocked out of whack that causes these things to read .002 off. They are over travel protected so it would seem that the dainty guts wouldn't take a hit. When the probe snaps in a lateral over-travel, the movement swings back to zero with vigor but unit seems to survive, so why does a 'Z' crash kill these so easily.

    Anyone taken the movement apart? The Germans call these Haimer 3D Tasters 'consumables' so factory repair is non existent..not cost effective!

    Stuart
    What you need to do is listed in post 14. This will fix your issue you are having in reguards to Z being off .002.

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    Quote Originally Posted by B-Mathews View Post
    What you need to do is listed in post 14. This will fix your issue you are having in reguards to Z being off .002.
    Read my post #19! 'Nul' is easy to adjust, it has been adjusted, Z is not the issue. The issue is the unit doesn't read correctly or accurately in the X or Y axis after a Z crash. Maybe I'm stupid and not seeing something obvious..highly possible.

    Stuart

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomarc View Post
    I'm going to dredge this thread back up because I have successfully mashed two brand new tasters into my vise in a 'Z' axis crash and now they no longer read accurately...a very expensive screw up for sure.
    Stuart, I had the same problem, see above. Rezero using the four tiny grub screws around the clock face. Bruce


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    I don't seem to be explaining my dilemma clearly.

    A brand new (two actually) Haimer Zero Master 3-D sensor was purchased, zero'd dead nuts on the mounting stub then subsequently mashed into the vise on a Z move. Busted the probe and jarred the readout off zero. Reset the zero (nul) using the two small adjusting screws that move the dial up and down. Now...the sensor reads correctly in a Z axis but has a error in X and a different error in Y. I have disassembled it completely and cannot see any bent pin or broken spring or busted gear..or anything weird.

    I hate to shitcan $800 dollars worth of stuff because the Huns are too damn proud to service them or tell a person how to service them after a stupid crash.

    There is something wrong with them but it sure isn't obvious to me.

    Stuart

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    Please show a pic of your problems we will try to help. I have one also.

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    Stuart, apologies, I had not understood the problem: that your 3D-Taster reads correctly in Z but not in X/Y. I have not seen that behaviour in mine. Cheers, Bruce

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    Bruce et al,

    I'm not 100% sure what my problem is. The taster will zero right to the gnats ass and the probe was zero'd dead nuts to the spindle.

    .0014 shy in a X measurement.

    .0008 shy in the Y direction

    .0015 shy in a Z measurement.

    .0004 shy in a Z measurement when both outside edges of a 1-2-3 block are touched off.

    All these measurement are made on accurate 1-2-3 blocks and a Sony DRO on a B-port. Blocks & DRO Verified against each other with a Mitutoyo DTI

    I can't afford to buy a 3rd taster so I'm going to give Haimer in the states a call as I can't believe they cannot calibrate these things...without sending them to the hinterland.

    I have completely disassembled the thing and cannot see anything bent or busted or stuck. If I had a clue which component I should be scrutinizing I would do so.

    Both these units were brand new and suffered Z axis crashes..does this automatically mean they're scrap?

    Maybe someone makes a rubber version of the Haimer..that's what I need.

    Stuart

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    Here are some pictures of a dissected Haimer taster..for what it's worth.

    Stuart

    image1.jpgimage2.jpgimage3.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomarc View Post
    Bruce et al,

    I'm not 100% sure what my problem is. The taster will zero right to the gnats ass and the probe was zero'd dead nuts to the spindle.

    .0014 shy in a X measurement.

    .0008 shy in the Y direction

    .0015 shy in a Z measurement.

    .0004 shy in a Z measurement when both outside edges of a 1-2-3 block are touched off.

    All these measurement are made on accurate 1-2-3 blocks and a Sony DRO on a B-port. Blocks & DRO Verified against each other with a Mitutoyo DTI

    I can't afford to buy a 3rd taster so I'm going to give Haimer in the states a call as I can't believe they cannot calibrate these things...without sending them to the hinterland.

    I have completely disassembled the thing and cannot see anything bent or busted or stuck. If I had a clue which component I should be scrutinizing I would do so.

    Both these units were brand new and suffered Z axis crashes..does this automatically mean they're scrap?

    Maybe someone makes a rubber version of the Haimer..that's what I need.

    Stuart
    I had the same thing happen. You can move zero by rotating the face on the indicator. So first adjust runout with the new tip, then you should be able to dial in x & y with gauge blocks or whatever using a combination of the 4 grub screws around the indicator and the dial.
    In theory I think this shouldn't be necessary if there's no runout at the tip (should deflect the same in any direction) so it must be damaged, but it still gets the job done.



    Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomarc View Post
    Here are some pictures of a dissected Haimer taster..for what it's worth.

    Stuart
    Your pictures are tiny (280 pixels square). Can you post higher res ones?

    I haven't been inside one of those compact type ones but I assume the mechanism is similar. They are sensitive to friction between the moving elements and are prone to stick-slip that affects accuracy if the surface lubrication is not exactly right. Getting it exactly right however is not simple. I don't know what kind of lubrication they have from the factory. Clean everything with no-residue solvent, then coat the sliding surfaces with a very fine film of white/silicon grease, and see if the situation is improved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fry View Post
    I had the same thing happen. You can move zero by rotating the face on the indicator. So first adjust runout with the new tip, then you should be able to dial in x & y with gauge blocks or whatever using a combination of the 4 grub screws around the indicator and the dial.
    In theory I think this shouldn't be necessary if there's no runout at the tip (should deflect the same in any direction) so it must be damaged, but it still gets the job done.



    Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk
    I wrote the same thing last night but then second guessed myself on if this would work. I am 99% sure that this is exactly what is needed. I don't think anything is damaged inside of the Haimer. There is a guy on Youtube who drove the whole probe be deep into an aluminum block and his just needed adjustment to correct his new error.

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    Quote Originally Posted by B-Mathews View Post
    I wrote the same thing last night but then second guessed myself on if this would work. I am 99% sure that this is exactly what is needed. I don't think anything is damaged inside of the Haimer. There is a guy on Youtube who drove the whole probe be deep into an aluminum block and his just needed adjustment to correct his new error.
    The adjustment of the indicator is global - it cannot affect error in individual axis, only if the error is uniform in all three axis'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gregormarwick View Post
    The adjustment of the indicator is global - it cannot affect error in individual axis, only if the error is uniform in all three axis'.
    Very succinct..exactly the root of my quandary. It seems like any damage to the mechanism should result the same error in any axis measured, but my readings don't support that idea.

    Yes, the pictures I posted are too small. I will retake them and post again.

    Stuart

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    Quote Originally Posted by gregormarwick View Post
    The adjustment of the indicator is global - it cannot affect error in individual axis, only if the error is uniform in all three axis'.
    Yeah, the error should be uniform. I think the sensitivity to lubrication mentioned earlier might be the issue there, now that I think about it I recall getting better results after reassembly with a thin coating of light spindle oil. X axis zero is still .01mm past Y zero but I manage.

    Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

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    Well, I dropped my brand-new-never-used Haimer last night when accidentally turning the collet nut looser instead of tighter the first time I used it. Broke a tip and it went to the floor off the Bridgeport table. Other than a pretty good scar on the side it seems to be reading just fine but now I'm not sure I'll ever trust it without sending it in for a checkup. I think I'm leaving it in the CAT 40 holder from now on and using the $13 Mitutoyo edge finder for the manual mill since I drop an end mill on my vise at least twice a month turning that nut the wrong way.

    I also ordered that Saunders Machine "It has been... days since I broke a Haimer tip" sticker for the new VMC along with another spare tip.

    Not as bad of a feeling as my first silencer getting a baffle strike the sixth round down the barrel. At least these you don't need to wait a year on paperwork to replace it! It's just money, right?!

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    Hi to All ,
    Because Haimer very wants to get ower money why don't we help one other member?
    there are my picture of the haimer zero masters tool that i fix with the help of yours.
    hope that help someone!

    Haimer zero master - Google Photos

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    What happens usually in a z axis crash is that the gears attached to the pointers jump out of alignment. This is very similar to what happens in a dial type caliper when you roll over a piece of swarf on the rack gear. You need to back off the grub screws that shift the indicator itself in the black housing. Mine only have two one at top and one at bottom on the left hand side as you look at the face of the taster, others may have 4, and take the brass indicator out of the black housing, tip it over and remove the 4 slotted screws to get the back off of the indicator. An extremely narrow slotted bit will be required. Mine came from Menards..Masterforce brand. Nothing is going to jump out at you. You will see a large pinion gear on each side of a very tiny pinion gear. This small gear is mounted to a very small rack gear. It is this pinion gear that drives the two needle indicators. Use common sense and without tipping the whole assembly upside down, figure out which gear is driving which needle. Usually in a z axis crash the larger of the two needles will not return to zero. Carefully move that pinion gear the direction it needs to go by slightly disengaging it from the rack gear pinion. YOU DO NOT NEED TO GET IT EXACTLY ON ZERO. The final adjustment is made with the afore mentioned grub screws (mine were 2 in number remember on the left hand side top and bottom. You may have 4) these grub screws move the indicator around in itís black housing and finalize the zeroing once you fit it back in that black housing MAKING SURE THAT THE RIGHT ANGLE PROTRUDING PIN IS IN ITS DIVOT.You can than put the 4 socket head screws back into the corners but do not tighten them until making the final zero with the grub screws. A magnifier will help with the small screws. These tasters are not the intricate mechanisms they get you to think they are. Just be patient and not ham handed and THINK! Donít forget to reindicate the probe tip to your spindle. Although you have not fooled with those 4 grub screws it just would not hurt to check it. While Iím on the subject your taster should be mounted in itís own collet chuck and it stays there unless you enjoy reindicating the probe every time you take it out of your mill and put it back in. I forgot to mention at the very beginning that the glass or clear plastic bezel over the dial is held on by a screw at each of the four corners on the front. There is an o ring type gasket that fits in a groove all around the bezel on the inside. When you have your Haimer fixed make sure this o ring is in itís groove when you reinstall the bezel. Also the socket screws are metric both in thread and socket hole. Have the right bits/wrenches before you start and work over a non divided cafeteria tray to prevent loss in a clean environment with good lighting. You can do it.
    Last edited by Hurco1; 01-24-2019 at 09:37 PM. Reason: Forgot to mention

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    Quote Originally Posted by snowshooze View Post
    I have THREE of them. ( Plus the one I killed... )Two big un's and one little 'un. Do not buy the electronic, you actually lose resolution.
    I haven't had a single problem dialing them in.. just toss my Starrett .0001" indicator at mid-level on the ball and work the set-screws against each other until the needle stops. 1 axis at a time.
    I love these things. My edge finder still comes out... once in a long while....
    I was thinking of getting a second one and thought it may be the digital. Would like to know more about your dislike?

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    Quote Originally Posted by atomarc View Post
    I don't seem to be explaining my dilemma clearly.

    A brand new (two actually) Haimer Zero Master 3-D sensor was purchased, zero'd dead nuts on the mounting stub then subsequently mashed into the vise on a Z move. Busted the probe and jarred the readout off zero. Reset the zero (nul) using the two small adjusting screws that move the dial up and down. Now...the sensor reads correctly in a Z axis but has a error in X and a different error in Y. I have disassembled it completely and cannot see any bent pin or broken spring or busted gear..or anything weird.

    I hate to shitcan $800 dollars worth of stuff because the Huns are too damn proud to service them or tell a person how to service them after a stupid crash.

    There is something wrong with them but it sure isn't obvious to me.

    Stuart
    Hi Stuart, I recently had a Z crash and went for the "DIY Haimer tip solution" (YouTube) using mechanical pencil leads and a 3D printed part.

    What's odd, is that I get accurate X and Y measurements (calibrated using a 1-2-3 block), but the Z axis got shortened by about 2mm. If X and Y are correct, shouldn't Z be implicitly calibrated ? BTW, the dial returns to 0 with no issues.

    I'm waiting for the Haimer replacement tip to re-measure the offset and check again.


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