Opinion on Tesa CMM-s
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  1. #1
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    Default Opinion on Tesa CMM-s

    Guys, I'd like to ask your opinion on the smaller Tesa CMM-s.
    I would very much like to get a small machine. Tough it isn't essential for my operation, it would help out a great deal on speeding up measurements on PITA parts, and - depending on the model - may allow me a 100% automatic inspection on many others.
    I was first looking at the arm-type units. They do have their benefits, but they also come with their own handicaps and now have abondaned that idea.
    Tesa has 2 other models in the small frame gantry CMM-s. One is a manual with manual fine adjustment. No software required or available other than the control panel. Price is very reasonable. BUT! I'm not sure about the accuracy and repeatability with all manual actuation. Also, due to the manual nature it does not have the programmability other than the sequence prompting the user for the individual points. IOW, it would not exactly speed up 100% inspection.

    The last one is the programmable DCC unit. Motorized and fully programmable, comes with the PC-DMIS software and have the optional solid model package available. Price is nearly a 10K jump, but it could/would serve all of my needs.

    Question is: How do the Tesa's compare agains the much bigger and even bigger wallet type units?


    P.S. I did not have the time to check out Mitutoyo at Eastec, so don't know about their accuracy or price. There was also another vendor, Hermel ( Me thinks) with a small fully motorized unit, sporting an under 20K pricetag. If anyone has any info on them and willing to chime in, I'd appreciate it.

    Thanks

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    I bought the Tesa star Cmm. It was in my price range and I prefer the Brown and Sharpe style of cmm. I spent the money on the indexable probe and the fine adjust.

    I don't have much time on it. The jack ass who had tons of work for me to do bailed after I became able to check the parts.

    The biggest selling point is the ease of use. With a little play time you should be able to do most anything. I'm used to the old BS Microval. One neat thing about them, is that once your part is aligned you just go nuts measuring lines, circles or whatever. Then when your done, you cursor to what ever feature you want the info for. I tried it on a part that I do with over 30 holes. I think its much quicker to measure all of the holes, then cursor up and down to see dimensions to check.

    The thing I don't like about the fine adjust is that the air flow is always on. This is how it allows you to fine adjust with the axis' clamped. The actuall clamping is a small pneumatic clamp that pinches your adjustment handle. They do sell shut off setups that will plug in. Then in the control you tell it to shut off the air after a specified amount of time. I added a small electic air valve to my set up. I have a switch right next to my control box that allows me to turn on/off the air supply. Sapposedly after you buy one with out the fine adjust, they say they can't add it later. I think its a line of crap, but from the old microval days I thought it was a must have.

    I'm by no means an expert with it yet. I use it so much that I had a custom cover made for it to keep the dust down. I've had it up and running since last December and I'm guessing I have less than 10 hours on it.

    Hope this helps, any questions just ask
    Rosie

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    Rosie

    Thanks.
    How do you find the accuracy and repeatability on them with all manual vs. micro adjust?
    I'd like bores to measureable within .0005, anything tighter I'll just use boregages. I'd also like flatness, parallel and positional measurements within that range if possible, but repeatability should be less than that, say somewhere .0002 or so for successive measurements of the same part.

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    We bought a re-furbished Tesa 343. The smaller brother of this
    http://www.q-c-t.demon.co.uk/tesa-m454.html

    We have it on a mezz floor upstairs, so the beauty with it is it's light (being ally frame).
    It's early 1990 vintage, but being manual they don't wear. A used cnc will not be anywhere near as good condition, purely because it's moving way faster for it's life.
    We didn't go for an adjustable probe, just a renishaw tp20 module with a selection of plain straight + star probes.
    To date, it's done us really proud.
    We looked at mitutoyo and it was long winded compared to the QCT software.
    DMIS is also (in my opinion) very involved, and if you want to just make parts and use the cmm as a tool when you need to (and not be a full time inspector), then simple is best.
    The QCT is so intuitive, and you can jump on the machine with weeks in-between, and still remember how to use it.

    As for the tolerances you want to check to, obviously in a temperature controlled environment then?
    I'm forever amazed at what ours reads:- If we're chasing tight bores, I'll double check with a known calibrated ring gauge, and the CMM will always read to within 5 microns. And we're not temperature controlled.
    For tight bores, get yourself a set of Diatest gauges. They're dirt cheap now becuase no-one wants them, but you can see the shape of a hole with these. We bought 4 sets from .02>.825, all for a total of around $1000.
    Money really well spent.

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    Barbter, thanks.

    I'm pretty much all set with boregages with Sunnen and Mitutoyo up-to 4.5"
    I did consider the PC-DMIS as a possible handicap for quickie measurements, but on the other side it does things that may worth the extra cash.
    5 Microns is pretty darn good for a manual machine, at least for my needs.
    I did not see the star probes as an option on the current models, but I consider the rotateable probe as a must since it does not require recalibration.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SeymourDumore View Post
    I did not see the star probes as an option on the current models, but I consider the rotateable probe as a must since it does not require recalibration.
    I've worked with the Micro-Hite 3D quite a bit.
    Every Tesa Micro Hite 3D with non-indexable probe I've seen came with the star probe configuration.
    The indexable probe moves in 15 degree increments both rotationally and in angle. The specs say that probe is actually more repeatable than the non-indexable.
    The Reflex software allows you to store up to nine probe positions and call them up as needed. They would have to be pre-qualified for each position beforehand which isn't too bad as long as you keep things consistant (probe #1 straight down, #2 towards you, #3 to the right, 4 to the back...)

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    Peddler

    I'm just looking at the catalogue. They list only 2 probes.
    The basic head is the Thesastar, which is a swiveling head that can be set to any angle manually, but does require recalbration after each movement. It is a single point probe.
    The other is the Tesastar-i, which is a swiveling head, adjustable in 15deg increments. It requires no re-calibration.
    The price diff. is 3K, and seems like a worthwile investment.

    In this catalog, I have not seen the star probe. I'm guessing by "star" you mean the 5 tip type probes found on many other units.

    There is a third one, which is fully motorized with over 5000 discrete positions, but that is not an optional head, it comes as a separate model of CMM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SeymourDumore View Post
    the Tesastar-i, which is a swiveling head, adjustable in 15deg increments. It requires no re-calibration.
    You are correct about the Tesa-Star I, just as long as it has been calibrated for each position beforehand. There are little windows on it that show the angle and rotation you're on. If you qualified and stored a particular probe position, it can be stored in any of nine locations in the software and called up when needed. The Tesa-Star I does not know where it is in space nor does it assume tip sizes.

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    SeymourDumore

    Sorry for the delay, I normally don't come to this forum much. I replied to your questions below.

    "How do you find the accuracy and repeatability on them with all manual vs. micro adjust?"
    -I don't have an answer for you. I haven't used it enough to give a confident answer. I only use the micro adjust when I try to touch a small area. Kind of like the old operation game. There is nothing more irritating than hearing the beep of your cmm too early or late. So for tight spaces I feel the micro adjust is a must.


    "I'd like bores to measureable within .0005, anything tighter I'll just use boregages. I'd also like flatness, parallel and positional measurements within that range if possible, but repeatability should be less than that, say somewhere .0002 or so for successive measurements of the same part."
    -I don't know if I've ever trusted a cmm on flatness, parallel, or perpendicularity. I don't know if I could trust for size under .001 . As to measuring the same part with out realigning the part, It is very close to the same measurment. 2 to 3 tenths sounds about right. If your realign your part it will have more of a variation. I realize it shouldn't, but like I said I don't have a lot of time using it yet.

    again sorry for the delay. If you're looking for the "affordable cmm" I think the tesa is a good choice.

    Rosie

  10. #10
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    Seymour,

    Did you end up with one of the Tesa units?

    Did you look at the One also?

    If so, how did it compare price wise?

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    Arb

    Nope, I didn't get a CMM....
    I figured if I could spend 40K for something, might as well spend 5x that...
    So, I've got a Mori NL2000SY instead.

    Actually the CMM is still in the plan, but the deal on the Mori at the time was such that I could not let it go.

  12. #12
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    Ok.

    Cool new wheels you got instead.


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