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Another 10ee issue

Grandquads

Plastic
Joined
Dec 31, 2019
Newbie on this forum please excuse me for that!! I have a 1956 10ee that I’ve been running on a homemade rotary phase converter (220) for about 10 yrs now with very very little issues until I had a friend helping me and I didn’t tell him to make sure power was off to lathe when not in use. The supply power was on steady for about a week and now my lathe will start but no power or speed past about 50 rpm in any setting (open belt) it’s jumpy and growling when I open the end door (tube area) I have the 2 c16j tubes and only one is lighting up ( the right or closest to rear) and flickering when both were smooth before. I swapped tubes from left to right and still same side lights and flickers. I have cleaned all contacts ( had a spider get smashed in one before causing issue) still no luck the lathe even at the low spindle speed it has no power I can lay a hammer handle against the smooth part of chuck with light pressure and stop it I’ve checked voltage and ohmed most wires from relays and contacts to end point ( mouse chewed wires before) and all seems ok
This is about as far as my troubleshooting can take me with what I know about this style of lathe
I do NOT wish to convert it as I feel this is something simple I’m ignorant about and possibly caused by line voltage on too long. Thanks in advance for any advice and when I figure out how to send pics bids I will
 
I should’ve put in my phase converter does have a wild leg (about 205-215 volts that has been on leg 2 of machine )
leg 1 125-130
leg 2 205-215
leg 3 125-130
 
I understand that but my pump and few other additions are three phase. Either way it worked fine for 10 yrs on this setup so I have a hard time thinking that’s the cause
 
Just the pump and a grinder attachment both are true three phase. I have 125v on legs 1-3 the same you would hook single phase to power without a converter. Leg no. 2 just runs to the accy’s Having it running off the converter is also an easy reminder to turn it off after use
 
Btw thank you all for the replies so far and I look forward to many more with hopes of figuring out what’s wrong. Thanks again
 
There is a LOT of info on these machines in old posts, have you tried searching for troubleshooting tips? Sometime an internet search using site = PM will come up with better results than the search here, try that first though. Someone here makes and sells solid state replacements for the tubes, if yours ends up being bad.
Some guys put the RPC on a contactor controlled by the shop lights, always gets turned off.
 
I’ve seen those and was a thought along time ago when I had issue with a mouse chewing a wire and it was driving me crazy. I’d prefer to just try to fix it and keep tubes just because it’s worked so long this way also since I swapped tubes and same side still lights with flickering would that rule out tubes? I have tried searching the web but seems everyone that has this issue has an older style with generator motor mine doesn’t have a genny motor I’m not sure the main wiring differences I’ve also read about diodes although I have some huge resistors behind the panel of tubes they all seem to ohm fine and I don’t see any diodes in this machine I’ve changed only because I had them all the small and relay tubes (no luck) I have ordered a manual hopefully with right wiring diagram
 
I have a contactor on my RPC that cuts all power when the RPC is off.

There is a module out test.
With the module out, the motor should run, there will not be any speed control.

Bill
 
There are two timers, one of which shuts off field current after a few minutes. They are poor and prone to failure. If you have been turning off power when you are finished, it wouldn't matter, but if the field current stay on, the whole headstock gets very warm. That appears to have contributed to failure of some of the diodes in the module, so that is where I would look first. The timers are unreliable and ridiculously expensive. I replaced them with modern solid state ones.

Bill
 
The modular 10ee with the black box and diodes was made starting in 1960. Earlier generation (not sure what years) had the thyratrons, but not the spindle modules.
 
9100– my machine is a 1956 manufactured date and I haven’t found any diodes or any black box I will try to upload some pics tonight. I’ve read about the diode failures although I not sure if it applies to this particular machine
 
John- I agree that the modular machines were later than what I have
I am guessing but what you have is a (works in a drawer) not an easy machine to trouble shoot due to all the other tubes which are not easy to sub due to not being readily available.
 
I did have someone that works on guitar tubes amps and restores them tell me to try shorting the ground on the c16j tubes to machine ground to see if they light correctly although be very brief as this can easily over heat the tubes he says this is a quick (redneck) test to see if tubes are good. I tried it and the tube lights brighter than normal and steady and machine runs hard and fast but only on one tube ( the short tested one ) also when I swap to other tube I get same result. Not sure if this means anything or I’m just f-ing up but hey it was something
 








 
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