First job for the 1949 mfg lathe
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  1. #1
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    Default First job for the 1949 mfg lathe

    Wouldn’t you know it, I had a pair of brake drums to turn that were ½” too large to fit the round dial. The 49 mfg lathe has been rebuilt about a month now, while I have been working on the 59 10EE and some automotive projects, so it was a good chance to use it. Also a good chance to see how versatile it is, since I needed to turn between centers and the work needed to fit the space between headstock and turret.

    Worked quite well, here are a couple photos:

    351413eb-0ddf-41fa-9ee0-d4e365c27ed1.jpg


    The live center mounted in the turret works fine because there is a lock bolt for the turret slide.

    d5a657d7-279a-4165-aa13-bcfc381e6ec7.jpg


    7f3ea138-6aec-4159-aeb9-a22a922dfbb6.jpg


    The expansion arbor had the same number of expansion slots as the number of splines in the hub, so it worked out well and the drum was well-supported.

    Next project is to make a fixture to hold the brake shoes for arcing. I have not been able to find an automotive repair shop within 100 mi. That does that work any more.

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    Very nice job on the restoration!

    It looks like the lathe is just a normal square dial 10ee with a turret attached?

    The mfg 10ee's that I have seen for sale in the pas have not had threading.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alcro1998 View Post
    Very nice job on the restoration!

    It looks like the lathe is just a normal square dial 10ee with a turret attached?

    The mfg 10ee's that I have seen for sale in the pas have not had threading.
    This machine did not have threading when I bought it, but Monarch always machined the castings to allow later fitting of the threading components, both inside the headstock and the attachments for gearbox, leadscrew, threading dial, etc. Monarch also designed the turret to fit a lathe wth leadscrew and provided a drawing that showed how to modify the rear cover of the turret apron by boring a pair of holes for the leadscrew to pass through. If you search the forum there are photos of another mfg. lathe equipped with threading that came that way from Monarch. There is a bit more to it than that, but most of the details are in a thread about the lathe.

    1949 Manufacturing Lathe Followed me Home today

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    My 1951 mfg lathes headstock was not fully machined in the headstock for the threading reverse gears, and endtrain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by donie View Post
    My 1951 mfg lathes headstock was not fully machined in the headstock for the threading reverse gears, and endtrain.
    I know you have posted that before Donie. I’ve never seen a headstock that did not have the bore for the countershaft. Could you post some photos?

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    I can, in fact I need to change the oil in the headstock, or more like reduce the the oil in the headstock from it leaking over from the front bearing.
    I suspect my mfg lathe was part of a batch that went to the Hanford US HEW program, the machines had a very rough paint finish like WW2 era machines. Those 1950s machines appear to be made in a hurry for the cold war. The operating features are slick as expected though.
    I do believe I have the most worn, but still running Monarch 10ee out there by the fact .080" plates were added to the compound slot to raise the tool post back to normal height, that was done at Battelle lab Hanford.
    The machine still does outstanding work, along as its not a long cut.
    It still has the spindle magic as so,
    Monarch 10ee lathe work holding demo, 6 jaw chuck - YouTube

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    Moose Motors in Pengrove can arc your shoes if you decide to not do it yourself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan from Oakland View Post
    Moose Motors in Pengrove can arc your shoes if you decide to not do it yourself.
    Dan, thanks for the tip. I heard the same from a restoration shop in Seaside. I called Moose but did not get through to anyone and they have yet to return the call.

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    Coming to this forum is a sickening experience, but here is a look at my old 1951 Monarch 10ee MFG standard lathe,
    Monarch 10ee lathe, a look into the manufacturing models headstock - YouTube

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    Quote Originally Posted by donie View Post
    Coming to this forum is a sickening experience, but here is a look at my old 1951 Monarch 10ee MFG standard lathe,
    Monarch 10ee lathe, a look into the manufacturing models headstock - YouTube
    click bait

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    It's alive! Good job and impressive to see. What do those drums fit?

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOldCar View Post
    It's alive! Good job and impressive to see. What do those drums fit?
    A '59 Porsche 356A.

    After machining the drums I was unable to find a shop within 100mi. that would arc the shoes to match the drums. So, I have a 10EE.

    img_1537.jpg

    img_1534.jpg

    img_1536.jpg

    img_1532.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by rimcanyon View Post
    I know you have posted that before Donie. I’ve never seen a headstock that did not have the bore for the countershaft. Could you post some photos?
    The other poster left the building but the issue of your lathe being bored for the counter shaft could be as simple as the monarch employee going to the stock available and grabbing a casting off the shelf to fill the order.

    I don't know if those castings were bored with a special multi spindle setup for the headstocks. If so it would have been more work to change the setup for a production lathe order.
    Don't know what the production numbers were on how many production lathes were built. I would think fewer
    I know that castings on tractors and truck tranny's and engines are all machined for accessories not used. It would cost more to change a production setup for all the different variety's of options. Donies casting may have been the oddball

    I'm speculating but am going on what I've seen with power transmitting gearboxes.
    You didn't get an answer to your question and the other gentleman is now on vacation. Soooo!
    Ill guess

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    I forgot too say that it sure is nice when you can add an accessory because its pre-bored.
    It allowed added threading to your lathe. Pre bored would be the norm. IMHO

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    Quote Originally Posted by donie View Post
    Coming to this forum is a sickening experience, but here is a look at my old 1951 Monarch 10ee MFG standard lathe,
    Monarch 10ee lathe, a look into the manufacturing models headstock - YouTube
    Donie, thanks for photographing your mfg. lathe. From the looks of it, the fact that it has a cover over the bore for the output shaft for the gearbox means that the headstock was bored and could be converted to threading. That is how mine was.

    Monarch is right, the headstock is not completely machined for threading, i.e. you can install the outputshaft, reverse and idler gear, a new spindle, and the shift fork and rack to engage the shifter, which is 99% of the parts needed to add threading to the headstock. The only operation that was not done on my mfg. headstock was to ream the bore for the shift rod (the splined shaft that moves the shift fork to rev/feed/fwd positions.

    The same is true of the apron. The mfg. lathe apron does not have half nuts, but the only operation required to add half nuts is to finish bore for the shaft.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rimcanyon View Post
    Donie, thanks for photographing your mfg. lathe. From the looks of it, the fact that it has a cover over the bore for the output shaft for the gearbox means that the headstock was bored and could be converted to threading. That is how mine was.

    Monarch is right, the headstock is not completely machined for threading, i.e. you can install the outputshaft, reverse and idler gear, a new spindle, and the shift fork and rack to engage the shifter, which is 99% of the parts needed to add threading to the headstock. The only operation that was not done on my mfg. headstock was to ream the bore for the shift rod (the splined shaft that moves the shift fork to rev/feed/fwd positions.

    The same is true of the apron. The mfg. lathe apron does not have half nuts, but the only operation required to add half nuts is to finish bore for the shaft.
    The front bearings are missing, the rear bearing present but of "uncertain provenance", but I can add an otherwise bare, but splined, "ordinary:" 10EE spindle to the growing care package earmarked for you. (Tachos & Davidson D-600 differential collimator..).


    IF... you actually want to make a project of converting it?

    I even have the gearbox, gears, etc.

    I also have a bare apron casting with "some" of the guts for that as well.
    Both are even cleaned-up, not at all grubby.

    But also LESS whatever various bits, gears, or bearings other PM'ers grabbed from Jeff when he was parting it out.

    There's a salvaged leadscrew and TS end mount around here somewhere as well.

    Upside is I no longer need any of this stuff for my own two Round Dials.

    Downside is all that is off a 1941 Round Dial. I've been going through it pulling some minor parts for another member's Round Dial.

    But I am not he who has a klew how much of it also fits your machine?

    Bill

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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    The front bearings are missing, the rear bearing present but of "uncertain provenance", but I can add an otherwise bare, but splined, "ordinary:" 10EE spindle to the growing care package earmarked for you. (Tachos & Davidson D-600 differential collimator..).


    IF... you actually want to make a project of converting it?

    I even have the gearbox, gears, etc.

    I also have a bare apron casting with "some" of the guts for that as well.
    Both are even cleaned-up, not at all grubby.

    But also LESS whatever various bits, gears, or bearings other PM'ers grabbed from Jeff when he was parting it out.

    There's a salvaged leadscrew and TS end mount around here somewhere as well.

    Upside is I no longer need any of this stuff for my own two Round Dials.

    Downside is all that is off a 1941 Round Dial. I've been going through it pulling some minor parts for another member's Round Dial.

    But I am not he who has a klew how much of it also fits your machine?

    Bill
    Bill, my conversion project(s) are done, at least for now. Best to forward those parts to someone with a need for them. My storage areas are worse than a tripping hazard, so time to stop acquiring parts without a near term potential.

    Thanks for the offer. Still wanting the Davidson of course.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rimcanyon View Post
    Bill, my conversion project(s) are done, at least for now. Best to forward those parts to someone with a need for them. My storage areas are worse than a tripping hazard, so time to stop acquiring parts without a near term potential.
    I'm aready walking ON TOP of parts of my hoard!

    I/you/we need to find a younger generation as caretakers ..lest they bury all this s**t WITH my ashes at sea in a SHALLOW spot ...and screw up magnetic compasses on small craft!



    Thanks for the offer. Still wanting the Davidson of course.
    I'm keeping the other TWO, so I won't miss it. I HOPE you can make two if not three light sources... so I can have one that works properly.

    Plan was LED or at least D-cell(s) for the tiny incandescent lamps (I'll send a few with it..) instead of a trip-over-it wall powered one to run a silly-tiny lamp that only even needs to be powered ON when your eyeball is looking through it.

    Or maybe a camera?

    The buggers are sore AWKWARD to use on a surface plate, rather than on a surveyor's tripod.

    ISTR Rich.. RC99, downunder, DID sort out a way to get a digital camera onto his Hilgar & Watts one?

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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    Plan was LED or at least D-cell(s) for the tiny incandescent lamps (I'll send a few with it..) instead of a trip-over-it wall powered one to run a silly-tiny lamp that only even needs to be powered ON when your eyeball is looking through it.

    Or maybe a camera?

    The buggers are sore AWKWARD to use on a surface plate, rather than on a surveyor's tripod.

    ISTR Rich.. RC99, downunder, DID sort out a way to get a digital camera onto his Hilgar & Watts one?
    For lights, I bought a few of the LED lights sold to mount on valve stems, they were about the right diameter and were cheap and worked ok.

    For tripod, I found a motion picture camera tripod worked better than a surveyor's tripod. It has an elevating mechanism already built in and is designed to support a lot of weight with great stability.

    For use on surface plate, I actually cheated: I put the autocollimator on another surface plate that was adjacent, and adjusted both surface plates horizontal with a precision level.

    A digital camera add on would be nice, I will need to check that out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rimcanyon View Post
    For lights, I bought a few of the LED lights sold to mount on valve stems, they were about the right diameter and were cheap and worked ok.

    For tripod, I found a motion picture camera tripod worked better than a surveyor's tripod. It has an elevating mechanism already built in and is designed to support a lot of weight with great stability.

    For use on surface plate, I actually cheated: I put the autocollimator on another surface plate that was adjacent, and adjusted both surface plates horizontal with a precision level.

    A digital camera add on would be nice, I will need to check that out.
    Light sources that work, and digital camera add-ons are the only way I'm ever going to actually put the two I am keeping with me to actual USE.

    TWO SP, one lathe bed. Right angle collimator setup.

    A stout tripod of the sort a former client once had warehouses full of prior to the "digital camera" age (Salon Films, HKG, for long years rented all of those goods to anyone who made cinema in Asia) would be LOVELY! I had tried a pro "view camera" one, as once used with a big Gundlach, but it wasn't even CLOSE to stout enough for a D600!

    I'll get an email off to you "shortly".


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