Help Finding Apron Parts for Monarch Model 61
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  1. #1
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    Default Help Finding Apron Parts for Monarch Model 61

    I am in the process of reworking a nominal 14" Monarch Model 61 and have found some parts in the apron that I might could make, but I would prefer to buy good used parts. In the Model 61 parts book

    http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2103/18297.pdf

    pages 28-29 these parts called the worm (N35), the driver (N31), the driver plate (N32), the half nut (N17), and the chasing dial worm gear (N113).

    I have attached some pictures for clarity.

    img_20200117_090428.jpg img_20200117_090517.jpg

    img_20200117_091048.jpg img_20200117_091140.jpg

    If you can help, please email me at [email protected]

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    Quote Originally Posted by nt1953 View Post
    I am in the process of reworking a nominal 14" Monarch Model 61 and have found some parts in the apron that I might could make, but I would prefer to buy good used parts. In the Model 61 parts book

    http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2103/18297.pdf

    pages 28-29 these parts called the worm (N35), the driver (N31), the driver plate (N32), the half nut (N17), and the chasing dial worm gear (N113).

    I have attached some pictures for clarity.

    img_20200117_090428.jpg img_20200117_090517.jpg

    img_20200117_091048.jpg img_20200117_091140.jpg

    If you can help, please email me at [email protected]
    Monarch will have all that stuff.

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    Moonlight
    I know that Monarch can make the parts, but I suspect that I can not afford them. I think Keith Rucker bought a bronze/brass worm gear from them over a year ago and spent $500 for it. The driver and half nuts are much more complex, so I suspect they will be too pricey for me. I will get prices from Monarch, but I am pretty sure that if I can't find used ones, I will have to make the parts I need.

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    I think someone was parting out a Model 61, have you tried a forum search for '61 parts' or '61 apron parts' ?
    The search might be fruitless, but maybe you'll get lucky?
    When you talk to Monach about the parts, ask them if any other model lathes used the same parts, in order to widen your search?

    Good luck..

    DualValve

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    Quote Originally Posted by nt1953 View Post
    Moonlight
    I know that Monarch can make the parts, but I suspect that I can not afford them. I think Keith Rucker bought a bronze/brass worm gear from them over a year ago and spent $500 for it. The driver and half nuts are much more complex, so I suspect they will be too pricey for me. I will get prices from Monarch, but I am pretty sure that if I can't find used ones, I will have to make the parts I need.
    Common false economy in that.

    There will be MANY things you cannot easily hire done at all. Monarch Lathe's prices are as competitive as any other skilled Ohio shop, and competitive skills is what Ohio is all about. Why d'you suppose Monarch Machine Tool wasn't the only maker to know that?

    Even if you have the tools, tooling, materials and skill, is diverting from what you CAN do, but Monarch can NOT readily do affordably for you the best allocation of scarce resources - TIME easily as important as money - when THEIR part will be "perfect", first time, every time, and they can assure you of it, effortlessly? It's their Day Job. They are good at it.

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    I can make the parts.

    Monarch can make the parts.

    Big money I am not willing to spend, time I have. I am a retired NASA structural engineer.

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    I just received the worm and worm wheel from monarch for my 16CY and yes, my wallet is significantly lighter. My half nuts look about the same as the OPs. Do they also need to be replaced? sure they don't look like 4TPI ACME but as long as the backlash is constant does it matter?

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    Yes, I will be repairing my half nuts. I will be using a process similar to that seen in this video series:

    YouTube

    My lead screw is 1.25x4 and I will need to build fixtures to bore out the old threads in the half nuts. As you say, the half nuts will continue to work with a lot of backlash. My old South Bend 16" lathe has worn out half nuts also. The biggest observable problems are the tremendous backlash and the fact that the index marks on the threading dial no longer line up with where the nuts actually engage the lead screw. I have learned to account for those problems.

    If your lathe is smaller, you can buy bronze acme nuts from McMaster or Roton or Green Bay Mfg to use to insert into the half nuts after they have been bored out. Unfortunately, their longest nut is 2.5 inches long, and I need more like 3.5-3.75 inches of length.

    When I have rebuilt mine, I could probably do yours if they would fit in the same fixtures.

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    Just out of curiosity, what did your parts cost?

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    Quote Originally Posted by marka12161 View Post
    I just received the worm and worm wheel from monarch for my 16CY and yes, my wallet is significantly lighter. My half nuts look about the same as the OPs. Do they also need to be replaced? sure they don't look like 4TPI ACME but as long as the backlash is constant does it matter?
    Not really. Backlash doesn't even matter at all in 'arf nuts. Only one "working flank set" is ever used at a time. Sufficient remaining strength to not fail is all yah need.

    If need be, "workable" if shorted-lived 'arf nuts can be cast with the leadscrew as mold in soft alloys or even thermosetting or pourable molding plastics.

    Stresses can be easily managed by a careful operator. Our lathes are no longer in 24 hour wartime production.

    Besides.. many of the items once single-pointed out of scarcity or inconvenience can be store-bought, online or local, US or Metric, Acme, etc. be in our hands same week if not same day. Others can be cannibalized or formed with hand-dies or taps run under gentle power.

    Surfacing I'd surely miss. Single point threading? Not really.

    "Unfair advantage" is the HBX-360-BC under the same roof, HERE.

    Threading - US or Metric - when one MUST - doesn't get any better until you go full CNC. Part of why I hauled her home from Dogpatch by the Sea.


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    Quote Originally Posted by nt1953 View Post
    Just out of curiosity, what did your parts cost?
    Probably bad form to post that here, check your PM

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    Quote Originally Posted by marka12161 View Post
    Probably bad form to post that here, check your PM
    It's only a sort of "mile marker" for history anyway.

    Take member Brian Miller's experience. No longer practical for him to post "catalog" prices of his test bars and replacement cross screws and nuts.

    The requests are strung out over long periods of time. The material costs keep going up. Fully-burdened time & taxes increase as well.

    The economy is MOVING again. Gots to quote orders as they arrive, "current market" - same as your own shop if a "revenue' one.

    Next Pilgrim will see a higher price. MOST things, cuppa cawfee, tin of beans, and all, not just Old Iron replacement parts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nt1953 View Post
    ..fit in the same fixtures.
    6-Jaw chuck. Naked. Bronze hex stock. The flat sides will be handy going forward.

    Bore. ID thread. Saw split.

    Braze into place where yah milled the old ones off.

    HALF nuts really are "half" ... of a nut. Arbitrary length.

    Or just a tad less than "half" actually. Engagement/dis-engagement thing... and saw kerfs cooperative as they can be.

    If this link fails, just search ebay for "Monarch half-nuts". This "sold" listing was for a pair for a Monarch 610/612 + + as sold a while back. Bit stouter than the Logan JR HS training wheeler in your linked video.

    Monarch Lathe series 610/612 half nuts | eBay

    At $95, those look to have lots of life left in them.

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    Here’s the parts you need, and factory new. This seller is a member here. Prices are quite good for NOS parts. (Link sends you to all of his listings, but it’s only one page you have to scroll through).
    Takes offers, too!

    https://www.ebay.com/sch/txrx7/m.htm...p2047675.l2562

    No affiliation with the seller...

    I also have used ones in decent shape if interested.

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    Those parts are for model 610 or 612. They look like mine, but are quite a bit bigger.

    I would be interested in good used parts for a model 61

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    Quote Originally Posted by nt1953 View Post
    Those parts are for model 610 or 612. They look like mine, but are quite a bit bigger.

    I would be interested in good used parts for a model 61
    Me dumb!
    Sorry about that...

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    Me dumb too. I had already contacted the seller before I realized they were the wrong parts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nt1953 View Post
    Me dumb too. I had already contacted the seller before I realized they were the wrong parts.
    Could be worse.. take my first marriage...



    Point is, there ARE part-outs "out there" but it takes time to find the right ones and useful.

    Meanwhile.. just HOW bad are your originals? And how MUCH will their wear actually affect the work you plan for the next year or so? For-real, not "all possible needs".

    Might save a lot of time, and no small amount of money, to "run what yah got" until a better set show up, affordably.

    A vintage aircraft needs to meet new spec, each and every "annual".

    Vintage lathes? Not so much - so long as they can still make decent parts.


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