Monarch 20" M raised?
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  1. #1
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    Default Monarch 20" M raised?

    I was looking over this lathe on CL and noticed a couple of things.
    Do all bigger Monarch lathes have the saw tooth rack to help lock the tail stock? I've never noticed that before.
    The lathe also looks like it's raised. I've seen South Bend lathes raised like this but I'm surprised Monarch used that approach. The ad says it has a 15hp motor.That compound looks fragile sitting up on it's throne.

    1938 Monarch 20-M Gearhead Lathe - heavy equipment - by owner - sale
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 00y0y_ezdufejebgoz_0ci0po_1200x900.jpg   00k0k_iem42nlv3xtz_0ci0po_1200x900.jpg   00z0z_dzy9dn9dl6rz_0ci0po_1200x900.jpg   00e0e_4ws2j14ujeoz_0ci0po_1200x900.jpg  

  2. #2
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    Had one but the normal 22 1/2" max. It was even older - with their proprietary flanged spindle nose

    Reed Tool here in Houston had it rebuilt at a cost of $20K in the early seventies and never used it afterwards

    I still have the new half nuts that were never installed. Monarch included this blueprint when they sent the manual during rebuild

    20210303_155623.jpg

    The bronze placards in your post say pre war

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    Yes Monarch raised some in the iron. I imagine when you need the swing but not the heft of a larger lathe. A 31 inch lathe built the way monarch builds things would weigh quite a bit, and if you are just turning large flanges or tubes, there is no point of it being able to hold a 1 ton part

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    Many of the older ( 1950s and older) large swing lathes had the tailstock catches, I believe they were just a safety feature. It's definitely a raised model, but above 20" it gets increasingly common. Raised are definitely not fragile! Those riser blocks are ridiculously heavy. We have an American high duty 40"swing built the same way. True beast of a machine. Runs quieter than our smaller American pacemaker lathes.

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    It has three steady rests and a taper attachment , But price is high for that old lathe. The ways are ground off up by the chuck for clearance but that's not unusual on older large lathes. You are limited to high speed cutting tools also at 400 rpm
    It doesn't look thrashed.
    Price is out of line but its kind of cool . The price may drop after it sits there for a while
    Cool looking old lathe

    Specifications:


    15-HP 3-Phase motor wired 208V.
    5-belt drive system
    Morse Taper #6 tail stock
    16-speeds ranging from 9 RPM to 400 RPM.
    Feed-rates from .0033 to .240 per revolution.
    Standard thread cutting - No metric.
    3-1/2" spindle bore
    D1-6 Camlock spindle mounting system (I think). I'll take measurements upon request.
    Flame Hardened ways.

    Sale includes:

    1. 30" Union MFG 4-Jaw independent chuck in good condition.
    1. Morosky 4-position turret tool holder in good working order.
    1. 18" 3-Jaw self centering chuck - brand unknown.
    1. Friction steady rest with approximately 6" capacity.
    1. Roller steady rest with approximately 9" capacity.
    1. Roller steady rest with 20" capacity.
    1. Working taper attachment.
    1. 30" faceplate - no dogs
    1. Heavy duty tailstock.

    Everything works. Nothing is broke

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    I had a 20 cm years ago that would swing 30.5,the original paper work from monarch called it raised in the sand.

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    Fix error

    Had one but the normal 22 1/2" max.
    It WAS a 22, so 24 1/2 max

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    Quote Originally Posted by boomerang69 View Post
    I had a 20 cm years ago that would swing 30.5,the original paper work from monarch called it raised in the sand.
    Raising the headstock , tool post and headstock is by design going to put more leverage at the base of the raised part.. The headstock is shouldn't be affected much. The tailstock is locked down unless drilling and the length of the base has good support. The toolpost ,compound and carriage may get more wear from more leverage but they are built so heavy.
    I only say this because I often see raised lathes criticized. Myth or fact ?
    I don't have first hand experience. I believe Monarch and American Pacemaker made lathes earlier on with base castings too match the swing then it seems started raising anything between the 20" range up to thirty. Then took a step up in size from there.
    I have a raised American that doesn't appear too have suffered damage from raising it in sand as they say. It still appears very overbuilt.
    The lathes that suffer may have been used for hogging on a production floor.

    Boomerang69
    I know you weren't criticizing Raising in the sand as they say. I guess Monarch started that phrase. Raised in sand.

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    Quote Originally Posted by maynah View Post
    I was looking over this lathe on CL and noticed a couple of things.
    Do all bigger Monarch lathes have the saw tooth rack to help lock the tail stock? I've never noticed that before.
    The lathe also looks like it's raised. I've seen South Bend lathes raised like this but I'm surprised Monarch used that approach. The ad says it has a 15hp motor.That compound looks fragile sitting up on it's throne.

    1938 Monarch 20-M Gearhead Lathe - heavy equipment - by owner - sale
    Yes, Monarch prided itself for only offering "raised in the sand" extra swing lathes. Monarch made some monster raised in the sand Series 90/91 and NN lathes.
    Yes, Models M, CM, N and NN had the saw tooth rack down the center of the bed. The smaller models did not have this feature.

    John L.

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    Not that you really want to do this but a 24" part (2' dia) has pi*d = 6.28 feet of surface-feet for every rev.

    Crank that bad boy up to 400 rpms and if you are brave enough to stand there its 2500sfm and your HSS tool is going to glow red.

    Even a pedestrian 100 rpm is 620 sfm....youd have to get down to 16rpms to get to 100sfm for your HSS tool to live a long happy life.

    Good thing it goes to 9rpm

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    Thanks for the replies, interesting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by matt_isserstedt View Post
    Not that you really want to do this but a 24" part (2' dia) has pi*d = 6.28 feet of surface-feet for every rev.

    Crank that bad boy up to 400 rpms and if you are brave enough to stand there its 2500sfm and your HSS tool is going to glow red.

    Even a pedestrian 100 rpm is 620 sfm....youd have to get down to 16rpms to get to 100sfm for your HSS tool to live a long happy life.

    Good thing it goes to 9rpm
    Matt
    I overlooked the surface speed verses RPM's when stating being limited to high speed tooling at 400 RPM. Not true.
    When I get the American running I'll get a chart or use the formula to figure surface speed. Surface speed is more important too consider than rpm's when diameter gets larger. Good points made in your post.

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