My first ever lathe! - CK 12, I think ?!
Close
Login to Your Account
Results 1 to 19 of 19
  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default My first ever lathe! - CK 12, I think ?!

    Hi All! Well, ive wanted a Lathe for over 20 years, and yesterday was finally the day! A mate of mine that works in machining, managed to get me an old 1943 Monarch lathe for about $500US (Im in Australia)

    Now, please go easy on me guys, I don't really even know the correct terminology for stuff yet, im 'very' new to anything like this, but hoping I can gain some info from you knowledgeable blokes!

    So, as far as I can tell, its CK 12", the plate with the model number on etc, is fairly hard to read...so could be a CY, or CK on there...hard to tell.

    Im assuming they are a fairly capable lathe ?

    img_20200510_151057.jpg
    img_20200510_151148.jpg
    img_20200510_151853.jpg
    img_20200510_152937.jpg
    img_20200510_152928.jpg

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default

    My mate told me he ran it and checked it, the main gearbox seems to be smooth, but the part that does threaded etc didnt seem to engage. And the belts need to be tensioned.

    I decided that before I ran it I wanted to check oils etc, so in the afternoon I took the top of the main gearbox and although the lathe itself looks likes its been feed more than its share of hot suppers, it was reasonably clean inside.

    img_20200510_161644.jpg
    img_20200510_155750.jpg

    Ive read that this old girl needs SAE 30 oil, does that sound correct ? Also, I have no idea where the oil level should be?!?

    There does seem to be workshop manuals available, but only in the US and wont shop to AU. Does anyone know if there might be an online version perhaps ?

    My plan at this point is to simply get it working, and then slowly rebuild it as I get more familiar with it. Imagining this beasty back in its former glory makes me happy!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    New York
    Posts
    550
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    7
    Likes (Received)
    201

    Default

    First things first. If you are new to machine tools, i recommend you study up on safety precautions when operating a lathe and take them very seriously. This machine can easily maim or kill you if you are not careful.

    Machine tools when operating are a bit like fire, beautiful, elegant and useful but get too close and you get burned.

  4. Likes 9100 liked this post
  5. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Michigan
    Posts
    11,629
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3974
    Likes (Received)
    4137

    Default

    Good to brush off everything you can .. pick off any chips ..then begin to wipe it with an oiled rag untill it looks clean..a little mineral spirits in the wipe oil is good..
    Dont wire brush or air blow anything..

    QT:[Im assuming they are a fairly capable lathe ?] one of the best..

    Good to hand roll the chuck to be sure you dont have a locked gear till you get uses to the gears.

  6. Likes Glen_Oz liked this post
  7. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Houston, TX USA
    Posts
    30,858
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I can try emailing the 15Mb manual scan if you want to Private Message me that email address - its but 21 pages, but all Monarch manuals of the period were quite slim. In case not known, this won't teach you anything about RUNNING a lathe.

    This would be more help in that direction

    http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/1617/5795.pdf

    Your photo unmistakably says 12 CK

    I run ISO 68 (Mobil DTE Heavy Medium) in my CW 16 and have for over 20 years - this is some lighter than "30 weight" - and is actually intended for machine tools - unlike "motor oil".

  8. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Kentucky
    Posts
    229
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    15
    Likes (Received)
    49

    Default

    Glad to hear about your find. I'm in the middle of my rebuild 16" CY, very similar. Look at thread, Monarch CY 16 Winter Project. It should answer a great deal of questions.

    Monarch CY 16 Winter Project


    I agree, if you are not experienced with running a metal lathe, please follow marka's advise above and get yourself schooled. This lathe, as with many, will not know the difference between metal or your limbs...

    A good cleaning is in order, make sure your oiling systems are functioning in the headbox and saddle/apron. Again look through my thread and it will explain oiling system, oil pump function, and hopefully more than you need to know.

    Don't hesitate to ask questions here... Alot of great folks!

  9. Likes Glen_Oz liked this post
  10. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Arizona
    Posts
    3,735
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    929
    Likes (Received)
    505

    Default

    You might have a look for manuals on Vintage Machinery (link). There are also dozens of brochures going all the way back into the 1920's, most of which were posted by Keith Rucker.

    Cal

  11. Likes Glen_Oz liked this post
  12. #8
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by marka12161 View Post
    First things first. If you are new to machine tools, i recommend you study up on safety precautions when operating a lathe and take them very seriously. This machine can easily maim or kill you if you are not careful.

    Machine tools when operating are a bit like fire, beautiful, elegant and useful but get too close and you get burned.
    Thanks for the advice, and I hear ya. While its been many years, in New Zealand, they taught lathe work in late high school, and one whole semester was basically machinery safety, with some pretty graphic demonstrations, and its still with me to this day.

  13. #9
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by johnoder View Post
    I can try emailing the 15Mb manual scan if you want to Private Message me that email address - its but 21 pages, but all Monarch manuals of the period were quite slim. In case not known, this won't teach you anything about RUNNING a lathe.

    This would be more help in that direction

    http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/1617/5795.pdf

    Your photo unmistakably says 12 CK

    I run ISO 68 (Mobil DTE Heavy Medium) in my CW 16 and have for over 20 years - this is some lighter than "30 weight" - and is actually intended for machine tools - unlike "motor oil".

    Thanks mate! I would really appreciate the manual if thats ok.

    I did find this one online - http://manuals.chudov.com/Monarch/Mo...N-W-Lathes.pdf

    It wouldnt be the same one ?

    Ill look further into the oil, sounds like SAE 30 might be a bit out dated.

  14. #10
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WillWilly View Post
    Glad to hear about your find. I'm in the middle of my rebuild 16" CY, very similar. Look at thread, Monarch CY 16 Winter Project. It should answer a great deal of questions.

    Monarch CY 16 Winter Project


    I agree, if you are not experienced with running a metal lathe, please follow marka's advise above and get yourself schooled. This lathe, as with many, will not know the difference between metal or your limbs...

    A good cleaning is in order, make sure your oiling systems are functioning in the headbox and saddle/apron. Again look through my thread and it will explain oiling system, oil pump function, and hopefully more than you need to know.

    Don't hesitate to ask questions here... Alot of great folks!

    Thanks! Ill have a good read before I go much further. I have my mate coming around tomorrow to go through a bunch of stuff with me too.
    Last edited by Glen_Oz; 05-12-2020 at 05:08 AM.

  15. #11
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default

    Yesterday, I hooked up the VFD and after putting some oil in the headstock, I ran the lathe real slow. Except for a little belt slap, it ran very smooth, so will have to adjust the tension at some point.

    Today, I wanted to check the apron, after dropping the pump cage off the side, I found zero oil and a reasonable amount of crud in there that I wanted to clean out, I tried just blasting is out with a bit of degreaser, but ultimately decided I would need to split it all, hoped I could just lift the saddle and get in through the top to clean the apron out.

    I must admit, I ran in issues here, I removed the 8 obvious bolts at the top, the adjuster, the dowels and the clamps under the CS, and while the rear saddle is free, its still held in place at the front somehow, is there a trick to getting the saddle lifted ? I could only find 10EE stuff with a search.

    img_20200512_162147.jpg
    img_20200512_162133.jpg

    I also found that the far right 'short' bolts connecting the saddle to the apron had been stripped, is there an accepted fix for something like this ? Helicoils ? What thread is this even ?

    I thought while I was checking things I would have a quick look at the Cross slide gearbox, while this looks like it should be full of oil, it was just packed with a bit of grease, is this common mod ? Maybe they leak too much ?

    img_20200512_181118.jpg

    Hope everyone is keeping safe and enjoying some isolation time with their lathes

  16. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Houston, TX USA
    Posts
    30,858
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    is there a trick to getting the saddle lifted ?
    Does Monarch use "hold downs" under the bridge of the saddle? I know the larger Lodge & Shipleys do - like my past a hundred-year-old 24"

    It wouldn't be the same one ? (manual)
    Pretty much looks like
    Last edited by johnoder; 05-12-2020 at 03:35 PM.

  17. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Tennessee
    Posts
    49
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    10
    Likes (Received)
    14

    Default

    Being only about 9 months ahead of you, here are the toe-holds that I have found most valuable.

    1) Go to Youtube and watch lathe accident videos to instill a healthy respect for the machine.

    2) The Youtube channels Vintage Machinery and Machining 360 both have lots of detailed videos about rebuilding Monarch lathes. Even if they aren't the exact model, many of the details are the same.

    3) There is loads of good info in these forums. I always search google for "<my issues> site:practicalmachinist.com" and rarely do I NOT find the answer. In particular, WillyWilly's thread has saved me an enormous amount of floundering around on my own.

    4) The Youtube channel Blondihacks has a series on basic lathe use that is a very concise introduction if you are like me and starting with zero knowledge.

  18. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Illinois
    Posts
    961
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    155
    Likes (Received)
    139

    Default

    Wow, you got a raised in the sand version with a lot more swing than standard

    John

  19. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    suburbs of Ann Arbor, MI, USA
    Posts
    13,155
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    451
    Likes (Received)
    1080

    Default

    What is up with all of those rods going thru the cross-slide? Is there power to the compound?

    Mine does not look like that!

    I ended up taking a gear out of the end train, was a lot of gear whine and that was simplest I could do at the time.

    The half nut engage (lever with threaded end) also doesn't look like mine, its sort of a cast ball-handle with an offset bend. Was once chromed before its poor storage environment got to it.

  20. #16
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Indiana
    Posts
    22
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    4
    Likes (Received)
    2

    Default

    On mine, a ‘44 CK, in addition to the 8 bolts, the saddle has clamps under the bed, both front and rear that need to be removed. Also there are 2 alignment pins threaded into the front on the extreme left and right that have standard screwdriver slots in them.

  21. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    392
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    60

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by matt_isserstedt View Post
    What is up with all of those rods going thru the cross-slide? Is there power to the compound?

    Mine does not look like that!
    Mine doesn't either. What have you got?

    I'm jealous of the extra swing - looks like you've got 3" more than normal.

    I thought I had the production records for Monarch, but I can't find them if I do. That might tell what options it was built with.

    Also, I'd be wary of cutting the apron loose from the saddle without having the apron supported by something other than the screws.

  22. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Oklahoma City, OK
    Posts
    4,930
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    881
    Likes (Received)
    2060

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by matt_isserstedt View Post
    What is up with all of those rods going thru the cross-slide? Is there power to the compound?

    Mine does not look like that!

    I ended up taking a gear out of the end train, was a lot of gear whine and that was simplest I could do at the time.

    The half nut engage (lever with threaded end) also doesn't look like mine, its sort of a cast ball-handle with an offset bend. Was once chromed before its poor storage environment got to it.
    That was an option, and I believe his has it.

  23. #19
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Indiana
    Posts
    22
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    4
    Likes (Received)
    2

    Default

    Congrats on the CK acquisition. I’m working on overhauling a 1944 CK. Very nice machines!


Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •