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Help Identifying Components in Monarch 10EE Control Panel

Hobby Racer

Aluminum
Joined
Apr 18, 2015
I just acquired a 1942 MG Round Dial 10EE. The previous owner said the DC drive "needed some work", i.e. it does not run. Before I tear into it I need some help identifying some of the components in the control panel so I know what they are called and their function. Then I can compare it to the wiring diagram and begin tracing down everything. I have marked the items of interest in the attached picture.

As you can see the main contactors were removed and more modern magnetic contactors were installed at some point.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

My_Control_Panel.jpg
 
+1 for what Thermite says on the contactors. They need to go pronto.

Forward - reverse pairs with mechanical interlocks built in and all the pesky changeover wiring pre installed can be found fairly easily. I recently got a set for a single phase 2 hp installation that was almost same price as a naked pair from an equivalent quality supplier. Name brand but economy range as that installation is light duty. If it sees 1,000 cycles in my lifetime I shall be surprised.

DC needs a much bigger contactor than AC for same power.

Trace the schematic or rip out and start over. Assuming that a previous worker has done what you would have done or at least the right thing tends to surprises of the sparky and magic smoke kind. Its amazing what folk can come up with when fixing as they go. Then you have the bodgers!

These days I tend to the rip-out or start over with clean paper and modern parts school of thought. Life is getting too short to play hunt the wire, guess the colour.

Clive
 
Here are some close ups of the contactors.

IMG_20220103_152427637.jpg IMG_20220103_152442578.jpg

If they are under sized for the task, what should I be looking for as replacements?

As for the components numbered in the original post, do you need close ups of each of them as well? They appear to be original so I thought they could be easily identified by their shape and position on the control board.
 
... Are you comfortable with generating your OWN "as found" schematic that reflects it as it is NOW?

Not hard. Just TEDIOUS!

Yes, but I would like to know what each component in there now is before starting that journey.

... These days I tend to the rip-out or start over with clean paper and modern parts school of thought. Life is getting too short to play hunt the wire, guess the colour.

I may go down that road if too many of the original components are not serviceable. I assume there are modern equivalents available for all the control panel components, right? I know the speed control rheostats are hard to find, and pricey if you do find them. Mine seem to be in good shape, just need a serious cleaning. I'm going to test those out today.
 
It looks like you have an AC relay. Can be used for DC if highly over rated.
Overloading a relay with DC results in a tendency to weld shut. In the trade
this is known as "bad". ;-)
 
... "Undersized" or a "surprise party" ... depending on your wont for gambling?

Ok, those gotta go.

But "patience" please. Instant gratification dies here. Lethal DC Voltages demand caution and respect.

So before you even go there... let's get a better evaluation as to how healthy the REST of the DC system is ... or is not.

Not in a rush. This is my winter project. Last project was restoring/rebuilding my 1963 J Head Bridgeport. That came out fantastic.

Is yours "inline"? Or "Piggyback". Both might have been shipping, 1941?

Mine is of the Piggyback variety.

And.. are your spindle bearings in decent condition?

Mechanically, the lathe seems in very good shape. The bearings turn smooth with no discernible slop. Ways and all sliding surfaces are in good shape.

Needs a serious cleaning and paint job.

All three motors are getting new bearings, brushes and belts (so long as they test out first).

With everything out and easy to get out I can get started!

attachment.php
 
Suggestion only, ignore if you like banging your head against the wall: find a good used DC control panel from another 10EE. They aren't hard to find, anyone who did a 3-phase VFD conversion probably has one. I have a spare if you can't find one from the usual sources, such as Damien on ebay. It also doesn't matter if it is from a MG machine or a WIAD, all the components are the same, except a few resistors. WIAD and MG controllers are wired differently, but its only an hour's work to convert.
 
Suggestion only, ignore if you like banging your head against the wall: find a good used DC control panel from another 10EE. They aren't hard to find, anyone who did a 3-phase VFD conversion probably has one. I have a spare if you can't find one from the usual sources, such as Damien on ebay. It also doesn't matter if it is from a MG machine or a WIAD, all the components are the same, except a few resistors. WIAD and MG controllers are wired differently, but its only an hour's work to convert.

I am slowly coming to that conclusion :D. I have been looking for properly rated DC contactors and they are hard to find, and when you do they are $$$$. Does "Damien on ebay" refer to a seller name or a manufacturer I should be looking for on ebay?

Lastly, should I post a WTB thread in this forum or the more general Commerce section?
 
Need a DC control panel!

I'm looking for a functional DC control panel. If anyone has one from a drive conversion or a spare they want to part with, please contact me.

I have posted a want to buy thread in the commerce section with contact information.

WTB: DC Control panel for Monarch 10EE

Thanks!
 
There are DC solid state relays available at these power levels.
However they will take a little some extra circuitry to use.
They generally take a DC control signal up to 32 volts. I few diodes,
a capacitor, and a resistor should be all that is needed.
 
I am slowly coming to that conclusion :D. I have been looking for properly rated DC contactors and they are hard to find, and when you do they are $$$$. Does "Damien on ebay" refer to a seller name or a manufacturer I should be looking for on ebay?

Lastly, should I post a WTB thread in this forum or the more general Commerce section?

If you search for 10EE parts on ebay, many of the listings are from seller damienpdr. Damien has a lot of parts not listed, so email him.
 
Try this guy: 10EE motors on Ebay
He's a machinery rebuilder in Ohio. He was reported to have DC panels for sale.

Cal

Good reference Cal. He does in fact have panels and other drive components from doing VFD conversions that he will sell. If someone is looking for assemblies, he is a good source to call.

...
Won't hurt if you can also expand the awareness, to "we" as potential needy, and to "he" as our perhaps being potential customers for his goods.

As mentioned above, a verified source of DC drive components/assemblies. Did not seem to interested in promoting part sales, but he will sell items IF you contact him directly.
 








 
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