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    Default photo posting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by rabler View Post
    If you look closely at the way too small picture (courtesy of this site's resizing algorithm, not my choice), ...
    I bet the photo came from an iPhone. For some reason iPhotos don't play well here. I routinely post photos from my Canon cameras and they come in full screen when the auto-resize does its thing. I've alerted site admin to the problem, but so far, no action has been taken.

    Cal

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    I bet the photo came from an iPhone. For some reason iPhotos don't play well here. I routinely post photos from my Canon cameras and they come in full screen when the auto-resize does its thing. I've alerted site admin to the problem, but so far, no action has been taken.

    Cal
    Dunno if the PM site can DO anything from their end, anyway.

    Take my simple-enough-for-dummies $99 Nikon 100. Until I sorted out how to tell it what resolution was good enuf, it made massive mega-pixel "originals". Even with that dialed back, I still have to transfer to the laptop, "view" the .JPG it saved, adjust, take a screenshot and save as a .png for upload to get under the file size limitations.

    iPhones and "not only" are nowadays capable of higher res and larger file sizes than that inexpensive Nikon.

    That is just to get the file to where "auto-resize" even sees it. And then.. the resize doesn't work the same on all file TYPES. That last part is likely to be the main issue.

    Some members have defaults that "just work", minimal effort.
    Others are wizard at sorting all that to very good effect before the upload, or take the time to delete, and try again after viewing until it is better.

    Others are not so fortunate.

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    It hasn't been necessary to jump through all those hoops for several years. This image is a 12 mega-pixel (4000x3000) .JPG with no post-processing, just the way it came off the SD card in my Cannon camera. It is 3.1Mb in size and directly uploaded with a click of the mouse. PM resized it to 926x762 pixels with a file size of 93kb. I can't produce a better 100kb image than this by manually resizing. Try it if you don't believe me.
    img11271.jpg


    However, iPhotos are different. I've had people send them to me. You can resize them all you like and they still come in at about 320x200. I actually have to save them in another format, then convert back to JPG to get them to upload at a reasonable size.

    Cal

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    It hasn't been necessary to jump through all those hoops for several years. This image is a 12 mega-pixel (4000x3000) .JPG with no post-processing, just the way it came off the SD card in my Cannon camera. It is 3.1Mb in size and directly uploaded with a click of the mouse. PM resized it to 926x762 pixels with a file size of 93kb. I can't produce a better 100kb image than this by manually resizing. Try it if you don't believe me.
    img11271.jpg


    However, iPhotos are different. I've had people send them to me. You can resize them all you like and they still come in at about 320x200. I actually have to save them in another format, then convert back to JPG to get them to upload at a reasonable size.

    Cal
    What I'm trying to tell yah is it is mostly about the end-lusers platform and their defaults. Not about what PM does afterwards.

    Your defaults "JFW".

    My ones need intervention prep for PM, work as-had everywhere else - attachments to SMTP email, mostly.

    iPhoto's I've never had the least need to care about. We have MacBook Pro's in the arsenal, but use F/LOSS software the Nikon's and other NON-Apple handheld's and camera's like, .jpeg, .jpg, .JPG mostly.

    Some several other folks are BOUND to understand that iPhoto issue and have more than one solution. PM is but a tiny patch of places where iPhoto's land.

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    So, have you actually (this decade) tried directly uploading full resolution images from your Nikon, or is this more "wisdom" from the mind of Bill?

    Cal

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    So, have you actually (this decade) tried directly uploading full resolution images from your Nikon, or is this more "wisdom" from the mind of Bill?

    Cal
    My galaxy note nine does ok but my previous IPhone I couldn't get good photos. When I email photos to myself it asks if I want to downsize. I downsize because if I dont it takes forever to download. I dont have a camera.
    This photo is straight from my Galaxy note nine phone .20201230_172430.jpg I agree the ops photos are most likely from an Iphone. That's what my IPhone photos looked like on the forum. And resize didnt help

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    So, have you actually (this decade) tried directly uploading full resolution images from your Nikon, or is this more "wisdom" from the mind of Bill?
    comic sans Cal
    How, otherwise, did you figure ANYONE would know the PM server would not accept them?

    The last 43 were downsized before I submitted.

    Just tried a 4.9 MB "raw" upload, file type .jpeg

    PM server DID downsize it FOR me. To 97.4 KB and still .jpeg

    But .. I get larger images from screenshots saved as .png first, then uploaded.

    You have some other platform?

    Your Resolution May Vary
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails gravel.jpg  

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    Thanks for moving this, Cal.

    It needed separate handling.

    Clearly this is "fixable". Somehow.

    It isn't "just" iPhoto.

    Only a subset of the membership has a problem. Others run whole threads, good photos, one after another, and near-zero hassle.

    See Docsmachine threads, Springfield and W&S turret lathe. Short TON of good photos in each.

    Low/no hassle .. that we KNOW of...

    Mayhap some of the members ARE doing a good deal of pre-prep and are simply relaxed with the need?

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    I have a Windows 10 desktop. I use File Explorer to copy files from my cameras' SD cards to my hard drive. I use PM's dialog to upload the files to the forum. Works like a champ, except for the fact that the rotation bit is ignored, so that portrait oriented images come in rotated 90 degrees. Years back you had the resize JPG files to stay under about 100kb or the uploader would reject them, but that's no longer a problem. One change that was made a the same time was the way it handles GIF files. I used to be able to upload line drawings as high resolution 2-bit GIF files, now the files get resized to down to the point that they're unusable. Now I have to convert drawings to JPGs to get them to post at a decent resolution.

    Based on feedback from a lot of different people, JPG files seem to post with easily and work pretty well, with the exception of JPGs from iPhones or iPad, as previously discussed.

    Cal

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    From the perspective of a software engineer: this ain' t rocket science.

    The problem is definitely not the end-user's, it is a lack of capability in the version of BBS software running on PM to deal with images that have metadata. If you want to get it fixed, you need to get Don's attention. I tried:

    Question for Millacron: Why does PM need to limit image size so much?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    I have a Windows 10 desktop. I use File Explorer to copy files from my cameras' SD cards to my hard drive. I use PM's dialog to upload the files to the forum. Works like a champ, except for the fact that the rotation bit is ignored, so that portrait oriented images come in rotated 90 degrees. Years back you had the resize JPG files to stay under about 100kb or the uploader would reject them, but that's no longer a problem. One change that was made a the same time was the way it handles GIF files. I used to be able to upload line drawings as high resolution 2-bit GIF files, now the files get resized to down to the point that they're unusable. Now I have to convert drawings to JPGs to get them to post at a decent resolution.
    .tiff would be better for line-art, actually. Compression philosophy issue.
    .jpg's are compressible, but it is a lossy process.

    .png is basically .gif with less legal hassle. And then it was enhanced. Neither as good as .tiff for accurate line-art. PM does not support .tiff. It isn't as easy, server-side. professional publishing industry relies on it mostly for the "master", puts out the post-edit work in formats that are not as resource-hungry.

    PM DOES support .png - which is close enough to .tiff's goodness for OUR needs.. so you might want to experiment with that for drawings instead of .gif, or .jpeg so as to preserve sharp detail.

    "depends" on what is important, so opinions differ;

    What's the Difference Between PNG, JPEG, GIF, and TIFF? | Widen

    On PM, what we share is USUALLY worth higher res than social chit-chat networks with nose, elbow, lip-wire, and lard-arse shots... so lossless compression has very useful value as to preserving our details sharply:

    JPEG, TIFF, PNG, SVG File Formats And When To Use Them | by Vince Tabora | High-Definition Pro | Medium

    Based on feedback from a lot of different people, JPG files seem to post with easily and work pretty well, with the exception of JPGs from iPhones or iPad, as previously discussed.

    Cal
    .. and Galaxy... which is not a "minority" platform, either

    We can safely ignore my OpenBSD, as it is "minority". Very.
    Up to me to sort that, not the community.

    "Time was..' I worked with this crud. For websites. And advertising. Had converters for about 70 graphics file formats. Powerbook Pro based. G4 CPU era, so "time was."

    So "it can be DONE".

    And - for common rock-bottom .jpeg at least..is probably something dirt-simple being overlooked in different platform default settings.

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    I found this in the photo upload help text:


    Filetype Max File-size Max Width Max Height
    bmp 19.5 KB 620 280
    doc 19.5 KB
    gif 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpe 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpeg 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpg 97.7 KB - -
    pdf 19.5 KB - -
    png 19.5 KB 620 280
    psd 19.5 KB - -
    txt 19.5 KB - -
    zip 97.7 KB - -



    Apple machines (iphones, macs, etc.) name the JPG file format with .jpeg extensions by default,
    while other machines may name them with a .jpg suffix.

    On a mac, I've found that just renaming the files to a .jpg suffix before uploading them is enough
    to ensure they are compressed to ~90k, rather than ~20k.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    Thanks for moving this, Cal.

    It needed separate handling.

    Clearly this is "fixable". Somehow.

    It isn't "just" iPhoto.

    Only a subset of the membership has a problem. Others run whole threads, good photos, one after another, and near-zero hassle.

    See Docsmachine threads, Springfield and W&S turret lathe. Short TON of good photos in each.

    Low/no hassle .. that we KNOW of...

    Mayhap some of the members ARE doing a good deal of pre-prep and are simply relaxed with the need?
    For about six months now I have been unable to post pics in my posts when I make them but just after I post I can edit the post and add pics without any trouble other than sometimes they are sideways. The pics come from an Iphone and are downloaded to a Dell PC then uploaded from there using PM's dialog box, it has become quite a pain and I don't know if PM changed ot more likly some Iphone update.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandenberger View Post
    I found this in the photo upload help text:


    Filetype Max File-size Max Width Max Height
    bmp 19.5 KB 620 280
    doc 19.5 KB
    gif 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpe 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpeg 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpg 97.7 KB - -
    pdf 19.5 KB - -
    png 19.5 KB 620 280
    psd 19.5 KB - -
    txt 19.5 KB - -
    zip 97.7 KB - -



    Apple machines (iphones, macs, etc.) name the JPG file format with .jpeg extensions by default,
    while other machines may name them with a .jpg suffix.

    On a mac, I've found that just renaming the files to a .jpg suffix before uploading them is enough
    to ensure they are compressed to ~90k, rather than ~20k.
    Here is an experiment: first image is a .jpg second is same image with .jpeg suffix. The first image was created by copying the first image with the .jpg suffix, no other difference.

    Brandengerger, thanks for solving this! Now what would be even better is for the file mentioned above to get modified so that all image types have the same maximum compressed size.

    img_0922.jpg


    img_0922.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by kustomizer View Post
    For about six months now I have been unable to post pics in my posts when I make them but just after I post I can edit the post and add pics without any trouble other than sometimes they are sideways. The pics come from an Iphone and are downloaded to a Dell PC then uploaded from there using PM's dialog box, it has become quite a pain and I don't know if PM changed ot more likly some Iphone update.
    To add pics from pc to a new post or thread: you click "reply to thread". On new window, click "go advanced". Scroll down, click "manage attachments". A small window pops up, click "add files". Either click "browse" in drop down to seach your pc for pic, or click + symbol to add up to 5 pics. After pics selected, click "upload". Then click "insert line" at bottom of small window.

    To stagger pics along a post. Write something, hit enter twice to give pic nice spacing. Then use above instruction to add a pic. Write some more. . .add another pic. Up to 5 pics.

    If loading pics directly next to each other, click between them and press space bar to give a visible spacing, when post is posted.

    Might need to trim pic size if its like 2 or 3 mb, not sure.

    For basic pic uploading, you can check the 3 links included in this link as well, The link from Homebrewblob has a youtube vid on it:
    Posting Pictures on the South Bend Forum

    Another note: I personally trim pic size using a screen capture device, then upload that, verse trying to upload a 1 to 3mb pic. The site will cut down the size for you, but you don't know what that outcome will be. By cutting the pics myself, they display the same as I cut them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    I bet the photo came from an iPhone. For some reason iPhotos don't play well here. I routinely post photos from my Canon cameras and they come in full screen when the auto-resize does its thing. I've alerted site admin to the problem, but so far, no action has been taken.

    Cal
    Yep, came from an iPhone, probably posted with an iPad. I have noticed that pics that I transfer to either Win10, Mac or Linux (ugh, yes, I have all of those around) prior to upload seem to behave better. Sounds like Brandenberg hit the nail on the head. Good info for future posts. And I do have a Canon camera too

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    Thanks Brandenberger for figuring out that the ".jpeg" suffix has something to do with the iPhone upload issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    I have a Windows 10 desktop. I use File Explorer to copy files from my cameras' SD cards to my hard drive. I use PM's dialog to upload the files to the forum. Works like a champ, except for the fact that the rotation bit is ignored, so that portrait oriented images come in rotated 90 degrees. Years back you had the resize JPG files to stay under about 100kb or the uploader would reject them, but that's no longer a problem. One change that was made a the same time was the way it handles GIF files. I used to be able to upload line drawings as high resolution 2-bit GIF files, now the files get resized to down to the point that they're unusable. Now I have to convert drawings to JPGs to get them to post at a decent resolution.
    ...
    .tiff would be better for line-art, actually. Compression philosophy issue.
    .jpg's are compressible, but it is a lossy process.

    .png is basically .gif with less legal hassle. And then it was enhanced. Neither as good as .tiff for accurate line-art. PM does not support .tiff. It isn't as easy, server-side. professional publishing industry relies on it mostly for the "master", puts out the post-edit work in formats that are not as resource-hungry.

    PM DOES support .png - which is close enough to .tiff's goodness for OUR needs.. so you might want to experiment with that for drawings instead of .gif, or .jpeg so as to preserve sharp detail.
    ...
    Here's an example of a PNG format file that I tried to post:
    monarch_ee_99_headstock-rear-bearing.jpg


    It started out as 834x771, 8-bits per pixel, 38kb file size. Since it's over the 19kb .PNG file size limit, PM's uploader converts it into a 253x234, 24-bits per pixel JPG with a file size of 22kb.

    Here's a .JPG that I created FROM the original PNG file.
    monarch_ee_99_headstock-rear-bearing.jpg


    It starts out as 834x771, 24-bits per pixel, 236kb file size, which is over the 97.7kb JPG file limit. PM converted it to a 688x636, 24-bits per pixel JPG with a file size of 97kb.

    I haven't tried posting a .PNG file that's under 19kb limit to see if it stays in .PNG format. But for my purposes, converting my line drawings to JPG (rather than letting PM do it for me) is a better choice.

    Here's a GIF file that I happened to have laying around:
    10ee-ab-start-circuit-basic.jpg

    It started out as 698x833x256, 18kb. Once again, PM saved it as a JPG file, even though it was under the 19.5kb file size limit for GIF files. The resulting file was 232x280, 24-bits per pixel, 13kb in size. It's too small to be useful.

    There's not much point is using PNG or GIF if PM is just going convert them to JPG format.

    Cal

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal Haines View Post
    There's not much point is using PNG or GIF if PM is just going convert them to JPG format.

    Cal
    Cal, since you are a moderator, can you contact the support staff for PM? All that has to be done is to modify the file that has the data and up the sizes.

    i.e. change bmp, gif, jpeg, pdf, png, psd and txt to 97.7 KB, like jpg.

    Filetype Max File-size Max Width Max Height
    bmp 19.5 KB 620 280
    doc 19.5 KB
    gif 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpe 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpeg 19.5 KB 620 280
    jpg 97.7 KB - -
    pdf 19.5 KB - -
    png 19.5 KB 620 280
    psd 19.5 KB - -
    txt 19.5 KB - -
    zip 97.7 KB - -

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    Dave,

    Being a moderator doesn't give me any special access, but I did try contacting the Super Moderator again.

    Cal

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    It appears that the .jpeg limitation applies even when uploading through photo albums.


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