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Round Dial 10EE MG drive - keep or convert

Moddage

Aluminum
Joined
Jan 23, 2021
I'm quite up on all the details of the 10EE at this point... I have a significant number of research hours into these lathes at this point, mostly on this forum prior to creating my account, some from Vintage Machinery, and some from just googling and hitting a bunch of links and sorting through for good stuff.

I had a small photocopy of the original wiring diagram and asked monarch for a better copy and they happily emailed it over. I spent a number of hours colorizing most of the primary circuits to make it easier to understand, but funny enough that was AFTER I had already sorted out enough of the electrical to get it to run in forward.

There's a good possibility this will be receiving a DC drive conversion, I have single phase power at home and presently have to Drill-Start the 3ph AC generator assembly when I need to turn something. It's definitely a hacky workaround for the time being, but it works and the back-EMF even runs the coolant pump if I want.

As far as I can tell this lathe was delivered to the company we got it from back in 1943, purchased new, and became ours in 2020 after sitting broken for over a year and finally deemed "scrap".

The only reason I'm considering DC drive "upgrade" is an AC motor and VFD as you pointed out is a downgrade where torque is concerned so that's out, and a good friend of mine is an electrical engineer and works at a company where he has a lot of involvement in DC drive upgrades, retrofits, and new builds for industrial wire making machines, so he's quite knowledgeable about them, plus he's also into precision tooling and knows all about keeping the DC motor and it's glorious torque.

That's not fully set in stone yet, I considered building a capacitor based start-run box for it from the resources on this forum, and then making a new contactor coil bobbin and winding a new coil for the missing one. Though I will admit, a proper DC drive conversion would free up the MG space for tooling storage and I kind of like that idea. Either way, I refuse to lose the DC drive motor, and I fully intend to make use of the big rheostat to control the speed, if I can't for some reason make that work I will mount a potentiometer to the same shaft and leave the big rheostat in place simply for the wonderful tactile feel of turning that chain driven masterpiece.

I'm in my early 30s, but I have a huge appreciation and fascination with beautiful old vintage precision machinery, and some art deco designs and feel in general. This 10EE will never be for sale for as long as I'm alive, I know that for sure.
 
...

There's a good possibility this will be receiving a DC drive conversion, I have single phase power at home and presently have to Drill-Start the 3ph AC generator assembly when I need to turn something. It's definitely a hacky workaround for the time being, but it works and the back-EMF even runs the coolant pump if I want.
...
There are plenty of us running motor/generator drive 10EEs from single phase power. PLEASE don't rip the guts out of a working 10EE before we talk over the options. Trust me, building/buying a static or rotary converter will be less expensive than any DC or VFD drive conversion option.

Cal
 
You know... I keep going back and forth on the DC drive conversion, I have a drive picked out that should fit the bill perfectly. It’s fully a programmable Parker unit that seems to support field weakening control on shut wound motors like this has, and I have a line on one petty cheap... But I keep going back to keeping the MG set and replacing the defective contactors. I found an appropriate replacement set of contactors that have the right number of contacts, both NO and NC, to keep function of the dynamic braking resistor etc. basically an almost drop in replacement minus the mounting and wiring. They’re from Schneider Electric and handle more than the full load current of the DC motor and are rated for making and breaking that much current and then some... they’re 250VDC coils and that part makes them somewhat unique, not common, and expensive. To the tune of near $500 for both. My reverse contactor is missing the pull down coil entirely and the forward contactor has a defective inductor/snubber coil on one of the contacts, which I have bypassed with a solid wire for the moment. The ceramic arc guide/containment pieces around the contacts are all broken as well. So repairing the existing contactors is almost a lost cause.

I really don’t want to “show and tell” the drive system and motor that’s in this now, you all would certainly be ready to crucify me for wanting to modernize it.. it’s not the original reliance drive or reliance motor. It’s all been replaced with GE parts. I’m not sure when. Unless it was done up with GE parts when new(I have a theory there but that’s a story for another thread..)

I considered replacing the contactors with 24V DC or 240VAC coils and modifying the wiring to make those work, as they’re way cheaper than 250VDC coil units... but that’s a complex change due to the way everything operates with anti-plugging and dynamic braking in this machine...


I’ll do some more thinking, I haven’t pulled the trigger on anything yet.
 
I don’t recall seeing a tachogenerator anywhere in it, unless it’s mounted at the back of the DC motor and I can’t see it... but nothing looks out of the ordinary really for a 10EE electrical wise. It has an in-line GE “Speed Variator” MG unit, and a GE 3HP DC motor for the spindle drive. I was under the impression these had Reliance MG sets and DC motors back in ‘42. But perhaps monarch was short on MGs and Motors and sourced them from GE... or perhaps GE furnished their own, since that’s where it shipped to.
 
I keep seeing mentions of field voltage "Max" around 140VDC, both from you and in a few other places I've looked with regard to people having done DC drive conversions to these... I'm confused why everyone seems to be running the field at 140VDC-ish? Mine is 250-260VDC on the field up to around 675RPM or so and then begins to weaken.

Armature Voltage goes up to ~275V and field is at ~116V at 1250RPM. Field drops to 91V at 1500RPM, 77V at 1750RPM, 64V at 2000RPM, and around 55V at roughly 2360RPM, which is where the Rheostat is maxed out. Field current before weakening is ~0.75A and decreases as the voltage drops.


Did some 10EE's have a lower field voltage for some reason? Is mine the oddball that has a higher than typical field voltage?

I took the voltage measurements with an Amprobe 34XR-A, and the current measurement with a Fluke 189(because I forgot the Amprobe has a blown 10A fuse). Both meters have always been pretty accurate when I've checked them in the past.


I think the bearings in my MG unit need replaced, it makes some abnormal sounds when it's spooling down, and visually looks like there is some play/movement in the commutator of the generator/exciter...

I'm still considering fixing the existing electrical stuff and keeping the MG unit. Realistically, I could get away with the ~180-190V DC from a DC drive without the boost transformers for 99% of what I'd be using this lathe for, I don't anticipate needing gobs of torque at 2500RPM. Base motor speed is 600RPM at 230V. Math works out that at max field and armature voltage on a DC drive I'd begin field weakening around 500RPM instead of 600. I've yet to take a cut that requires anywhere near the 3HP on the motor nameplate. This 10EE is pretty much in a retirement home and likely won't be used for any production work, maybe ever again. It's more for when I need to turn something on occasion, usually to repair something else I'm working on. So far it's been used to make a brass driver for a valve guide installation, an adapter to press a bearing on a shaft for a motorcycle, and I cut an oil filter open with a parting blade at like 50RPM because I could.

I actually find drill starting the MG unit pretty humorous. I'm tempted to keep it and not bother with capacitors or a VFD, just for the laughs. But if I'm going to do that, and reduce the full power capabilities of the entire system by running the 3rd leg on its own back-EMF, then I might as well just go with the DC drive and set it all up on the laptop and fine tune it. I looked at the 514C's, and quickly dismissed it as there is no programmable logic, not that there's anything wrong with an analog DC drive, but I'm way too geeky for that and like to be able to program via software. Plus my EE friend does automation and motor control for a living, so I'd never be stuck if I couldn't figure something out with the software side.

My plan if I do go DC drive is to use a more modern Parker drive that is digitally programmable, and supports shunt wound motor control, I shouldn't need the second drive for field control at all as the parker units can handle I think up to 3A field current and this motor is under 1A. The plan would likely be to wire the existing rheostat in series with the field control output on the drive, and use the other existing rheostat as the speed control input if it will accept the sweep range. The forward and reverse direction control would then be controlled by toggled inputs via the existing direction switch in the headstock until I decide it needs moved somewhere else, if ever.


I'm not entirely familiar with the "gigavacs" you mentioned earlier, and upon searching for that term I was greeted with a bunch of devices that look similar to an automotive starter solenoid... And they're not cheap either... I'm not sure how that would solve my contactor problem if I keep the MG setup in it now as the contactors have 4 NO contacts and 1 NC contact...
 
I'll have to look at the schematic again, but I remember studying it last year around when this lathe came home and deciding the least intrusive repair to the electrical panel near the DC motor was a set of 250VDC contactors that would emulate the way the factory contactors operate, since everything else in there is functional. If I had 480 available I wouldn't be questioning a DC drive conversion now, as I could easily meet the voltages needed to drive this motor appropriately.

I guess I need to evaluate the mechanical condition of the MG unit and go from there. I don't particularly like the noises it makes, but it might just need bearings and some brushes. That's a project for another day though.

Once my new thread about the lathe gets approved I'll add a photo of the motor nameplate among other things.
 
You DO know how to "turn on" a 10EE?

Top-up her juices, tell her she has a nice ass, stroke her neck, and nibble on her earlobes work for yah? Have a care where yah nibble. Wouldn't want to get yerself rectumfried.


LOL. I'm not THAT into my 10EE... Perhaps I joined the wrong forum? ;)



I just had a glance at the schematic drawing that I started modifying last year when I was going to put some cheaper, more common(still good quality Schneider Electric units) 24VDC or 120VAC contactors in, and was reminded where I left off. the way the anti-plugging and dynamic braking relays are integrated into the contactor loop requires a minor redesign and addition of at least one additional relay/contactor to make the dynamic braking relay work correctly. in addition to some wiring changes for the switched contacts of the AP relay and the control switch in the headstock to no longer be carrying 250VDC. Life and COVID got in the way a little bit and drew my focus away from the lathe for a bit so I never finished my modified drawing and revisions to update the contactors in the control panel to reduce the cost of fixing what's already there. I'll have to revisit that avenue when it's not way past my "bedtime" and I can think straight.


As much as I want the Geeky control of a modern digital DC drive that I can fine tune and tweak until my heart's content, the lack of appropriate voltage output to drive this 230V excited motor to its full potential of glorious DC torque also bothers me, even if I likely won't ever need all of it. I don't think there's a reasonable replacement drive motor option that would be financially viable to run at 180V and provide the power(or more) than the motor that's in it can provide, even if I did have a line on a sweet DC drive for a song... After the MG is torn down and evaluated for what needs replaced/cleaned up, I will most likely build a capacitor start box for it so I don't have to spin it up with a drill anymore, despite that being kind of entertaining.

Worst case, if the MG is worse internally than I thought, I suppose I could put a DC drive in it like I had originally wanted and maybe I'll get lucky and find the appropriate boost transformers and another drive for a song like the one I almost bought...
 
I keep seeing mentions of field voltage "Max" around 140VDC, both from you and in a few other places I've looked with regard to people having done DC drive conversions to these... I'm confused why everyone seems to be running the field at 140VDC-ish? Mine is 250-260VDC on the field up to around 675RPM or so and then begins to weaken. ...
Your machine has an inline exciter. Most of those machines had 230VDC exciters, DC control panels and spindle motor fields. The next generation of motor/generators had a belt-driven exciter; they had 115VDC exciters, DC control panels and spindle motor fields.

Cal
 
Your machine has an inline exciter. Most of those machines had 230VDC exciters, DC control panels and spindle motor fields. The next generation of motor/generators had a belt-driven exciter; they had 115VDC exciters, DC control panels and spindle motor fields.

Cal

That makes sense. And thanks for moving this discussion to a new thread.


As for the DC drive swap, after lots of discussion and going over ALL the potential options and plans for the future, my father and I have decided to keep and refurbish the Motor-Generator, which sounds a tiny bit sickly, I think it just needs bearings and brushes. I plan to also go through the DC motor and check its brushes and bearings(maybe bushings), and I'm going to update/repair/modify the electrical control system to fix(likely replace) the defective contactors it has. The DC motor has what I assume are little semi-automated oilers on the front and rear, I haven't taken the little caps off yet, but it looks like a small reservoir you would fill with oil and then it would continuously keep the bearings/bushings oiled until it was out of oil, so I'm not expecting much wear there. The DC motor seems pretty smooth and doesn't make any noises that are suspicious, nor does the spindle. I warmed it up for a good while the other night and finally took it to maximum RPM for the first time, it didn't quite reach 2500, but everything sounded smooth as could be and the only notable vibration/harmonics seemed to be from the twin V belts vibrating around due to the idler roller being missing. There was a repair order tag on the DC motor, I found it today, and it appears to have been rebuilt at some point, so hopefully no nasty surprises when I go through it.

Instead of building a capacitor start box for the MG unit to start on single phase 240, we are planning to get a rather large capacity VFD and program it to output 60Hz to feed a 3 phase subpanel, which will allow us to run other 3 phase motors/machines in the future should we acquire them(probably more when than if, I hope anyway :D).

I'm going to finish colorizing the factory wiring diagram at some point during this process, and I will likely upload it to the forum so anyone else looking for EE-2442 has a nice diagram to reference that isn't all black lines that don't jump over each other where they aren't actually connected in reality.
 
I copied this post from the other thread to reply to it here, seems you missed copying this one over Cal.


LOL! You are in the right place to make a problem out of a solution.

As you are doing.

All this has been done to death, right here, on PM.

Preserving the OEM MG isn't about nostalgia. We do it because they are more rugged and longer-lived than solid-state. Low/no hassle, off yah go to make chips. Not just today. For the next forty years.

Monarch's "hollow state" drives are also rugged, go for decades with little or no need of attention. Now that one among us has sorted-out GOOD bolt-in solid-state tube substitutes, their future looks even better.

IF yah MUST use Solid State?

"3-Phase ONLY" DC drives are near as dammit wire and forget simple. No boost transformer needed. Ripple-filter still a good idea, but nowhere near as critical as it is on two-pulse single-phase source. ESPECIALLY if you utilize a 24-pulse 3-Phase drive, not a white-bread 6-pulse.

Problem is you need rather decent 3-Phase to feed a 3-Phase-only DC drive.

Single-phase you need a FULL ISOLATION boost transformer or array-of AND NOT an "autotransformer". And you need a ripple filter.

Not because I say so. Because the makers of the motors and drives say so and even explain WHY. And they have been proven RIGHT the whole time. Just as 180 VDC max DC drives have been proven WRONG for a 10EE for about forty years, already.

Wheelbarrow tires on a pickup truck thing. Can you make wheels to DO it? Surely. Is it a good idea? F**k NO!

Use what works.

ALL, repeat ALL the adjustment you need and far MORE are already built-in to either class of drive.

There is NOTHING to "invent".

There IS NO fiddle-farting nerdishness. It doesn't belong in the equation.

Lethal power levels are involved. BIGTIME!

These are industrial goods proven in multiple decades of use. Look at the tech pub and drawing dates. 1980's and 1990's on the still-current-item SSD's. And those are the NEWEST players in the room. Early DC drives can be scores of years older.

It just Dinosaur Current, after all.

Analog/digital hybrid control logic is done with biased sensitive Iron and Copper relays in an OEM MG. Since 1898 or so.

Same sort of hybrid logic is done in dirty beach sand in a solid-state DC Drive. For over fifty years arredy.

All-digital with programmable "brain" and any "memory" more complicated than a screwdriver-set trimpot?

Only adds needless complexity, raises the cost and vulnerability to nasty events, ergo reduces the reliability.

Wrong technology for the job where high voltage and high current transients are "standard".

BEST to either restore to well-proven OEM, or use well-proven off-the shelf goods.
The Engineering has already been paid for. The R&D was done. Testing was followed by proof in USE. Corrections and improvements were made AGES ago already.

Just "commission" the system per the Fine Manual, and JF run it the next 40 years as if it were a toaster, microwave, ceiling light dimmer... or ... would you believe.."machine tool".

Powerful machine-tools with lethal voltages involved are not safe places to do hobby "KTE" level experiments on a whim.

If you want something to "play with" take up building robots from scratch.

Preferably ones that do not have 1500 Volt + spikes and 300 plus Volt "stick and fry" Dee Cee power "etc".


I feel like you're partially underestimating my knowledge/resources, respect for electricity, and experience based mostly on the fact that you know I'm in my early 30s...

In addition to my own personal experience and knowledge gained over years of tinkering and educating myself, I grew up having a grandfather who was an electrical engineer, and now a friend who also is. I'm not just your typical average "kid" poking about in a high voltage machine for "funzies" and trying to do "experiments" with drive and motor control blindly because I saw it on YouTube or whatever. The aforementioned friend who is an EE, also specializes in and works a day job for a manufacturing company that builds and retrofits machinery that runs on modern DC drives and automation control stuff, and he's my go-to resource when I get stuck or need guidance in my own endeavors into the realm of harnessing and controlling pixies.

I also wasn't looking at junk china copies of drives either, I was specifically targeting industry proven, reliable, Parker/Eurotherm/SSD Drives, well, because they're reliable as frig and for the more geeky/computer programming inclined people like myself and the EE friend I mentioned, the digital ones offer a much better method of control and fine tuning than some potentiometers on an older drive do, not that there's anything wrong with those drives, they're just lacking in my opinion. Technology has evolved as a whole, and motor control is no exception, why wouldn't I seek a drive that I can program and fine tune to control a motor to levels the older "analog" drives could only dream of?

The only reason I've gone back to keeping the MG and repairing what I have (for now anyway) is because it's realistically the lowest cost option to get the machine up and fully functional to where I can just set up, push the start button, and run it when needed. Yeah sure the lower voltage of a DC drive without boost transformers/etc wouldn't give me full power on the motor that's in it now, but that realistically for my purposes of use is highly unlikely to have been an actual issue, and I was also exploring the option of replacing the motor with something along the lines of a 5HP 180V motor that had a base speed of at least 1750RPM with full field current at some point anyway, you want torque? That should get the job done...

After I go through the MG unit and DC motor and update the control panel, it just might outlive me, I don't do shoddy half-ass repairs, it's pretty much either perfect or it's not acceptable. That being said, if at some point down the road I come up with a 5HP 180V motor that I can make fit appropriately inside the stock base cavity, AND a proper digital programmable DC drive to control it for good prices, I wouldn't hesitate to modernize the hell out of the electrical system and motor if it gives me more power available plus all the awesome functionality and features that exist in the level of DC drive I'm interested in.

With regards to technology evolving and modern motion control and motor control being at the point it's at... Does anyone still build a lathe, or any machine tool with Motor-Generators and big chonky open frame 230+V DC motors today? If not, how come? Is it purely cost prohibitive, or does it have something to do with superior DC motor control technologies being invented? Not saying the MG and DC powered Monarch is lacking where it counts, in fact I think it was ahead of its time considering that as far as I'm aware, it was the first "infinitely" variable speed lathe with gobs of torque and a precision level worth drooling over all in a rather cute form factor. As great as it is in all it's glory, even in todays world, we have technology available that allows a 0.1% accuracy for RPM control of a DC motor, not to mention the ability to control ramp up/down rates, regenerative braking faster than a dynamic braking resistor, field loss detection and safeguards, etc. Is it really so wrong of me to want a lathe as capable and accurate as a 10EE, with a modern drive system and motor in it?

Anyway the biggest bonus here is the rest of the budget that is not presently going to be spent on converting this to a much more modern electrical system/drive method and higher output motor, is going to be spent on tooling instead. So it's a win-win in the end anyway, less cost to get my EE chooching at full song in both directions and making chips, Y'all on here don't crucify me for removing a MG unit from a round dial(yet anyway ;), and more tooling, which I'm looking forward to because my tooling is severely lacking right now.
 
Stop ass u me ing and look. And/or look on PM. Should be Alemite Zerk grease fittings. And you'll need to open the exit side screw plug cap to pump/purge a fresh ration of grease into them. If you do NOT open the relief plug, you will be forcing grease into the MOTOR! That gets messy.

There does not appear to be zerk grease fittings on my DC motor, I looked. It has what appear to be some sort of oiler, maybe spring pressure and a plunger type, definitely not a zerk though... It's possible the DC motor has bushings and wicks instead, further evaluation is needed to be certain.

The DC exciter however does have one zerk fitting and an exit screw, but the bearings that sound bad from what I can tell are in the 3phase AC motor, or the generator section, and those do not have any external means of lubrication that I could find, so it's gotta get opened up and evaluated.
 
I'm well aware no one here is on a payroll to be here, neither am I, never have been in any of the forums/communities I've been a part of and contributed to in the past. And I have no intention on "using anyone up". I'm a perfectly capable man-child and know how to use the search function, which seems to work infinitely better on my computer than it does on mobile, but I'm on the go and not at a desktop or laptop more often than not, so that presents a small challenge/issue finding info sometimes.

Regarding my apparent lack of knowledge, perhaps it's a perception thing based on me voicing partial thoughts mid thought process. I tend to multi-task and "think out loud" a lot, on and off forums I guess. I may not be the most knowledgeable person about the 10EE, or even DC drive conversions in general, but I'm far from inept or lacking in knowledge... That being said, I'm still also in knowledge-sponge-research-brush-up phase on some details in that specific area, but that's just part of my process of deep dive rabbit hole research on the path to mastery I seem to end up taking with most things I get myself into.

I'm not trying to be in any kind of contest or pissing match either. And despite it seeming like I haven't spent much time on this forum, I assure you I have spent many hours on here prior to creating my account. I can probably recite specificities about the 10EE that most people don't care to know or learn(not specifically anyone on this forum, y'all are just as bad as me or worse when it comes to knowledge on that subject :D).

I took a guess that it may be age related because it certainly wouldn't have been the first time that's happened. Happens a fair bit in fact.


I know there's a ton of info here on tooling and "everything else". I've been lurking on this forum occasionally since like 2012 or 2013, back when I was teaching myself CAD/CAM and Speeds and Feeds for CNC milling for a small local company is how I originally found this place. I thought I did create an account at some point, but my username wasn't taken nor was my email registered, so I guess not. but that's beside the point.


Also, the lathe does run, via Drill-starting the 3phase motor on single phase at the moment. I don't have reverse or threading yet, but haven't needed either for any of the things I've turned on it thus far... And I never said I was buying tooling before I finalized the repairs/updates... that would just be silly.


As for data, you want data, brother have I got data for you.

Nameplates:

DC Motor.jpg
General Electric
Model: 5B284A168 D-C Motor
Type: T, Frame: 284, Winding: Shunt
Volts: 230, Amp: 13.4, Speed: 690/2650
Enclosure: Open, No.: 1025230
HP: 3, Duty: (illegible or blank) Hour, 30°C Rise
US Patent 2085995
N.P. 55863, Schenectady NY, MADE IN U.S.A

Speed_Variator.jpg
General Electric
Speed Variator
Model: 15 A 174, No: 1898949
Generator-Volts: 230, Amp: 12.9
Motor-Volts:220/440, Amp: 11.5/5.8, CY: 60, PH: 3
Exciter-Model: 5B792AB4, V: 230, A: 1.3
FOR USE WITH D-C MOTOR
HP: 3, Volts: 230
SP_. Duty
NP84580, Schenectady NY, MADE IN USA


File_003.jpgFile_007.jpg

My EE uses 230-Volt excitation, 230V field and armature. The Armature is actually more like 278 at peak, and the field is more like 260.
Field current is ~0.75A at peak, Armature current I haven't measured but it stands to reason that it's more than the nameplate rating under heavy load due to the increased voltage.

Wiring Diagram for my lathe.
I colorized the DC section and corrected some minor errors in the 1980 Monarch re-draw using a magnifying glass to read the small photocopy I got of the original schematic as a reference.

"
This links externally to a 3440x2195 resolution partially colorized Monarch EE-2442 wiring diagram. File size is 1MB.
The original file I scaled this down from is a massive 7MB and 10229x6527 resolution.
I converted it to a vector file so I can scale it theoretically infinitely, could print it on a billboard if you wanted to.
 
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Good to know about the being logged in and using google in another tab. I guess it wasn't just my imagination or lack of the right keywords that the search function seemed to be doing almost nothing for me before.


That you have GE - comparable to the 3 HP "large frame" Reliance, and in straight-shunt, AND Type T... is also rare.

As-is a GE MG unit.


You just brought in a ration of "exotic meat" we do not often see!

Good on yah!


I had a feeling it was quite the rare specimen... the unknown hours I spent on this forum, vintage machinery, and whatever else google brought up for me last year when I did a deep dive into the magical land of the 10EE revealed to me that this might be quite rare indeed.

I wonder how many of these out there got produced with the GE MG unit AND GE Type T motor... any ideas? I couldn't seem to find any last time I searched.

I'm always interested in history and data about old machines, not specifically the 10EE or even my variant of it. I just enjoy history about certain things, mostly mechanical.

As for my explanation of the potentially unicorn GE parts in this lathe, that has to be because it was ordered by GE. I couldn't find any data for either the MG or the DC Motor in this when I tried googling their part numbers, I barely found anything on the "Speed-Variator" line of MG units or when they came to exist. Do you happen to know if these parts could be original to this lathe? Perhaps either shipped to Monarch and installed by them at GE's request before delivery, or installed by GE on site after arrival. The wiring between the control panel under the headstock and the MG unit is all the typical(from what I've seen) Monarch blue colored insulation with the little metal stamped ID tags crimped around each wire, at both ends. It's hard to believe GE would have gone to the trouble to label the wires with the same exact tags as I've seen in other EE's I've searched up, so I'm inclined to think these parts were shipped to Monarch by GE and installed by Monarch.

The Motor was repaired at some point, the hand written tag attached to the motor was hard to read but indicated that at least brushes were replaced, and if the first 4 digits of what looks like some sort of internal order/processing code are a date, it was done in 1971, but that could be incorrect, it's a several segment number with hyphens in between.

I tried to do a deep dive and spent countless hours searching everything I could about the GE campus this machine came from at the time it would have been delivered, as well as a few other potential locations it could have originally went to first, hoping to find some old WWII era photos of workers making things and this lathe somewhere in one of those photos, but I came up empty.
 
young package of electricity

LOL!(literally) This made me laugh probably more than it should have.


I was wondering if you were in a different time zone, but then I saw Virginia and just guessed you were a vampire like me, or a WAY early riser. But I guess vampire was the right hunch.:D
 
I never knew dolphins didn't sleep... that's interesting...

Here's something interesting also. This was among some of the things with my lathe. It says it's for a "Type B" motor, but the nameplate on the motor in it says Type T... Perhaps the original motor was a Type B? or maybe the instructions apply to both?

I'm not sure how readable these will be, but it's 4 pages all about a GE DC Motor, and it's dated 1937.

GE DC Motor 1.jpgGE DC Motor 2.jpgGE DC Motor 3.jpgGE DC Motor 4.jpg
 
That’s a genuinely neat dolphin fact, I came here for machine related knowledge and I’m already gaining bonus facts that I’ll remember for inexplicable reasons! This forum rocks. lol

I make no claims to be an expert of anything. And offer no implied warranties of any kind. That being said, when I get to the point of taking this MG and motor out and possibly tearing down and refurbishing, I’m sure I will gain more knowledge. And will gladly contribute what I can. I’ve already gained so much from this forum, if I can further the 10EE knowledge-base and help someone else down the road who started off where I started searching for answers about their GE powered machine (and largely came up empty as it’s not so common) then I will happily do so.

I don’t have a flat bed scanner but I can try to find a piece of glass to flatten these out and get good photos of them and send to Cal. PM probably will compress them similar to the uploads in the threads, but email should work.
 
To be practical --
I would advocate for a 220V brushless ac servo drive and motor, new, and selling off all the old stuff.

My 12x lathe has that, with 90 Nm torque for 3 secs from 0-1000 rpm.
2.5 kW cont.
And 30 Nm torque forever ...
And 0.1 secs 0-1000 rpm, if I was reckless enough to use that (I use 3 secs).

A full-on AC servo drive and motor costs less than 2000$ for 2.5 kW or so.
It will be much smoother, will have perfect speeds and no ripple, and vastly higher acc and torque for 1/10 the sise, and last in industrial usage around 10.000 hours.

For comparison, the HAAS ST-10 of 11 kW has a PEAK torque of 102 Nm at 1200 rpm, and around half that for most of the usable range.
So my refit has nearly the same torque with much better ripple, acceleration, and torque values for 1/4 the size.
And 1/3 the cost.

I used a big timing belt, HTD-8-30 mm, to give me a C axis and 0.01 degree indexing.
And built a big heavy mount to control all that torque.
Think of a tractor.
Trivial to do, just big and heavy.

I LOVE the lathe -- but think anything other than an ac servo is just silly.
You can keep the gears, for now, and maybe later put a pulley directly on the spindle like I did.
Or both.
I don´t miss the gears or the noise.

My much higher torque has proven extremely useful.
I never, ever, ever expected that.
 








 
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