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Fascinating automation video

watched one where they were building engines in Europe . Wish I could remember where I found it . Would like to watch again. It was on a level that I couldn’t imagine at the time.
 
I know, its crazy huh. Can you imagine trying to coordinate the "project" that would be getting one of those lines engineered? Let alone, running! :eek:

The engineering, especially the precise modeling that must have been required, is tough to comprehend. As an engineer, I work on some pretty cool/advanced stuff, but that was definitely impressive. We build some of the most complex defense systems on the planet, and our 'factory' looks like an asian shoe factory compared to that.

The comment about the places humans interact was a good one. I mean after designing and automating all that, WTF is the point in leaving a human in the loop anywhere? Just finish it up - then turn on the power, turn off the lights, dump raw materials in one end and get shit out the other.
 
Honestly, fairly standard stuff in that video. Nothing you wouldn't see in about any automotive factory or in many Tier 1 suppliers.

I am 100% sure you are correct. But, a lot of us have not seen it. I mean sure, everybody has seen the car traveling down the "assembly line".
But, there was stuff in that video I have been pondering for 30 years. Specifically: how do they get these windings in there so damn perfect?!
And, how do they sew all this up so damn perfect? That has got to be one of the most expensive sewing machines on the planet.
Is that thing bespoke for that particular motor? Or, is that off the shelf stuff from automation direct?
And, the number of very application specific machined parts is kind of astronomical.
Anybody worried that automation is going to kill CNC machinist careers needs to watch that video. So many parts!

Automation is a whole new world for me is all. And, that video kinda blew me away a little bit.

I've been spending a lot of time on this stuff after all the employee struggles I had in 2020.
And now, after seeing the impacts of implementing some automation (which are happening in a very short period of time),
I feel this is a path I need to explore a whole lot farther.
 
And, how do they sew all this up so damn perfect? That has got to be one of the most expensive sewing machines on the planet.
I'd like to understand why they're sewing at all. There must be some technical reason but I can think of a lot of cheaper, simpler ways of securing things then that complicated sewing operation. Is it a case of "we've always done it this way" or is there a good reason for sewing?
 
current flowing through each wire produces a magnetic field (and some heat), wires try to push away from each other, they are secure between the stator ribs, but the loops outside the ribs aren't, changing temperature also is a factor, and how else would you secure those loops? sewing is the most economically effective way of doing that, even when it looks complicated, it really isn't, also, I didn't notice it in the vid, but there might be a step to dip the whole stator in resin, and the knitted together coils retain the resin gluing the wires together to prevent rubbing of the insulation between individual wires which increases durability

regarding the process in general - it was a gradual process which started all manual, step by step machine replaced some part of the process and this is just the end result

the issue however is that the overall design is very influenced by the need to automate the manufacturing/assembly process, which usually means bad news for people servicing during and after warranty, little individual parts available, when you replace something - you replace assemblies, kind of goes against the whole sustainability theme that is being pushed everywhere
 
interesting to see where they resort to having a human do something....

Yeah, someone screwed up and allowed a human to remain. Probably the plant managers mother. LOL

Watching that vid got me looking at some of the early 1980s promo vids. Unimate and Cybotech was showing up big time especially in Gilman lines in the auto industry. (Yeah a long time ago, seems like yesterday).

But anyway it's often mentioned in those old promis that ROI will be "X" number of workers and that those workers will now find jobs created by automation.

Some pretty amazing stuff.
 
So Wheelie - you've been doing automation for some time, you just call it CNC programming. It's comfortable because it's famliar.

Threre's also an issue of scope - it's one thing to model and machine a part. Another to do it in very few setups. Another to model in automated fixturing, etc. Akin to how an operating system or app suite is "more of the same" as "hello world", but also different in a fundamental way. (Size/complexity/volume/quantity all create a kind of quality of their own.)

And to be sure, there are a whole lot of processes in that video, and industry as a whole, that depend on large volumes of identical things, said things designed for this process. (Hence some of the knobs on the motor housing that are there at least in part to allow robotic tooling to hang on to them. Same knob later tapped for a bolt - double value! What, it's also a material build-up to offset stress loads? Triple value.) Finding all of that takes a great deal of engineering/testing effort.

Which why you have been seeing, and will see more and more, of common parts across models or even manufacturers - things like airbags, microprocessors, and at least within a family of companies engines (for a long time), motors, etc.

In fact, electric cars can easily pull a scaling trick with motors - want more power? Put in a second instance of the same motor! 4x? Put in 4 of them! No multi-year effort to upsize your 200hp engine to 400hp and the hoard of headaches that came with that. Just use 2!
 
little individual parts available, when you replace something - you replace assemblies, kind of goes against the whole sustainability theme that is being pushed everywhere

Ohh, that is a whole 'nother subject. I am so sick of hearing the term "renewable energy"! Yes, I looked up the (their) definition. I know what they mean.
But, the fact remains: it is complete and utter bullshit. You can not create (renew) energy. You can only convert and/or store energy.
Some methods of conversion are much more efficient than others. Wind & solar being at the bottom of the list. Nuclear at the top, followed by hydro, then probably diesel. I honestly am stepping outside my knowledge a little with that list. Coal is in there somewhere. And, there or more factors than just the raw efficiency (like process). I get all that. But, the fact remains, wind/solar are at the bottom of the list. And, they do not store well.

I'm all for clean air, low emissions, and saving the environment. I'm not even against EV's. (although I am strongly against completely eliminating ICE's).
But, I feel this whole movement is not about the earth. It is about money and power. And, it is bullshit.
 
...I'm all for clean air, low emissions, and saving the environment. I'm not even against EV's. (although I am strongly against completely eliminating ICE's).
But, I feel this whole movement is not about the earth. It is about money and power. And, it is bullshit.

I feel the same, that an awful lot of engineering effort is being wasted on building beautiful electric power units that will be subject to the inherent limitations of "green" energy. Now if the greens would admit that nukes are the key to energy production then I'd feel a whole lot better about EVs. But they won't. It's almost as though they hate cars for the freedom they give to the individual—reduce the driving range, reduce the efficiency of refueling, and when EVs are all that's available, then you've got control over a population's mobility. Rolling blackouts would stop travel quicker than a gas shortage. At least you can hoard gas for an emergency.
 
It's almost as though they hate cars for the freedom they give to the individual—reduce the driving range, reduce the efficiency of refueling, and when EVs are all that's available, then you've got control over a population's mobility. Rolling blackouts would stop travel quicker than a gas shortage. At least you can hoard gas for an emergency.

BINGO!

That is exactly what this is about. I'm no conspiracy theorist. But, I'm also not stupid (even though I accuse myself of just that all the time)
 
Honestly, fairly standard stuff in that video. Nothing you wouldn't see in about any automotive factory or in many Tier 1 suppliers.

Seems sort of neat.
Seems like black magic and the how and planing of all the tiny details and timing to make the system work.
This may be falling off a log for you as seems so basic and simple. We all need to remember being rookies and all things learned.
Bob
 
I feel the same, that an awful lot of engineering effort is being wasted on building beautiful electric power units that will be subject to the inherent limitations of "green" energy. Now if the greens would admit that nukes are the key to energy production then I'd feel a whole lot better about EVs. But they won't. It's almost as though they hate cars for the freedom they give to the individual—reduce the driving range, reduce the efficiency of refueling, and when EVs are all that's available, then you've got control over a population's mobility. Rolling blackouts would stop travel quicker than a gas shortage. At least you can hoard gas for an emergency.


In regards to future energy use in the United States it seem that a "one size fits all" approach is how many demand we adapt/apply energy usage.

One form of energy such as solar may be offer high return on investment in one geographical area while somewhat inefficient in others. Hydro and wind the same. Possibly in some high demand areas with little room for brownouts then nuclear it seems would be the obvious choice. Some demand ZERO usage of fossil fuels--how does that make economic sense when we are sitting on vast reserves.

Seems while many demand diversity(?) in thought and social practice those same people want all to adhere to some rigid energy policy based, it seems, more on emotion than reality.
 
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In fact, electric cars can easily pull a scaling trick with motors - want more power? Put in a second instance of the same motor! 4x? Put in 4 of them! No multi-year effort to upsize your 200hp engine to 400hp and the hoard of headaches that came with that. Just use 2!

It seems in regards to flexibility in EV production most will be using what is referred to as a "skateboard" which is basically a modular power unit that can be scaled to the requirements of the application.

i believe the delivery vehicle startup in South Bend, Indiana will be bringing in mostly pre-fabbed body units and then using a "skateboard" built up from U.S. sourced components. If you search 'electric vehicle skateboard' you will get a ton of hits.
 
I used to be fascinated by automation videos.

These days they just stress me out.

Two things in particular come to mind:

1. How do you keep those machines clean? Is the raw material clean? Is the air filtered? Does spent lubrication gunk up? Do rubber seals and wipers gunk up over time?

2. How do you find and train personnel to maintain those machines? When something goes awry, how long does it take to source replacement parts and repair the machine?
 








 
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