Time to build a machine to automate a process, Anyone want to help my first journey? - Page 7
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  1. #121
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    Do a search using HUANYANG as the search item. There will be a number of returns. Read what others have said about said drive.

    Tom

  2. #122
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    To OP.

    Have You ever made any automation projects for/in industrial use ?

    The 4k$ is far too light in materials cost.
    Any decent electronics can cost 2-4000$, alone.

  3. #123
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    Based on what I've bought already, I'm going to politely disagree.

    $200 for the PLC
    $1000 for linear motion and ball screws
    $1000 for pneumatics
    $1400 for wiring and servo/drives
    $800 for spindles and vfds

    Real close to the 4k budget.

    I would have made the budget by going stepper but the servos sounded like a much better plan.

    I'll be able to hit the $5500-6000 mark and I'm ok with that

  4. #124
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    What about the safety stuff don’t get yourself in a jam. That stuff is expensive


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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  6. #125
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    Safety is what took industry away from this country. I'll add safety stuff after someone gets hurt.

  7. #126
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    I think you are deceiving yourself re the safety aspect. You have two potential problems. OSHA and the person that gets hurt. That is assuming someone does get hurt. There was a post here a few weeks or months ago about a person that was terminated that called OSHA and made life hell for the company. I agree OSHA is a bit aggressive. For the most part safety is just good common sense.

    osha cowboy on horse - Google Search

    OSHA results

    Tom

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  9. #127
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    I'm well aware 😂 out of the last 12 years we have yet to fail an inspection or even get a warning.

  10. #128
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    Workers are most likely to become injured doing mindless repetitive tasks. Automation, in most instances, improves worker safety.

    In those instances were repetitive work is required elaborate safety measures are needed. For example, punch press operators need to use both hands to engage the punch cycle. In addition there may be a light curtain or a safety cage to deter a worker intent on defeating the basic interlock.

    In the case of a manual double spindle drilling operation there is the danger of a careless operator getting his hand drilled by engaging the drill cycle while holding the part.

    The automation project removes the operator from the machining operation. Whatever safety measures are required will be much less expensive than that required for manual operation.

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  12. #129
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    Agreed.

    My plan is to put an acrylic panel box over the drilling area. Easy and we have scrap material laying around.

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  14. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    The "$4000 in materials not taking into account the labor" seems on the light side.
    Would be nice to know what the outside vision comes in on it own on just orient. Kind of a near and dear subject to me.

    Think throughput per shift, not op cycle time or machine cost.
    Yes the load, unload kills you in such fast holes. Robots are no better.
    Those low cost and not to be talked about drives...Not world class but can work and do very many cycles.
    I'm all in for the big stuff where there is money but this is only 60,000 parts a year, not like designing for a million cycle warranty.

    Notably missing is that motion guy on this attempt.
    Bob
    Haven’t had much time recently for PM . . . the move, 5 dozen people working on non paying stuff, bankers, appraisers, city inspectors, all wanting their pound of flesh, we’ve been operating on a temporary certificate of occupancy until last week when we became official . . . September was a bad month!

    Camera system with lensing, lighting and interface to a $200 PLC? Keyence $$$, Cognex $$, ??? My bet is $5k minimum and wouldn’t be surprised at $7k - $10k for something that is reliable and fast. That is if it really needs a camera.

    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    Safety is what took industry away from this country. I'll add safety stuff after someone gets hurt.
    . . . It’s a new world. China’s success is based on abuse of people . . . if you copy their methods to be successful, you are no better.

    One of our biggest new customers had this attitude, we recently installed a $30k safety guard system on an 70’s vintage engine lathe. Think about that . . . a single op dedicated lathe you can buy on eBay for under $30k required a $30k safety system to be installed. How does this happen?

    From first contact requesting assistance (me answering the phone at 5:20 pm after hours) to installation was 16 days. And we have a half dozen other safety projects of similar and larger scope with this customer to get done before the end of the year.

    One injury won’t get you in this situation, but a couple of injuries and subsequent OSHA fines and then civil lawsuits from the family of the injured with awards that make OSHA fines look like a third graders allowance . . . at some point capital “S” Safety needs to be taken Seriously and when all is compromised for bald faced greed or to make a name for yourself (narcissism) not saying this is you, but it reflects this customer’s past . . . and your quote is almost word for word in alignment with their past right up to the dod contract.

    The balance ultimately swings in favor of the regulators, courts, and insurance companies to bring a correction. And when your $10 million dollar dod contract has non-performance penalties, and your insurance company has locked your front door until you can show you have addressed your safety issues . . . that $30k safety system you need installed pronto pup on your old American Pacemaker lathe will seem like a bargain and you pay extra for getting it installed in 16 days over the 4th of July holiday.

    Just sayin . . .

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  16. #131
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    I'm guessing you didn't sense my sarcasm there.

    We have never had an OSHA warning or fine or ever had anyone hurt in the last 10+ years. My insurance is low and I'd like to keep it that way ��

    It's a machine that drills holes....not a machine that makes rocket fuel. Maybe that's why the USA sucks for manufacturing, always over thinking stuff.

  17. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    I'm guessing you didn't sense my sarcasm there.

    We have never had an OSHA warning or fine or ever had anyone hurt in the last 10+ years. My insurance is low and I'd like to keep it that way ��

    It's a machine that drills holes....not a machine that makes rocket fuel. Maybe that's why the USA sucks for manufacturing, always over thinking stuff.
    Well drilling plastic or human flesh the machine won't care.

    I agree some of the safety is BS over rated, but I have worked at a place where someone was killed. If there had been better safety practices in that shop he would be alive today.

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    Still, sarcasm must not be existent in many of your lives.

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    In the last month we have been involved in conversations with 3 different companies that I bet 90+ percent of the users of this forum would immediately recognize and two of these companies make products that are likely purchased by a significant percentage of PM users.

    Company 1 - injury on a repetitive single op lathe - loss of fingers - aerospace / defense
    Company 2 - fingers cut off in an AMADA horizontal saw - automotive
    Company 3 - finger sheared off in Traub CNC turning center - sporting firearms

    We regularly are called in to companies where injuries (including loss of limbs and fatalities) occur and design safety systems to remove the possibility of it happening again. We are required to be enrolled with ISNetWorld with regular safety training and an accident experience grade of B+ in order to receive purchase orders from our largest customer.

    Intelligent sarcasm is generally understood to be funny . . .

  20. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    ..... Maybe that's why the USA sucks for manufacturing, always over thinking stuff.
    Rule number one : Do no harm.
    Rule number two: Never underestimate the ability of people to do foolish,dumb or just plain stupid things.
    These are why you overthink things.
    Bob

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  22. #136
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    Yea well I dont hire idiots so there's that. I'm for sure not going to over think how to cover the drill mechanism with plexiglass sheets

  23. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    Safety is what took industry away from this country. I'll add safety stuff after someone gets hurt.
    It is unfortunate that you said this. If someone get hurt and the attorneys find this, you will be strung out and left to dry. What you have said here is that you have no interest in the safety of your employees, only money. Maybe that's not what you intended but that is what you have said in writing.

    Tom

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    Ive noticed this as a "trend" on this forum. Bunch of old farts with no sense of humor find some thing that "** irks" them and they grab a hold and wont let go.

    Lets keep this thing on topic here or I can just not contribute and no one gets to see the progression from an idea into an automated machine that helps make this country more productive.

    I could just as easily do it all on my own, which for the most part have, and not have the drama of "you need a light curtain, dead man switch, full fenced off cage with bio metric scanning to enter" safety. Those of you that have a shop...probably have manual machines that are far more dangerous that have zero safety measures in place.

    So can we all agree to keep this on topic or do we all agree for me to stop posting about this project?

  25. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    Ive noticed this as a "trend" on this forum. Bunch of old farts with no sense of humor find some thing that "erks" them and they grab a hold and wont let go.

    Lets keep this thing on topic here or I can just not contribute and no one gets to see the progression from an idea into an automated machine that helps make this country more productive.

    I could just as easily do it all on my own, which for the most part have, and not have the drama of "you need a light curtain, dead man switch, full fenced off cage with bio metric scanning to enter" safety. Those of you that have a shop...probably have manual machines that are far more dangerous that have zero safety measures in place.

    So can we all agree to keep this on topic or do we all agree for me to stop posting about this project?
    I agree to disagree with anyone who agrees or disagrees.

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  27. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    Ive noticed this as a "trend" on this forum. Bunch of old farts with no sense of humor find some thing that "erks" them and they grab a hold and wont let go.
    Well, I'm a young guy, and the word is "irks". "Erks" is what you have left after you drop a part and break off one of your zerks...

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