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    Default Cazeneuve 500

    Just missed an opportunity to buy one of these but whetted my appetite. I know its a long shot but does anyone know where to find one here in the US?? Thanks, John

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    Quote Originally Posted by amoretti View Post
    Just missed an opportunity to buy one of these but whetted my appetite. I know its a long shot but does anyone know where to find one here in the US?? Thanks, John
    "Anal-ecdotal evidence" is that Cazeneuve made over 40,000 HBX "manual" lathes, but.. AFAIK, that included all sizes, HBX 360 plus the HB 5XX series, and out of factories in France, Japan, and Brazil (optionally "Nardini" badged), plus at least an assembler-fitter if-not-also foundry in Spain for a time.

    They are still in new poduction in France, just no longer as all-manual. Siemens electronics, hybrid / "Teach-in" CNC, rather. Factory has a neat You Tube video on that family. Well worth drooling over!

    My -360, an early cast-base rev, made in France, may have come from the Savanna River facility, as one other HBX-360-BC recently active on PM did "for sure".

    West-Coast, most may be expected to have come out of the Cazeneuve / Japanese joint-venture factory. Part of the reason they built it.

    Good lathes. VERY!

    But I've no klew if they have gone scarce off being sent-off to scrap for company failures, lack of effort to UNDERSTAND them, or if they are quietly working away, same as always, not yet ready to leave their Day Job and be put up for sale.

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    Does a weight of 6,500# seem correct, looking at moving options. Seems heavy 10ee weighs half that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by amoretti View Post
    Does a weight of 6,500# seem correct, looking at moving options. Seems heavy 10ee weighs half that.
    Check the manual. They can be found.

    The smaller (nominal 14" x 30") HBX-360 starts at 2,900 Avoir.

    With the older cast-not-weldment base, both "B" and "C" options (special apron and capstan TS), plus the electrohydraulic tracer, ISTR about the same as a 10EE - EG: ~ 3,200 Avoir.

    500 series have greater swing, longer beds, enough extra Iron to support all that.

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    Dont have a manual yet but ordered. May move before manual arrives so if someone can look up the weight it would be appreciated as it impacts moving options.

    Its a 500b model 18"swing and 30" BTC.

    Thanks, John

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    Quote Originally Posted by amoretti View Post
    Dont have a manual yet but ordered. May move before manual arrives so if someone can look up the weight it would be appreciated as it impacts moving options.

    Its a 500b model 18"swing and 30" BTC.

    Thanks, John
    Search term: "Cazeneuve HB500b weight"

    Range comes back 1400 kG and up.

    I'd bet on the 1800-2000 kG range for this one, as it is the shortest bed they made.

    "As usual" with rigging, prepare to safely move fully double the expected load and yer usually golden.

    2000 kG is wot in "real numbers"? 4400 lbs, Avoir?

    My built-as-a tracer HBX-360-BC was a comfortable under-load at around 3,200 Avoir, my usual mount for go-fetch:

    Penske diesel Cornbinder, 26-foot box, adjustable on-the-fly air suspension. The shorter wheelbase units exhibit "freeway hop" when a roadway has joints. DAMHIKT, but a thousand miles of that s**t is 999 too many!

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    Thanks, that weight is more in line with my guess.

    Is it possible to lift it with the forks of a stout forklift under the ways? Using straps and chains has its own issues. How do you guys maneuver a lathe like this around the shop? Pipe rollers? Pallet jacks? As I recall the 10ee was lifted by a plate beneath the ways hooked to a chain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by amoretti View Post
    Thanks, that weight is more in line with my guess.

    Is it possible to lift it with the forks of a stout forklift under the ways? Using straps and chains has its own issues. How do you guys maneuver a lathe like this around the shop? Pipe rollers? Pallet jacks? As I recall the 10ee was lifted by a plate beneath the ways hooked to a chain.
    A stout strap AROUND the first cross-web in the bed is all a 10EE needs for overhead lift, FL forks, auto-wrecker, or proper crane. NB: AUGMENTED by a chain to the rear to control the tilt.

    That would be harder with an HBX-360 as the webs are actually clever chip chutes angled to the rear, do not "open" directly downward.

    The HB 500 family have provision for a center-under chip bin instead.

    Tony's website has fotos that seem to show the 500-series bed webs DO open downward, and "may" be well arranged for direct use of a lifting strap, and/or/else strap or chain around a timber-under and "close enough" to long-axis CG that a supplemental chain or strap could control long-axis tilt.

    There are other differences between the base of the HB 500 family and my HBX-360.

    The HB 500 having seperate HS and TS pedestals, not a full-length "bridge beam" base as 10EE or HBX 360 have?

    NO I would NOT try to lift it with FL forks from under the bed. Might be "possible". I just don't LIKE it.

    I'd EITHER:

    - rig for overhead lift, whether crane, wrecker hook, or elevated FL forks.

    ELSE (since I have all the goods needed) - get it up onto crossbeams and outrigger skids spaced well out to resist tip-over, then move it on skates, OR slide it on greased sheet steel.

    Pipe rollers have ZERO place in my universe. Basic volunteer suicide-kits.

    Can't reliably control loose rollers when "single handing" as I do.

    Besides... my many and several skates are PAID FOR already! Those, pry bars, toe-jacks, lubed-up galvanized sheet steel - and PATIENCE - are how I manage them once indoors. Not as if they were rented canoes or such being moved every hour or so.


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    Thanks for the great replies. Ill be retrieving the lathe with a flat bed trailer. The lathe will of course be oriented long axis to long axis. Question- what does one tie to on the lathe to prevent side to side tip over risk and not damage the lathe? Best I can think of is straps that go over ways and tie to cross webbing and then down to the sides of the trailer. Dont fancy a strap to the tail stock or head.

    The haul will be in Wyoming so any moisture will be snow except for possible salty spray from the roads, 350 mile haul. Covering seems problematic with all the straps and wind, will wipe down carefully immediately on arrival. Plan to spray down with WD 40 or some such prior to departure. One time I put grease over the ways and exposed metal surfaces but was a messy deal on both ends! Any clever solutions come to mind?

    John

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    I have a manual for the 500/575/725 series lathes. Send me an email to [email protected] and I will send you a copy
    Gary

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    Default hb575

    my hb575x2000 when craned off the trailer weighed 2500kg without huge steel suds and swarf tray which took two to heft, then there is the hydraulic copier mountings
    aron clamps are not working, they were when i first used it
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails img_9539.jpg  

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    Quote Originally Posted by stuarth44 View Post
    my hb575x2000 when craned off the trailer weighed 2500kg without huge steel suds and swarf tray which took two to heft, then there is the hydraulic copier mountings
    aron clamps are not working, they were when i first used it
    I can't reach them nor see them from HERE. You'll have to have a recce.

    Even two generations of the Henri's Bruet combined could not have made it quite as complicated as a Norden bombsight.

    Well.. then again... there's that "B" "special apron", and "black magic, French recipe"....so maybe they did?



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