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  1. #21
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    Dear Peter,

    Thanks for the update...

    The tail stock in our Sag 12S does not have the dial scale. How the hell anyone could loose it..

    Any way, maybe someone made a new thread and was lazy or did not know how to cut a left thread.
    If a left thread is standard in even low cost machines I do not see why Graziano will not have
    a left thread at the 12S tail stock.. probably one more thing to handle if and then...

    Thanks,
    Noam.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by noamw View Post
    Any way, maybe someone made a new thread and was lazy or did not know how to cut a left thread. Noam.
    It is pretty easy to buy off-the-shelf right hand acme threaded rod plus cylindrical nuts, maybe that is what happened.

    That doesn't explain why it would need a new one, however it is not unknown for tailstocks to fall onto the floor. I have seen photos of lathes with repaired hand wheels, probably from hitting the concrete...

    BTW, this lathe is now restored like new (not mine, but another Kiwi).


    Attachment 283384
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails graziano-sag-12-broken-hand-wheel.jpg  

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    I dubblechecked on 2 Sag12 one Sag12S and a Maho Graziano100W I have here
    Sag12 and Sag12S have the abnormal right hand tread on the tailstock
    The Maho Graziano100W has the normal left hand thread (clockwise to advance )

    The Sag12S is the only one where the carriage handwheel pulls out

    Picture of a Maho Graziano100W which is technicaly the same as a Sag 12 or 12N So with a gearbox
    Not a variable drive like the 12S
    dsc07702.jpg


    Peter

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  5. #24
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    Dear Peter,

    That is nice off you, thanks.

    That explains why it looks strange but does not explain how any could loose the tail stock dial

    Today I triad to run for the first time. It runs nicely. It makes much less noise that I though it would.
    Besides the variator dial that is broken everything looks functional. The motor etc sounds a bit noisy
    to me so I think that maybe one of the 10 bearings are worn out or maybe the chain is not lubricated as
    it should be.

    But in all a nice heavy built machine.

    Italian mechanical designers are really good.

    Well hope the Corona crises will be soon over so I may be able to start doing something on it.

    BR,
    Noam.

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  7. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter from Holland View Post
    I dubblechecked on 2 Sag12 one Sag12S and a Maho Graziano100W I have here
    Sag12 and Sag12S have the abnormal right hand tread on the tailstock
    The Maho Graziano100W has the normal left hand thread (clockwise to advance ) Peter
    Peter, Noam,

    I have a Sag 12 and a Sag 14, and both original tailstocks are "clockwise to advance". I just went and double-checked in case I was going mad .

    I reckon you both must have modified tailstocks, the Italians are not that crazy

    Having said that - whoever decided to use plastic handles on the 12S, instead of steel, was not a good engineer, possibly they were a stylist or an accountant.

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    Dear Peter S,

    Thanks for checking that...

    By the way do you have any idea were to get a SAG 12S oil filter ?

    BR,
    Noam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by noamw View Post
    By the way do you have any idea were to get a SAG 12S oil filter ?
    I don't know, but here is another Italian parts supplier mentioned on this forum:

    PM poster “elliot” from Italy wrote in 2007:

    "You will be able to find whichever spare parts for the lathes Graziano near: mechanical workshop Giunco Sergio 15050 Carbonara Scrivia (To) Genoa road n°14 phone:0131 892033. Mr. Giunco is a lot competent and his warehouse is a lot supplied. Unfortunately he doesn't speak English and he doesn't trade by Internet but he sends in all the world. Ciao"


    -------------------------

    You could also try DMG Mori, as Graziano has been part of this company for many years.

    Probably worth including the serial number - it should be stamped on the front bed way, front face, at the tailstock end. It is not the number on the UCIMU tag (if it has that tag).

    The DMG Mori website lists their Israeli dealer:

    Mori Seiki Israel Ltd.
    6 Meitav St.
    Tel Aviv
    ph +972 356 26 266
    e-mail [email protected]


    Or possibly try Graziano, however they don't give their e-mail address on the DMG Mori website. They probably want you to work through your local dealer.

    Graziano Tortona S.r.l
    via Wilmer Graziano, 15
    IT-15057 Tortona (AL)
    Italy
    ph +39 013 18 18 1
    fax + 39 013 18 18 213

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    Dear Peter S,

    Thanks for the detailed answer.

    I contacted DMG and in several hours the local Israeli representative contacted me.
    After sending the serial number and what I need the simply vanished ???

    At worse I will drain the oil, remove the filter and look for a replacement. I would have
    preferred to do that at the same time but that is the only option I see now.

    BR,
    Noam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter S View Post
    Peter, Noam,

    I have a Sag 12 and a Sag 14, and both original tailstocks are "clockwise to advance". I just went and double-checked in case I was going mad .

    I reckon you both must have modified tailstocks, the Italians are not that crazy

    Having said that - whoever decided to use plastic handles on the 12S, instead of steel, was not a good engineer, possibly they were a stylist or an accountant.

    The Italians are that crazy
    I noticed before on other Italian lathes to have a right hand tread on their tailstocks

    Peter

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    Dear Peter,

    The 12S does not have a thread dial. I could not find any related information.

    Is there a place to install one or does this mean that once engaged you cannot disconnect the
    carriage from the lead thread until you finish your thread ?

    BR,
    Noam.

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    In a school environment we gave up on thread dials many years ago. Instead we would engage the half nut and reverse the spindle when we got to the thread relief. On other machines, we reversed the motor to accomplish the same thing. So unless you are really bothered by the lack of the thread chasing dial you can still make any thread that this machine is capable of.

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    Hi,

    I have used lathes with a thread dial and my own small lathe does not have one.

    Yes it can work without but its nice to have one

    Thanks...

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    Quote Originally Posted by noamw View Post
    The 12S does not have a thread dial. I could not find any related information.
    Here is a photo of a 12S with thread dial, this lathe was being auctioned locally. Very noisy drive.

    Also photos of my 12 with presumably the same thing.

    Let me know if you want dimensions of anything.


    graziano-sag-12s-thread-dial-01.jpg sag-12-screw-cutting-dial-04.jpg sag-12-screw-cutting-dial-05.jpg

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    Dear Peter,

    Any drawings would be nice, yes please.

    The lathe we have at works is noisy but reasonable. When I am taking into
    consideration how old it is, it is OK.

    I think that most of the noise comes from the chain.


    Thank you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 706jim View Post
    The carriage handwheel on my Sag 14 pulls out to disengage although I rarely use this feature.
    I'm sure this is how it was shipped from the factory.
    Well, after reading this I had to go out and check my SAG14 to see if the hand wheel pulls out. It does. Had the lathe for about 10 years now and never knew it had this feature. I'm really not sure what the advantage is to this feature, but at least I now know it has it. Thanks Jim.

    Ted

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    Dear Ted,

    Releasing the hand wheel has to benefits.

    1. If you activate the power feed and you are bending over the machine it does not rotate, hence a protection side effect.
    2. If you release the hand wheel and do not engage automatic feed you can move the carriage rapidly (slide it), like you do with the tail stock.

    BR,
    Noam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 706jim View Post
    In a school environment we gave up on thread dials many years ago. Instead we would engage the half nut and reverse the spindle when we got to the thread relief. On other machines, we reversed the motor to accomplish the same thing. So unless you are really bothered by the lack of the thread chasing dial you can still make any thread that this machine is capable of.
    yes, i have not seen a thread dial in my life, except on pictures.

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    Noam,

    I have started another thread which includes sketches and photos of a Sag 12 thread dial.

    Graziano Sag 12 Thread Dial Drawings and Photos

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    My 12S has a normal tailstock thread, LH for CW / in. Maybe a US spec?

    My guess would have been the thread was damaged drilling large holes, or tailstock dropped as someone else suggested.

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    Hi,

    I have repaired the RPM meter in our lathe.. The glass was broken, the finger was out of its place...

    Any way I created a new window from Poly-carbonate and it works :-)

    At 1500 RPM the lathe makes a lot of noise so I think the meter is not accurate.

    I have tested the emergency button (the red one on the right of the console and it seems
    that it does not do anything ?.. it should turn the machine off ?

    I attached some images, have fun,

    Thanks for every one that adds some input, you are great.

    BR,
    Noam.

    imag0178.jpgimag0179.jpgimag0180.jpgbefore_image.jpg

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