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Compensating employees on overnight production jobs

baran3

Cast Iron
Joined
Jan 28, 2007
Location
Littlestown PA
How has anyone handled compensating employees when you have jobs with long cycle times let's say 8 plus hours and someone comes in at night to load / change parts and then leaves. Maybe they are there an hour or less, but obviously there has to be some incentive for doing it. Any common ways of handling this type of thing? Machine runs 8 hours pay employee for 4 hours to split the difference and benefit so to speak? Obviously whatever employee and employee agree and are comfortable with would decide what works, but just looking for others experience and guidelines that others may use.
 
Years ago I paid guys 2x for working nights. I had 2 guys running 5 machines at nights. It was well worth 2x for several months to keep things running at night. I figured the guys were producing $300 per hour and costing $45 per hour. This was in 1993. They were more than happy to make 2x. They were both in their early 20s.

Life was good back then. Today not so much.

Best wishes,

Dan
 
The laws vary state to state. It used to be that you had to pay someone 4 hours for showing up, but I think that is less common today. There is no Federal requirement for show up pay beyond the actual time an employee is on premises.

But 4 hours is a reasonable amount to pay someone to come in at night to keep the machine running, and having 2 people on site is always advisable, regardless of what the law may say.
 
Back when we started running Swissturns lights out we had the machines modem call a pager if the machine shut down, our swiss guy was literally 5 minutes away. We paid him minimum one hour for every trip he had to make back to the shop, and since he worked a lot of hours it was almost always at overtime rates.

These days I will not have one guy in the shop, too dangerous. So check your laws first, then I would talk with the employees and work something out, so much depends on their home life and travel time. Some guys would be happy to come back in for an hour and some guys you couldn't pay them enough to come back.
 
Us in maintenance at my plant get 4 hours show up time + time and one half for time worked, garenteed two hours time and one half.
 
Do not listen to anyone here as they do not enforce the labor c ode in your state.

Every state is different and the codes are not clear even to the enforcement folks...anyone who has worked for certian carriers have been burned by this.

Visit your labor office and discuss what your situation is.

Call in pay usually applies to insure an employee is paid a minimum to avoid employer from having them work for 20 minutes but this can get silly if they already have worked in the day and return later in the day as the time difference could mean clock reset for time reporting...again this varies by state.

Shift differential is usually not a legal requirement but many places offer it to entice folks to work night shifts.

Where things get stupid is following example...

Normal 5 X 8 schedule days.

Get a call in at 9 pm that lasts until 2 am then return next morning.

Some states like ca have 1.5 pay for hours greater than 8 that bumps to double hat hour 12.

But the usual time keeping systems often stop at midnight so the employee gets screwed out of the double pay.

So first action is to document your proposed schedule then meet with labor enforcement folks to discuss any and all mandated pay adjustments as well as required posters that usually spell this out and are required in most places.

Then discuss how to properly specify how the work day clock is determined as in the example above it is critical that this is in place and it is spelled out in most code and it can be provided to you.

Next develop your company policy from what you learned then go back and review it with the labor folks and once all good then put it into action.

BTW fines and penalties can be steep and usually go to the employee so they will check the rules if you don't and you could pay a hefty bonus...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk
 
Do not listen to anyone here as they do not enforce the labor c ode in your state.

Every state is different and the codes are not clear even to the enforcement folks...anyone who has worked for certian carriers have been burned by this.

Visit your labor office and discuss what your situation is.

Call in pay usually applies to insure an employee is paid a minimum to avoid employer from having them work for 20 minutes but this can get silly if they already have worked in the day and return later in the day as the time difference could mean clock reset for time reporting...again this varies by state.

Shift differential is usually not a legal requirement but many places offer it to entice folks to work night shifts.

Where things get stupid is following example...

Normal 5 X 8 schedule days.

Get a call in at 9 pm that lasts until 2 am then return next morning.

Some states like ca have 1.5 pay for hours greater than 8 that bumps to double hat hour 12.

But the usual time keeping systems often stop at midnight so the employee gets screwed out of the double pay.

So first action is to document your proposed schedule then meet with labor enforcement folks to discuss any and all mandated pay adjustments as well as required posters that usually spell this out and are required in most places.

Then discuss how to properly specify how the work day clock is determined as in the example above it is critical that this is in place and it is spelled out in most code and it can be provided to you.

Next develop your company policy from what you learned then go back and review it with the labor folks and once all good then put it into action.

BTW fines and penalties can be steep and usually go to the employee so they will check the rules if you don't and you could pay a hefty bonus...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk

And I thought the OP was asking about what would be a GOOD compensation. Not the very minimum that would meet the legal requirements.

Heck, before there was cash, there was beer!
 
I used to have an arrangement with my employer a few jobs ago. I ran the wire edm. So I would stop in to check (I was about 5 minutes away, so gas, etc not a big deal) and make sure it was still running if it was a hot job. Also, on repeat jobs I had some records of how long it took to rough before pulling a slug and so forth. Well anyways, the agreement was 1 hour minimum. BUT after like 3 times of doing it they cut down to 30 minutes "since I was so close and it was no big deal" :rolleyes5: So that only lasted a week and a half? Some bosses/owners just have no understanding of how to treat employees, regardless of your state/federal regulations say...

Now that said, worked a salary job where I would often come in after dinner, sat and sun morning and afternoon to keep machine loaded, but they were very generous in when the hot job was finished I got extra time off. I guess it depends on the employer as much as the employee. I would say, find out the laws and regulations to make sure you are covered, then offer them something worth their while to keep your production going.
 
Maybe two questions here?
What is legal and you can force your people to do and what is right and just.
There has to be a very wide range of how this handled.
Bob

You can't force your employees to do anything, people are free to do as they wish...And what is "right and just" is a matter of opinion.

What really matters is an agreement between employer and employee that works for both parties, and that could only be determined by the parties involved.

What the OP is really asking here is what is socially acceptable in this situation, and that has already been determined by law.
 
I find the responses in this discussion comical... Lessee, to get someone to come in and load parts for less than an hour, you have to...
1) Pay them four hours...
2) At double time.
3) And it must be two guys...

For a grand total of sixteen hours pay. Jeeze, it would be cheaper to just run a second shift.

Don't get me wrong, I've faced this myself, running molding presses overnight. My solution?

1) The machines don't have modems; they don't call for help if they go off cycle.
2) They have photo optics to insure the part cleared the mold, If not, they shut down.
3) They have photo optics to insure they made a part, If not they shut down.
4) They have a three minute timer on the alarm bells, so the damned things don't ring all night and annoy the neighbors.

When I come in in the morning, if the press(es) are still running, we made some extra money. If not, we didn't lose anything.

It's a lot less hassle, and expense, than trying to get someone to come in in the wee hours of the morning.

You want to run more parts overnight than fit on the table... buy an automatic pallet changer. Or, arrange for the machines to automatically shut themselves down when they run out of parts and be happy with the extra six, eight, or ten hours of "free" production.

Dennis
 
I find the responses in this discussion comical... Lessee, to get someone to come in and load parts for less than an hour, you have to...
1) Pay them four hours...
2) At double time.
3) And it must be two guys...

For a grand total of sixteen hours pay. Jeeze, it would be cheaper to just run a second shift.

Don't get me wrong, I've faced this myself, running molding presses overnight. My solution?

1) The machines don't have modems; they don't call for help if they go off cycle.
2) They have photo optics to insure the part cleared the mold, If not, they shut down.
3) They have photo optics to insure they made a part, If not they shut down.
4) They have a three minute timer on the alarm bells, so the damned things don't ring all night and annoy the neighbors.

When I come in in the morning, if the press(es) are still running, we made some extra money. If not, we didn't lose anything.

It's a lot less hassle, and expense, than trying to get someone to come in in the wee hours of the morning.

You want to run more parts overnight than fit on the table... buy an automatic pallet changer. Or, arrange for the machines to automatically shut themselves down when they run out of parts and be happy with the extra six, eight, or ten hours of "free" production.

Dennis

I don't know you, and you don't know me, but this is probably what drives the whole "fuck my employee(s)! / fuck my employer!" mentality.
If your state/county/municipality/etc requires the first 3 things you say, well sorry, I agree that sucks.

Is your second shift always going to have profitable work to pay- their wages, the electric/water etc of keeping the shop open another 8 hours per day? If so, then ya (duh) get a second shift going, but that itself is probably no small task for a smaller startup/mom&pop shop so... I think what the OP was asking is how to handle it for the OH SHIT I need to run 70 hours of production in the next week (or 70 hrs per, in the next two weeks, three weeks, etc), whilst minimizing (not cheating mind you!) 30 hours of overtime to one guy, or one cell, etc.
 
Been there, done that, all 3 sides, and
- I always made good money,
- and everyone else always made good money,
- company always made good money.

Weather I was a 3-shift employee, or
- I was paying my employees.

IF/when there is a need for someone to come in specifically to do/make something at night/urgently, it is because it very valuable to the company.

Could be, the co. screwed up planning, and is trying to avoid penalties in something. Yes.
Or the co deliveries failed from a sub. Yes.
The workers, typically, are not on a company-gross-margin profit list benefits scheme.

SO;...
We think You mr Worker, should come and help us.
We will pay You correctly and generously.
The scandinavian 50%/100/200% model is pretty good.
50% on anything extra, 100% sat, 200% sundays.

If the company cannot afford it profitably, the company will still pay YOU and eat it, and maybe discuss the matter with the seller/quoter/foreman.
Or not.

And You are free to take the OT, or not, and if not we will give it to whoever.
You don´t get to gripe, at all, ever, if You did not take it.
And if You took it, You should also not gripe.
Free, honest, not-required OT, if You want it, well paid.
 
Is your second shift always going to have profitable work to pay- their wages, the electric/water etc of keeping the shop open another 8 hours per day? If so, then ya (duh) get a second shift going, but that itself is probably no small task for a smaller startup/mom&pop shop so... I think what the OP was asking is how to handle it for the OH SHIT I need to run 70 hours of production in the next week (or 70 hrs per, in the next two weeks, three weeks, etc), whilst minimizing (not cheating mind you!) 30 hours of overtime to one guy, or one cell, etc.

If it's a small operation that is up against a deadline, there is a simple solution... The owner can do it, as I have from time to time, although I prefer not to.

I don't need premium pay.
I don't need minimum hours.
I don't need a second guy to hold my hand (although today cell phones have made this much safer.)

My point really was, this is cheap extra production, until you have to pay someone to attend to it, then it's not cheap anymore. So, just fill the table at quitting time, and let the machine shut down when it finishes those parts.

Or put in sufficient automation to change parts unattended.

Dennis
 
One guy by himself legal or no? The OP would have to find that out. I've never heard of it being against the law. His insurance co may have a problem with though...................

OP,
Is this an ongoing job or just a one time deal to get 'er done? I assume you must be runnin 1 shift? If running two, 2nd shift would load it and go home. Maybe stagger your 1 shift? Few guys work from 4am-noon and a few noon-8pm. Last guy out the door pushes the green button.
 
Is this an ongoing job or just a one time deal to get 'er done? I assume you must be runnin 1 shift? If running two, 2nd shift would load it and go home. Maybe stagger your 1 shift? Few guys work from 4am-noon and a few noon-8pm. Last guy out the door pushes the green button.

The foundry I started my apprenticeship at had an Afternoon shift in the pattern shop that ran from 12:30 to 8:30 (no lunch but 2 15 minute breaks) We had to work this shift for a week every 8 weeks. Most of us liked this as it gave you an opportunity to do all the errands that had to be done during the day without losing time and yet you were not working really late. As a once in a while thing an employee might like a shift similar.

I sometimes come in late myself and stay late to mind the CNC.
 
OP,
Is this an ongoing job or just a one time deal to get 'er done? I assume you must be runnin 1 shift? If running two, 2nd shift would load it and go home. Maybe stagger your 1 shift? Few guys work from 4am-noon and a few noon-8pm. Last guy out the door pushes the green button.

Small business. My brother just started working with me this year. He lives closer to the shop than I do. Like across a field from the shop. Got some work where I can load a bunch of parts on plates with pit bull clamps for 1st ops to take advantage of all those night hours. Depending on how cycle times come out or whatever someone has to do in the evenings it can certainly be a situation where someone can switch plates out and you basically gain a days time on jobs.
 








 
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