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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by BGL View Post
    Since you brought it up.
    My cell phone has pictures of setups. It holds screenshots of machine settings and alarms. Part failure and successes. Nameplates off of components to replace. It holds PDFs of machine manuals, a speed and feed app, tap drill chart.

    It has an easy to read in poor light and use one handed calculator with trig functions, conveniently holds the last number when turned off/on. It has a flashlight. A clock with alarm, stopwatch and timer as well as a calendar that will alarm to remind of meetings and deadlines and such. I have apps for Amazon, McMaster-Carr and Haas. It holds material, NEC, ASTM, NA and NAS and host of other standards, photos of material certifications.

    Cool thing I just learned is a slow motion video feature. I used it to diagnose a tool change problem,it was not what it thought the problem was - really neat!

    I haven't opened my coveted Machinery's Handbook in years because it is right there in my pocket or hand..

    Just like a chair, it is a necessary and useful thing if used correctly.
    You are an extreme exception to the rule. To most people a cell phone is a toy, not a tool.

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  3. #82
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    I have seen both ends of this.
    Shops where guys are half assing things because they dont want to get off the chair. I have also seen shops that benefit from having guys able to sit and deburr, program etc. It is nice to have a chair to do the task' that are easily done sitting.
    The idea of being able to "earn back" a chair is what would piss me off enough to leave. Doubt anyone in the office has to ever "earn back" a chair or anything else.
    Seems the real problem is people who want to sit all day instead of working......I was told by a manager i greatly respect that when you punish an entire crew for what a few people are doing wrong its a sign of poor management and/or a sign that the manager is too chicken shit to tackle the problem head on with the problem employees individually.
    He has taken what was most likely a problem with a few people and turned it into a problem with most of the shop.

  4. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    Seems people have some very weird ideas and impressions about me.
    Bob
    I think you are trolling. Is that wrong?

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  6. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    Wow, not a chance or you read something really, really wrong.
    Not a member of the Flint water works.
    Since the family on both sides are the original "sitdowners" I did buy BBQ and take it out to the "line" yesterday.
    I hope you also support in some way our working brothers and sisters during this strike.
    Seems people have some very weird ideas and impressions about me.
    Bob
    Do I need to search the archives sir ?
    Or are you claiming "short term memory loss" ?
    Troll

  7. #85
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    Kettle Black?


    ------------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox

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  9. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dualkit View Post
    You are an extreme exception to the rule. To most people a cell phone is a toy, not a tool.
    We use cell phones for setup pictures too. It would be better to document it in a parts file but I would much rather have a cell phone picture of what we did last time when we have a rush setup change than the old "how did we do this last time?" head scratcher. I have found that with chronic phone abusers the simple phrase of "if you don't stop playing on your phone all the time you have to keep it in the coolant tank" works wonders. Keeping things light and humorous often gives better results of than threats.

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  11. #87
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    Good morning All:
    Here's how I see it (further to my post #23:

    "new-ish manager above me decides everyone sits on their ass too much, and REMOVED ALL CHAIRS from the shop"

    Management basically said to the workers:
    You're a bunch of slackass losers and we're going to beat you with a stick.

    Workers said back to management:
    "Problem IS: operators are refusing to work overtime"
    Which translates to: "Fuck you and the horse you rode in on...from now on we work to the minimum standard necessary to keep getting a paycheck"

    I don't see this as a super helpful way to have initiated the conversation or solved the problem (assuming there even WAS one), and the fault, in my opinion, lies entirely with management in this instance.

    If the fundamental problem is insufficient productivity among some of the workers, management needs to do better than to punish everyone...I think toolsteel said it very well in post#82:

    "I was told by a manager i greatly respect that when you punish an entire crew for what a few people are doing wrong its a sign of poor management and/or a sign that the manager is too chicken shit to tackle the problem head on with the problem employees individually."

    Not only that, it smacks of someone who didn't bother to take the time to find out if there were places where productivity could be improved by removing chairs, and other places where the presence of chairs actually helped people to do their jobs, or whether the problem was a toxic workplace culture, or a malcontent who needed firing or whatever.
    Workers are not stupid, and they can see all of this pretty quickly.

    That makes this particular manager a brainless, lazy assed, self absorbed pig who deserves no respect and should be fired before he fucks up worker/employer relations totally.
    The utterly juvenile crap about "earning the chairs back", well I outgrew that sort of bullshit back in early elementary school, and I'd be damned before I let someone pull that kind of crap on me...I'd move heaven and earth to make that asshole look bad in front of HIS boss to see if I could get him fired.
    If I couldn't make that work, I'd know there was no future in that place for me and I'd be planning my escape.

    IMO, it's not the frickin' chairs...it's the attitude.

    Man am I ever glad to be self-employed!

    Cheers

    Marcus
    Implant Mechanix • Design & Innovation > HOME
    Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining




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  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mud View Post
    I think you are trolling. Is that wrong?
    I don't think I am trolling.
    Sit down office chairs slow you down when running machines. Period, one with accurate timekeeping and production records can't deny it.
    Long cycles not that big, but is it useful time spent? Are you being paid to just sit and do nothing? Is that helpful in any way, shape or form?
    Are you providing any benefit to the company your co-workers or society in general while doing so or just felling entitled?

    Cell phones also can but sure as shit pictures of setups or the way things were done last time can be big timesavers.
    Problem here becomes being on the phone when the cycle ends checking the weather or other stuff that is not work related.
    Stools are better than luxury chairs for getting back to the job but for some sit down jobs luxury or ergo chairs are the way to go so I buy into that.

    Of note is that sometimes the better or longer term employees will toss the chair out in the aisle with a "WTF, get this out of my way".
    I will pull out the office chair when I don't feel like working but know that I will spend 9 hours to do what I could do in 6 or 8.
    The big screen TV in the shop also reduces output when a good movie or game is on but weekends should not be hard and you have to treat the team well for coming in.

    You get up in the morning and tell the mate that you are going to work.
    You do not say that I'm going to "play" or "kick back and relax".

    Confused on the overweight thing. This would be a clear violation of employment rules. Perhaps it was in the discussion of health insurance and meant as a poke.
    I do not think such right by any stretch and you just can't do it unless you want to end up in court and pay two years wages.

    Bob

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    I don't think I am trolling.
    Sit down office chairs slow you down when running machines. Period, one with accurate timekeeping and production records can't deny it.
    Long cycles not that big, but is it useful time spent? Are you being paid to just sit and do nothing? Is that helpful in any way, shape or form?
    Are you providing any benefit to the company your co-workers or society in general while doing so or just felling entitled?

    Cell phones also can but sure as shit pictures of setups or the way things were done last time can be big timesavers.
    Problem here becomes being on the phone when the cycle ends checking the weather or other stuff that is not work related.
    Stools are better than luxury chairs for getting back to the job but for some sit down jobs luxury or ergo chairs are the way to go so I buy into that.

    Of note is that sometimes the better or longer term employees will toss the chair out in the aisle with a "WTF, get this out of my way".
    I will pull out the office chair when I don't feel like working but know that I will spend 9 hours to do what I could do in 6 or 8.
    The big screen TV in the shop also reduces output when a good movie or game is on but weekends should not be hard and you have to treat the team well for coming in.

    You get up in the morning and tell the mate that you are going to work.
    You do not say that I'm going to "play" or "kick back and relax".

    Confused on the overweight thing. This would be a clear violation of employment rules. Perhaps it was in the discussion of health insurance and meant as a poke.
    I do not think such right by any stretch and you just can't do it unless you want to end up in court and pay two years wages.

    Bob
    “Confused on the overweight thing. This would be a clear violation of employment rules. Perhaps it was in the discussion of health insurance and meant as a poke.
    I do not think such right by any stretch and you just can't do it unless you want to end up in court and pay two years wages.”


    Why would a little thing like the law stop a man like you? I suppose you meant law rather than rules right? Otherwise you would never end up in court. I think even if or whoever you violate those rules/ laws you never end up in court. A working man does not make you pay they leave you in God’s care.

  15. #90
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    What law would that be breaking? (weight issue)


    -----------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trueturning View Post
    ...
    Why would a little thing like the law stop a man like you? ....
    As a shop owner you not only have legal responsibilities or laws, you have moral and sociological rules and responsibilities to your people.
    Arguably the latter are the far more important as you can't take money with. You die with only your honor, dedication and help to others. All the rest is window dressing.
    The better you can run the more you can reward the team that does the real work and that is the point. Pay, benefits, advancements, quality of life you can provide.
    It's not about being by yourself or what is good of comfy for me.

    I know the laws and court system as I have had superstar machinists people moved up into supervision that should not have been.
    I do not have a problem finding people. I've stood up for the "young and new" generation here many times and have a waiting list of people who want to come back and work for me if I had the work.

    Not sure why you have have such an attitude towards shop owners or managers. I'd guess some bad experiences have tainted your thinking and for sure there will always be asshole bosses.
    My "team" over the many years is coming up on 500 men and women. Each and every one cared for as if my own blood. This is why your attacks on me hurt so much and why I respond.
    No matter what you say I give a shit about those I work with. Many have gone to greener pastures, the others I fear that I have failed.

    Not sure what kind of man I am but I try the best I can. Judge me as you will with what knowledge you have but there is no need for this fight.
    Bob

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mickey_D View Post
    We use cell phones for setup pictures too. It would be better to document it in a parts file but I would much rather have a cell phone picture of what we did last time when we have a rush setup change than the old "how did we do this last time?" head scratcher. I have found that with chronic phone abusers the simple phrase of "if you don't stop playing on your phone all the time you have to keep it in the coolant tank" works wonders. Keeping things light and humorous often gives better results of than threats.
    I recently have taken pictures of things before I tore them apart. I never used to do that, but pushing 60 and sometimes only sleeping 2-3 hours a day my memory isn't the greatest. Most of the time it is items with wires, it sure beats making a home made wiring diagram. I have also used the stop watch for timing operations that aren't done on CNC machines.

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  19. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ox View Post
    What law would that be breaking? (weight issue)


    -----------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox
    Ask him. Working men don’t usually have lawyers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    As a shop owner you not only have legal responsibilities or laws, you have moral and sociological rules and responsibilities to your people.
    Arguably the latter are the far more important as you can't take money with. You die with only your honor, dedication and help to others. All the rest is window dressing.
    The better you can run the more you can reward the team that does the real work and that is the point. Pay, benefits, advancements, quality of life you can provide.
    It's not about being by yourself or what is good of comfy for me.

    I know the laws and court system as I have had superstar machinists people moved up into supervision that should not have been.
    I do not have a problem finding people. I've stood up for the "young and new" generation here many times and have a waiting list of people who want to come back and work for me if I had the work.

    Not sure why you have have such an attitude towards shop owners or managers. I'd guess some bad experiences have tainted your thinking and for sure there will always be asshole bosses.
    My "team" over the many years is coming up on 500 men and women. Each and every one cared for as if my own blood. This is why your attacks on me hurt so much and why I respond.
    No matter what you say I give a shit about those I work with. Many have gone to greener pastures, the others I fear that I have failed.

    Not sure what kind of man I am but I try the best I can. Judge me as you will with what knowledge you have but there is no need for this fight.
    Bob
    What a speech. Your spots changed. A apology from you would be ok with me.

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    Age
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    Overall health?


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    Ox

  22. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    I don't think I am trolling.


    Confused on the overweight thing. This would be a clear violation of employment rules. Perhaps it was in the discussion of health insurance and meant as a poke.

    Bob
    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    I like to poke and light up things..... Note taken. Yes, that was a bit much and overboard but that makes for debates.
    I apologize but still want to light a flame or thinking.
    I have no disrespect for Trueturning and that was not intended, it was a stick poke or sword swipe and I expect the same back.
    Bob
    FYI, this is the very definition of trolling. Are you that unaware of yourself and your public presentation?

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  24. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mud View Post
    FYI, this is the very definition of trolling. Are you that unaware of yourself and your public presentation?
    You make a good point.
    When all this open computer communication stuff started it was hoped that it would be a good exchange of ideas for and against.
    Like if you thought COBOL was better than FORTAN and that you could talk thoughts that may spark other's thinking into different directions.
    Perhaps opening minds to strange and different thoughts for the good of all.
    Yet it has become a place to wall in and defend your box at all costs.
    I like debates even when I play the devils side. Perhaps there is no use for this on the net now which is sad and not the intention of the founders.
    As to my public presentation, I'm a rebel, black sheep and always have been, too late in life to change that now.
    I will shut up as requested.
    Bob

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  26. #98
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    Back to chairs.

    New sign on shop wall:

    Beatings will continue until morale improves.

    Signed, new boss.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    I will shut up as requested.
    Bob
    Please don't.

    You & I have disagreed civilly on a few occasions, agreed on a number of others. That's all that's required IMO - civility.

    God knows I like shit-stirring on occasion.

    PDW

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  30. #100
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    Why do trolls deny being trolls? Just own your behavior. Our leading resident troll denies both being a troll and his political affiliation.


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