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Hard to find material's and material specs that not many carry.

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Kaszub

Hot Rolled
Joined
Dec 1, 2014
Got a bunch of quotes and cant find material.
Why is 2014 T651 AMS-QQ-A-225/4 so hard to find same goes for 2024-T851 not to mention it has to be USI ultrasonic inspected.
Little better situation with 7050 but still out of 6 of my vendors only one sent me his quote and he is like way out of state.

Anyone has a supplier they would share info.

Thanks
 
Kaszub said:
Got a bunch of quotes and cant find material.
Why is 2014 T651 AMS-QQ-A-225/4 so hard to find same goes for 2024-T851 not to mention it has to be USI ultrasonic inspected.
Little better situation with 7050 but still out of 6 of my vendors only one sent me his quote and he is like way out of state.

Anyone has a supplier they would share info.

Thanks
Click to expand...

I feel your pain on that one.. Spend more time trying to find the material than actually doing the job,
and after you've wasted a ton of time, with no success, you go back to the customer and they say, "Oh you
can make it out of this COMMON, EASY TO GET material".... That's why "generally", if I can't source it quick
and easy, I quote "machine only", and I know for some that isn't an option...

I suggest getting a copy of one of the aluminum heat treat specs.. I've got mil-h-6088 on my desktop..
Its free at everyspec. And then you can work your way through the heat treats.. Sometimes, like
with 2024 T851, its not that common, and you end up buying some T351, and then its a simple time and
temp to bring it to a T851... 12 hours at 365 to 385.. Same with the 2014 T651 is a T451 cooked
for 10 hours at 340-360.

What sucks is when there is that little extra hanging '1' on the end, like T6511, which is basically
the same damn thing, but it was straightened or some stupid thing..

Also, on the ultrasonic inspection.. Ask your supplier, most of the folks that are supplying
certified material *SHOULD* understand this, and they *SHOULD* have a vendor that can supply the
service before they even ship you the material.
 
Might try Aviation Metals

I'm like Bob, if it's hard to find and not much quantity I will ask the customer to supply.

It's gonna come from an aerospace metals specialty house either way- your normal supplier is just going to source it from one of them and mark it up to you.

The specs are not unusual for an airplane part. If it's an STC'd part I don't even ask for an alternate material, I know the answer will be no. If it's not an STC'd part it's worth asking for an alternate.

If you have to heat treat, you will need a cert for that too- so that kind of rules out home heat treating.

I'd give the full spec including the USI requirement to an aircraft metals specialty house, and be sitting down when they give you the price. You should get the ultrasound cert when you get the material.
 
Thanks everyone.
No substitutes allowed, wish it was that simple.
I have local vendors for both heat treat and USI.
Future metals i know ,they did not send me a quote back.
 
jancollc you were not kidding and i knew that from past

7050 3.50 T7452 HAND FORGINGS USI
3.5000 in sq x 9.4500 in gr
AMS 4108, AMS STD 2154, CLASS A 10pcs @290.00 each

I ma not saying it is a bad price it is just sooooooo much more than 7075 of any flavor evne when i have to do USI
 
Kaszub said:
jancollc you were not kidding and i knew that from past

7050 3.50 T7452 HAND FORGINGS USI
3.5000 in sq x 9.4500 in gr
AMS 4108, AMS STD 2154, CLASS A 10pcs @290.00 each

I ma not saying it is a bad price it is just sooooooo much more than 7075 of any flavor evne when i have to do USI
Click to expand...

Hadco is in NY I have used them for mil spec and ITAR requirements...maybe fry steel also.
 
both Hadco and Fry no quote all of 2014/ 2024 and 7050, really only Yarde came with 2024 T581 offer but no USI

Thats why i am asking here.
 
Kaszub said:
both Hadco and Fry no quote all of 2014/ 2024 and 7050, really only Yarde came with 2024 T581 offer but no USI

Thats why i am asking here.
Click to expand...

Try copper and brass... They have a pretty good selection of aluminum, and will saw to size.. They had
7075 T73511, and worked with me when I was looking for T78511. They understand DFARs compliant. And
when I needed 12 feet 4 inches of material.. The girl on the phone "those are random lengths, I'll
just make sure he pulls a long one.".

I got some some 2024 T851 from them a bit ago.. Round, they didn't have flat bar. But they had it.
Cheaper than Bralco.


And I have some 2014 sitting out here, 2 big 13 foot long I-beams.
 
2024-T851 is common. A bit less common USI. If you provide form/sizes, I could make some suggestions. 2014 is a tough one. Last I looked, I think I only found stock at Copper and Brass and Central Steel and Wire. Both only had a couple sizes.
 
Does it make sense to get an independent analysis done of the raw materials? Haven't there been some cases of "counterfeit" materials, which certs or no could screw you over if there's an issue with the parts?
 
Kaszub said:
Got a bunch of quotes and cant find material.
Why is 2014 T651 AMS-QQ-A-225/4 so hard to find same goes for 2024-T851 not to mention it has to be USI ultrasonic inspected.
Little better situation with 7050 but still out of 6 of my vendors only one sent me his quote and he is like way out of state.

Anyone has a supplier they would share info.

Thanks
Click to expand...

I did not read through the posts yet, so it may have been stated above:

AMI metals in Ca for plate, 2124-t851 QQA-250/29, 2024-t851, etc.

When it comes to 4-5" round 2024-t851, very few places stock, or even care to look for (unless mill qtys are needed) beyond Thyssen Krupp/ Online Metals. Selection is limited, and you WILL feel it in the pants, but if it's all you have.....;)

Also, Bralco metals was a good option, but as of late, not so much.

Castle ~used~ to carry T851, but no more....:skep:

It is getting harder and harder to locate "real" aerospace grade aluminum..... At least in the quantities I usually look for.

Doug.

ETA: I didn't see/read the USI requirement. I don't think any of my suppliers will offer it up that way.
 
Last edited:
We've been struggling with customers to get other materials substituted for 2017 here. We can't get it anywhere after evidently decades of no trouble (this is all legacy business from before we bought the place). I'm 99% that Central Steel and Wire was our go-to for these odd Al alloys but I'd have to run it by our purchaser.
 
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