Hard Time Getting a Machine Quote

boosted · Aug 3, 2015

I'm having a seriously hard time getting a quote for a new lathe, and it's really pissing me off.

On Friday I made the three hour trip from my home to the new shop so I could meet with a salesman. He knew that it was a giant PITA to meet up in person. 30 minutes past our scheduled meeting I had to call HIM to find out WTF was going on. He had an emergency and couldn't make it, but had plenty of time to give me a sales pitch over the phone. Apologized and said he would email quotes over ASAP. Yet as I type this; haven't seen a damn thing. The other company is at least willing to do everything over phone/email, but still not really very responsive.

When are these stupid OEM's going to change their archaic sales process? Haas is kicking the shit out of everybody with a mediocre (at best) product. I think it's hugely because people don't have time for this bullshit.

Just tell me how much your product costs and when I can buy it!

Weasel · Aug 3, 2015

Find out who the territorial sales manager is, and give him a call. If that doesn't work, you should stay away from them.

2outof3 · Aug 3, 2015

Call the regional for the builder not the distributor if you don't get satisfaction from the distributor.

boosted · Aug 3, 2015

barbter said:
If the sales are like this, what must the service be like?

I can't agree more. And unfortunately I think it's an industry wide problem. Would love to see the OEM's take responsibility for sales and service directly. Has anybody in the NorthWest been particularly impressed withed the support side of a new machine purchase?

Mcgyver · Aug 3, 2015

boosted said:
On Friday I made the three hour trip from my home to the new shop so I could meet with a salesman. He knew that it was a giant PITA to meet up in person. 30 minutes past our scheduled meeting I had to call HIM to find out WTF was going on. He had an emergency and couldn't make it,

this is the description of a shit - complete disregard for others. Whatever the emergency, you notify your appointments.

DouglasJRizzo · Aug 4, 2015

boosted said:
Would love to see the OEM's take responsibility for sales and service directly.

No you wouldn't. Dealing with a huge corporation is going to be way worse than dealing with a distributor.
Can't judge 'em all by the acts of one..

metalmaster10 · Aug 4, 2015

I couldn't get a quote from our local Doosan dealer. 200k in hand for a new turn center, 4 emails and phone calls looking for a quote and comparison on 2 of their machines.... Nothing.
I had it boiled down to 2 machines, told them the exact options I wanted. Didn't get a quote. So, I didn't buy from them!
On the flip side, haas guy was trying hard to get me one of theirs, buy I didn't feel this was their strength. It probably would have done ok for our work. At least when I call or email the haas guys I get answers back.
The only other sales guys I have had try as hard as haas was DMG, but no way! Been down that road and its not a good one.

g-coder05 · Aug 4, 2015

Haas is kicking the shit out of everybody with a mediocre (at best) product.

My mediocre Haas (all 26 of them) are cranking parts out 16 hours a day 6 days a week while your looking for a reliable distributor. Perhaps you should drop them and keep searching for someone as reliable as Haas. Maybe you could just run out buy a Mori or Mazak? They have a great service and sales office just south of you. I'm sure they will respond quickly. Good luck with your search.

boosted · Aug 5, 2015

g-coder05 said:
My mediocre Haas (all 26 of them) are cranking parts out 16 hours a day 6 days a week while your looking for a reliable distributor. Perhaps you should drop them and keep searching for someone as reliable as Haas. Maybe you could just run out buy a Mori or Mazak? They have a great service and sales office just south of you. I'm sure they will respond quickly. Good luck with your search.

Both Mori AND Mazak dropped their Pacific NorthWest distributors this month... I was stood up by the distributor for another popular Japanese brand. Looking into a couple of Korean machines as well.

I'm considering Haas as the nuclear option. They would be a much more serious contender if they were priced a little better. I don't need a big Japanese machine, but when it's the same price that should be a no-brainer. Too bad the support infrastructure sucks.

2outof3 · Aug 10, 2015

boosted said:
Both Mori AND Mazak dropped their Pacific NorthWest distributors this month... I was stood up by the distributor for another popular Japanese brand. Looking into a couple of Korean machines as well.

I'm considering Haas as the nuclear option. They would be a much more serious contender if they were priced a little better. I don't need a big Japanese machine, but when it's the same price that should be a no-brainer. Too bad the support infrastructure sucks.

I saw that you have a new Mazak dealer. Have you been told directly that Mori made the move? I know this has been a rumor for awhile. Not just your area by the way.

boosted · Aug 11, 2015

Pretty sure the Mori/Ellison split is finally happening on the whole West Coast. I was told that directly.

Based on my experience with Mazak's recent move though; the people who will be involved probably don't know any more than we do. It doesn't appear to be a well managed industry.

StreetSpeed · Aug 12, 2015

I made an online quote for a HAAS UMC750 and asked someone to get ahold of me ASAP. Salesman rolled in 10 days later on an unrelated note and said "oh yeah, I'll get that to you." I bought a Mazak 5 axis in that 10 day period, and still haven't gotten a price from him 2 weeks later. Really boils down to the distributor - I'm sure Haas would have loved to sell me a machine (woulda been my 7th Haas) but I guess the distributor didn't care enough.

SND · Aug 12, 2015

boosted said:
Just tell me how much your product costs and when I can buy it!

So... how much you got to spend?

Sadly this is going on with every industry, it's frustrating, and only made worse when it comes to machines that cost as much as CNC's.

I didn't know such a shake up was going on, is it supposed to be for the better, or what's behind it?

nofxz · Aug 13, 2015

Just I know.
Hey guy, I am about to spend half the value of your house. Could ya send me a email with some numbers you looked up in a binder and added on a calculator then typed into a email. A god damn real estate agent will meet you at 10 or more random houses and by the math I bet the real estate on makes slightly more.

tangent
Looking at screw air compressors right now for my shop. Same shit, different machine. Oh, you really you have a dealer network and I can't contact this other person because you charged the other guy money to sell your stuff with in a specific region. And I will need a rocket mc scientist to read the binder.

If anyone can point me at a compressor seller that works like haas. I will buy one just to prove a point as long as it isn't as loud as my queen rickshaw(princess auto) or with the same poor build quality.
tangent over

If they were not working for a sales commission, I could understand the Mcdonalds services provided but they make several times as much and atleast that guy can tell ya using his cash register, how much those fries will be.

forgive me rant

Moriboy · Aug 13, 2015

I'm curious, what Japanese machine compares in price to Haas?

boosted said:
Both Mori AND Mazak dropped their Pacific NorthWest distributors this month... I was stood up by the distributor for another popular Japanese brand. Looking into a couple of Korean machines as well.

I'm considering Haas as the nuclear option. They would be a much more serious contender if they were priced a little better. I don't need a big Japanese machine, but when it's the same price that should be a no-brainer. Too bad the support infrastructure sucks.

hanermo · Aug 13, 2015

Me too.
Would love to see a quote or specs..

Moriboy said:
I'm curious, what Japanese machine compares in price to Haas?

cnctoolcat · Aug 13, 2015

I'm curious, what Japanese machine compares in price to Haas?

By the time you option a Haas out to be equivalent, there are several Japanese vmc's that are in the same ballpark, price-wise. The Okuma 560, Mazak Smart vmc, Mori's "value line vmc" (whatever they call it now) for example.

Now granted these "Japanese" machines may be built in Taiwan (Mori an Okuma), or America (Mazak).

And by ballpark I mean within 5 to 10% of the cost of a Haas. If you're gonna spend $110k for a Haas, you would be silly not to consider another brand of high-quality machine that costs $120k. Some people are silly though...

ToolCat

Bobw · Aug 13, 2015

cnctoolcat said:
By the time you option a Haas out to be equivalent, there are several Japanese vmc's that are in the same ballpark, price-wise. The Okuma 560, Mazak Smart vmc, Mori's "value line vmc" (whatever they call it now) for example.

Now granted these "Japanese" machines may be built in Taiwan (Mori an Okuma), or America (Mazak).

About 7 years ago I was looking at new machines.. Had a quote on my desk for a Mazak 510C (the 40x20vmc), and
Haas had their stuff online... Once you optioned the Haas up to get close to the base Mazak, it was right
there on price, and it still had less of a spindle, slower rapids, less mass, and that stupid chip auger thing.

Too many options... I'm not sure if it still is but "circular interpolation" used to be an option. This isn't 1978
anymore...

Seems they should go the way some car companies went, instead of having everything be an option, a few packages...
Bare bones, better and best. At least for the basic machines, seems like that could streamline the manufacturing
process.

boosted · Aug 13, 2015

Moriboy said:
I'm curious, what Japanese machine compares in price to Haas?

Sitting on a quote from Okuma that is damn close. The quote from Doosan is actually substantially lower.

Moriboy · Aug 13, 2015

Interesting. I haven't priced a Haas in a few years, thier prices must've come up a lot...

boosted said:
Sitting on a quote from Okuma that is damn close. The quote from Doosan is actually substantially lower.

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