If all goes well I will own my own building in 30 days, what is a C of O?

kpotter · Jan 24, 2013

I am buying a small brick warehouse in the downtown part of Tucson, I have it in escrow right now and I am getting all the inspections done. I was told that I need a certificate of occupancy. What is it and what needs to happen before I can get it. The property is zoned I1 and it is already a sheet metal fab shop, it has been that for more than 50 years. I will be running a machine shop out of there and there are other machine shops on the same street. Do I need an inspection? if so do I get it before I move in or after. Any help is appreciated.

SND · Jan 24, 2013

Around here it usually means that the final building inspection had been done, which is normally at the end of construction when all requirements have been met.
Did such a thing exist 50yrs ago, I don't know.
Of course in other places it might mean something else, right down to having to bring buildings up to current codes.

Best of luck with it going thru and having your own building!

S_W_Bausch · Jan 24, 2013

I'm happy to answer your questions, your success is deserved; I'm happy to see you prosper. However, the Code Enforcement website of your local government probably has that online.

Here ya go, and Good Luck!

The initial search:
how to get certificate of occupancy in tucson arizon - Google Search

Some of the results:

Apply for Certificate of Occupancy | The Official Website for the City of Tucson, Arizona

http://cms3.tucsonaz.gov/files/dsd/C_of_o_Prov_pamphlet.pdf

http://cms3.tucsonaz.gov/files/dsd/C_OF_O-Name_change.pdf

City of Tucson

If the process starts to confuse you, you aren't alone, it seems:

A year ago the City of Tucson’s certificate occupancy ordinance took effect with new requirements for commercial use of existing buildings. It was quickly determined the ordinance was broken and needed to be fixed. And while there was an adjustment in January, nothing more has happened.

“We’ve been working at this for about a year and a half now,” said Rich Rodgers, owner of Rich Rodgers Investments Inc. “We’ve gotten some good changes done to this such as last year when you no longer need an architect’s drawing, but we still have a ways to go before this is really workable. It is unpredictable from time to time.”

atomarc · Jan 24, 2013

Kevin....why ask here of all places? :crazy:

Ask the building officials in Tucson. Congrats on your new building...will we get pictures. Brick buildings are nice.

Stuart

Joe Rogers · Jan 24, 2013

The fire marshal is the biggy. The county issues it and a call to them will give the local details. At least that is how the situation went down when we opened last month.
Joe

kpotter · Jan 24, 2013

You guys seem to know it all so I figured I would ask, funny I never thought to look it up. The building was built in the 30s it is red brick 2 stories high with a loft office space, a couple of bathrooms and best of all AC and Swamp cooling and heat. The company that is in it is a heating and airconditioning company. It has 20ft ceilings with large rafters the floor is concrete not wood, and it has 200amps of 3ph. I got a good deal on it because it has only 3 parking spaces and a small yard. I only need one space and I dont need a yard. I hope I dont have to update the bathrooms or put in sprinklers that would be bad.

Milacron · Jan 24, 2013

kpotter said:
You guys seem to know it all so I figured I would ask, funny I never thought to look it up. The building was built in the 30s it is red brick 2 stories high with a loft office space, a couple of bathrooms and best of all AC and Swamp cooling and heat. The company that is in it is a heating and airconditioning company. It has 20ft ceilings with large rafters the floor is concrete not wood, and it has 200amps of 3ph. I got a good deal on it because it has only 3 parking spaces and a small yard. I only need one space and I dont need a yard. I hope I dont have to update the bathrooms or put in sprinklers that would be bad.

Sounds great (except 200 amps is kinda skimpy)...but didn't you just move everything less than a year ago ? :willy_nilly:

S_W_Bausch · Jan 24, 2013

Milacron said:
Sounds great (except 200 amps is kinda skimpy)...but didn't you just move everything less than a year ago ?

200 amps at 240 volts is 75 KVA, which is roughly 75hp. If he insists on staying with manual machines, and just him, it shouldn't be a problem. However, if he gets the CNC bug and moves in 4-5 machining centers, that might be a problem.

200 amps at 480 volts is 150 kva, which is roughly 150 HP.

He was suffering with lack of air conditioning, and perhaps suffering under the same roof as immediate family

kpotter · Jan 24, 2013

I did just move but found that no heat no cooling and other issues to be a deal breaker. I have been looking for years for the right deal. Everything that I could afford was trashed, and in bad areas. This had been on the market for less than a couple of hours when I made an offer on it. There was no sign out I got an email from an agent and it was in a list of properties but this one had a crazy low price but no pic, I google earthed it and saw the street view and hauled ass over to it to see if it was real. I asked the current occupant if it was for sale and he said that he didnt think so. He had been renting it for 35 years. I had a full price offer in the next day and it in escrow two days later. So as long as it is not a toxic waste dump I will own it. I cant wait to have cooling in the summer, I had heat exhaustion 2 times last year.

Admin5 · Jan 24, 2013

S_W_Bausch said:
200 amps at 240 volts is 75 KVA, which is roughly 75hp. If he insists on staying with manual machines, and just him, it shouldn't be a problem. However, if he gets the CNC bug and moves in 4-5 machining centers, that might be a problem.

200 amps at 480 volts is 150 kva, which is roughly 150 HP.

He was suffering with lack of air conditioning, and perhaps suffering under the same roof as immediate family

Most homes are 200 amps. My shop is 600 amps 480 volts and I thought that was a little skimpy for a 15,000 sq foot industrial building. I wasn't thinking in terms of the individual use but in terms of property value.

Milacron

wrustle · Jan 24, 2013

Congrats Kevin! Hope all goes well for you!

Nothing like having your own building instead of putting money in someone else's pocket.

We just closed on ours in December, looking forward to getting in there but dreading the move!!

Best Regards,
Russ

kpotter · Jan 24, 2013

I have 600 amps right now but my machines are old and dont need gobs of power. The sub station for the electric company is across the alley and the shop next door has hundreds of amps they are running a lazer. I should be able to close pretty fast with any luck. When I moved out of my house the riggers started taking pictures because they had never seen anything so packed in before. The owner said to his guys" take a good look fellas this is as bad is its ever gonna get." When I move this time it will be easy you can run a semi through the building. The new place should be no trouble as well 20ft roll up door on both ends they can drive right through. It took a total economic collapse for me to be able to afford machines and a building, the industrial realistate broker calls guys like me cockroach manufacturing, because we never die no matter how bad things get.

strength and pow · Jan 24, 2013

When I got my C of O, the space was empty except for a fire extinguisher on the wall. Pretty hard for an inspector to find issue with an empty space.
Not sure if you are planning on doing any work on bathrooms, walls etc that would require permits, inspections etc. If so, you could potentially have to comply with current ADA standards on the bathrooms, wheelchair access etc.
Best of luck. Usually this time of year I am in Tucson for the AGTA show, it gets crazy down there. I grew up in Mesa, no clue how you survived the summer without AC, brutal

kpotter · Jan 24, 2013

The bathrooms are not ada but doing it empty sounds like a good way to go. Stop by if you are here during the show. I am having an open shop, I make tools for jewelers.

rbent · Jan 24, 2013

I don't know much about the C of O but hopefully congrats on the new building, you could certainly use more room and it was good to meet and get to sit down and talk with you earlier this month.

-Ryan

cretedog · Jan 24, 2013

Congrats Kevin! Hope your deal and move both go smoothly.

JM

S_W_Bausch · Jan 24, 2013

Admin5 said:
Most homes are 200 amps. My shop is 600 amps 480 volts and I thought that was a little skimpy for a 15,000 sq foot industrial building. I wasn't thinking in terms of the individual use but in terms of property value.

Milacron

The parking lot (of 3 spaces) would be a problem for most tenants. Of course, if metered parking or public parking was nearby, 3 spaces would only be a problem if 4 people thought they deserved "at the door" parking.

Or someone sued for handicapped parking.... and there are lawyers that prosper simply by suing small businesses for ADA transgressions. It's simpler for most folks to roll over and pay the lawyer's fees and proposed settlement.

Lucky for Kevin, the guy I am thinking of is in California:
lawyer makes a living suing for ADA violations - Google Search

Targeting ADA Violators

strength and pow · Jan 24, 2013

kpotter said:
The bathrooms are not ada but doing it empty sounds like a good way to go. Stop by if you are here during the show. I am having an open shop, I make tools for jewelers.

I would love to stop by. Unfortunately, I will be in Miami setting safes for the Original Miami Beach Antique Show. We rent safes to the exhibitors. You ever get to Vegas for JCK?

kpotter · Jan 24, 2013

I used to show at jck I had a booth there, I stopped after 2007 my sales just fell apart. I used to do that show and wonder how the hell I was going to pay for all the booth fees and hotel costs. I did well at it but dang did they suck every dime out of you.

Chip Chester · Jan 25, 2013

Another vote for inspection while empty, and no immediate remodeling. Around here, parking spaces are driven solely by square footage of the building, forcing massive parking lots for some businesses that don't really need it. Maybe try to speak with some real estate attorneys in your area, to see how to play it. If you classify as an artist's studio rather than manufacturing, then you might get by on some details.

If there are code issues that are triggered by change in ownership, maybe re-structure your purchase to be a 'lease' with a 99% downpayment and lease payments of the remaining 1%... at least until they get their "broken" ordinance fixed.

Hopefully you can fire up some A/C this summer. You've earned it.

Chip

If all goes well I will own my own building in 30 days, what is a C of O?

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