Is it just me, or is finding/buying used eqpt a major hassle?

pgmrmike · Sep 5, 2018

Been looking for another CNC Lathe and having flashbacks of the last time I bought one. Literally only about half of the dealers I RFQ a machine shown on their site even respond. A few I have talked to on the phone promised to email a quote but never did. Several dont actually have the machine they are advertising, it has already been sold. I dont get it.

Or I ask for all pics, relevent info such as hours etc and I get one picture with model number and year. Seriously?

Maybe Im just jinxed.

Aejgx6 · Sep 5, 2018

A lot of folks try to broker sales. I love seeing the same machines for sale by different people.

HOMESTEAD · Sep 5, 2018

I think dealing with dealers of anything is a major pain if you're buying used. I'm sure there's exceptions, but all I see is ridiculously over priced junk, even factoring in the haggle factor. I'd rather buy directly from the owner or at auctions.

lazz · Sep 5, 2018

Have you bought a used car recently.... Its kinda like that...

Joe Miranda · Sep 5, 2018

It's just you.

pgmrmike · Sep 5, 2018

lazz said:
Have you bought a used car recently.... Its kinda like that...

Yes I have. But for me, this is worse. Today I asked for a quote for a specific machine on a brokers site, along with more pictures, hours and any other info they have.

Below is the response I got:

Hi Michael –
*
I received your web inquiry, thanks for reaching out.

Few questions:

Why are you looking to buy?
Timeline?
Budget?

( its me again )
Now, I admit Im probably being a bit critical because Im irritated, but really? Why does it matter why I want to buy it? I have money. You ( supposedly ) have a machine. Isnt that enough? Please give me all relevent info and price, thank you

*

pgmrmike · Sep 5, 2018

Joe Miranda said:
It's just you.

Do you have any tips? Or dealer names? I absolutely would love to learn what I need to to make this process easier, more efficient.

drom68 · Sep 5, 2018

I have had similar issues. Tried to get additional information on a cnc and it took a week with several calls. Wanted additional pictures of underneath the way covers, the guy said "I think it is safe to say they are in good shape".

Dealing with private owners only from here on.

DDoug · Sep 5, 2018

pgmrmike said:
Yes I have. But for me, this is worse. Today I asked for a quote for a specific machine on a brokers site, along with more pictures, hours and any other info they have.

Below is the response I got:

Hi Michael –
*
I received your web inquiry, thanks for reaching out.

Few questions:

Why are you looking to buy?
Timeline?
Budget?

( its me again )
Now, I admit Im probably being a bit critical because Im irritated, but really? Why does it matter why I want to buy it? I have money. You ( supposedly ) have a machine. Isnt that enough? Please give me all relevent info and price, thank you

*

Post up here the name of the dealer, and the name of the salesperson.

Then, after some "What a dope" postings, send a link to this thread,
to the salesperson, showing them what real people think of their tactics.

Danny VanVoorn · Sep 5, 2018

Buying used in my area, St. Louis is not like it used to be. When I started 30 years ago there were a fist full of yellow page adds for new and used, now there is a total of two pages of dealers and all are new. Used to be able to go down town and park and was in walking distance of 4 different dealers ware houses full of used machines, all are closed now. The new dealers are scattered all over several counties now and the last time I used any was for parts for a machine they were that brand dealer for.
Live auctions are gone in this area too for the most part, seems they dried up about 10 years ago. In the last 10 years I have only been to about 1 per year that were genuine sold to the highest bidder auctions, a couple were a guy trying to get top dollar out of a bunch of antiquated junk with the option of pulling it out of the auction if he didn't like the price. I told the auctioneer never to send me a notice on another of his sales without notice of that practice. After showing up and hanging around to buy some things only to have it pulled really made me mad.
I have a feeling most dealers are used machine brokers now and the money involved is not that great, plus the machines are all questionable with none really knowing what they have. It sounds like a good way to run into dis satisfied customers and nothing but head aches from that business model?
Dan

cincy k · Sep 5, 2018

I find it difficult to sell as an owner. I have a nice vmc now I'd like to move just to give myself some growing room for 5 axis stuff but it's tough. Let me know if there's any interest.

Bobw · Sep 6, 2018

Of course its a pain in the ass.. Just the way the world seems to work now a days.

Things that have worked, sort of, for me..

Are you in with your local salesmen? The Mazak guy, or the Haas guy? They're in everybody's shops and
can keep an eye out for you.. If its a big dollar sale, they might take a cut as a middle man, but on
the lower $$ stuff (at least here) they'll just put you in contact with the seller.

Cutting tool and materials salesmen(women) also, they are in everybody's shops also..

"networking", do you know the owners of any other local shops? They guy across town that you
haven't met yet might upgrade his lathe if he could get $20k for it, but the dealer will only
give him $13k, even though it might be worth $24k to you...

Also, get on some mailing lists of used dealers.. Premiere in Florida, and I know if you look
at their web site, their prices are crazy, but when they are liquidating a shop, or are selling a
machine for a client, the prices become reasonable, since all they have to do is arrange shipping
from Shop A to Shop B and take cut off the top. Talk to the salesman for your area, they will
call you when a trade in or something comes up.. I've had similar experience with KD Capital in
Phoenix.

pgmrmike · Sep 6, 2018

Bobw said:
Of course its a pain in the ass.. Just the way the world seems to work now a days.

Things that have worked, sort of, for me..

Are you in with your local salesmen? The Mazak guy, or the Haas guy? They're in everybody's shops and
can keep an eye out for you.. If its a big dollar sale, they might take a cut as a middle man, but on
the lower $$ stuff (at least here) they'll just put you in contact with the seller.

Cutting tool and materials salesmen(women) also, they are in everybody's shops also..

"networking", do you know the owners of any other local shops? They guy across town that you
haven't met yet might upgrade his lathe if he could get $20k for it, but the dealer will only
give him $13k, even though it might be worth $24k to you...

Also, get on some mailing lists of used dealers.. Premiere in Florida, and I know if you look
at their web site, their prices are crazy, but when they are liquidating a shop, or are selling a
machine for a client, the prices become reasonable, since all they have to do is arrange shipping
from Shop A to Shop B and take cut off the top. Talk to the salesman for your area, they will
call you when a trade in or something comes up.. I've had similar experience with KD Capital in
Phoenix.

I have let basically everyone I know that I am looking. So far nothing has popped up locally. My last 2 machines were local, I lucked out really, both came from word of mouth. Maybe thats all the luck I will get haha.

I actually had a machine lined out till a couple of weeks ago. A broker had one coming out of a shop, a price was agreed pending inspection, but then it was put on indefinite hold, apparently the sellers replacement machine had been delayed and they had to hold on to the one I was buying. No estimated date, nothing. I would like to just hold on but I am swamped and have to get something going.

m98custom1212 · Sep 6, 2018

lazz said:
Have you bought a used car recently.... Its kinda like that...

It's worse much worse..

Fish On · Sep 6, 2018

pgmrmike said:
I actually had a machine lined out till a couple of weeks ago. A broker had one coming out of a shop, a price was agreed pending inspection, but then it was put on indefinite hold, apparently the sellers replacement machine had been delayed and they had to hold on to the one I was buying. No estimated date, nothing. I would like to just hold on but I am swamped and have to get something going.

I'll do you one better. Same scenario, except I had already paid for it, paid for trucking, and the truck was scheduled to pick it up that day...

Seller suddenly says the deal is off.

wheelieking71 · Sep 6, 2018

Bobw said:
Also, get on some mailing lists of used dealers.. Premiere in Florida, and I know if you look
at their web site, their prices are crazy, but when they are liquidating a shop, or are selling a
machine for a client, the prices become reasonable, since all they have to do is arrange shipping
from Shop A to Shop B and take cut off the top. Talk to the salesman for your area, they will
call you when a trade in or something comes up.. I've had similar experience with KD Capital in
Phoenix.

I agree with Bob on KD Capital. Go ahead and sign up on their website to unlock prices.
It works. You will have to give your email. But, they don't spam nearly as bad as most places.
You will have to log-in to unlock prices daily.
Small hassle, but not bad. And, you don't have to talk to anybody unless a machine peaks your interest.
I have bought two machines through them. Smooth and easy.
Resell CNC here in phoenix may be good as well? Mike Mills is the guy I would try to deal with (he was at KD Capital when I used them! LOL)
He is a straight shooter, no BS kind of guy (at least as no BS as a salesman can be). And, the reason I would contact that firm.

kazlx · Sep 6, 2018

I don't understand why it's so hard for these guys to put relevant information in a listing along with a price....

pgmrmike · Sep 6, 2018

Fish On said:
I'll do you one better. Same scenario, except I had already paid for it, paid for trucking, and the truck was scheduled to pick it up that day...

Seller suddenly says the deal is off.

yeah...that would make me want to stab somebody in the face....

( dont worry, I dont ACTUALLY stab people )

Kaszub · Sep 6, 2018

kazlx said:
I don't understand why it's so hard for these guys to put relevant information in a listing along with a price....

Most of the schmucks dont own any equipment they dont even know what it is that they are trying to sell, that is why buying a used machine sucks.

pgmrmike · Sep 6, 2018

Glad yall reminded me about KD Capital. I have looked at their site and signed up before but it hasnt been showing pricing recently . I just re-verified. Thanks

Is it just me, or is finding/buying used eqpt a major hassle?

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