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    Default Prospective employee test

    I'm looking for a test I can give applicants that covers basic machining skills. I'm not looking for tool makers just folks that know about machining and measuring equipment. Anybody have a good one they like?

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    A pump jack shaft or head shaft , using a 4 jaw chuck

    It has both RH & LH threads, A key-way and a turn down if so desired.

    It's simple and should take 2 hrs max. on good manually operated equipment

    measure the threads over wires, make the applicant tram the mill and cut the key-way.

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    I dunno about a machining test. Have you ever walked into a foreign shop and tried to machine something? Good luck. Machine shops are all like labyrinths and it takes years to learn where things are. You won't be able to find a sharp drill or a usable insert. The lathe and mill will have some stupid quirk that everyone is used to working around, but you have no idea how to deal with.

    I've walked into the toolroom at fortune 500 companies and been amazed they could make anything. Asking a guy to make a complex part on the spot is not a good test IMO.

    I can't answer for machining specifically, but I've seen some neat tests for technicians and engineers. One was a packing assembly with maybe 25 parts. You were given a super crappy copy of an old drawing and asked to put it together correctly. At another company, they had a crazy machine with cams and gears and levers. They would disable it in various ways and ask you to tell them how to fix it.

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    I would be cautious having a non employee operate machinery. You might ask your insurance agent about this.
    I once had a prospective boss hand me a blueprint and ask me to come up with a detailed machine plan for the part shown. I got the job.

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    I think a print reading test and some short answer "how would setup" or "how would you inspect" should give some decent insight into their capabilities and knowledge.

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    I used to hire machinists all the time and it is a crapshoot. During the interview process I would walk thru the shop and pick up random tools, cutters, fixtures, etc. and ask relevant questions about their uses. Such as "how fast would you run this tool in 316 stainless, show me how to measure this length, what does this line of g-code do".
    This doesn't guarantee a good hire but it helped me gage their basal knowledge. Plenty of people would tell me they used to run a knitting, washing, plastic injection, etc. machine therefore they were a machinist.

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    This has been hashed and re-hashed before, take a few minutes
    to check the archives.

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    One needs to clear in the job posting that a certian set of skills must be known and the applicant will be expected do demonstrate knowledge of them as part of the interview.

    List some but not all.

    Reason for this is if a person shows up and has some sort of handicap you could be in trouble.

    But having things listed in the job advertisement sets up a gatekeeper function to block certian folks.

    We had a line something like this,
    Must be able to transport a rack mount equipment weighing 75 pounds from warehouse to site via company supplied vehicle then get it from vehicle across as much as 200 ft of loose gravel and or up 3 flights of stairs and into a position 5 feet above the floor without any assistance at any time of the day or night.

    This prevented folks who are in a wheel chair from getting to the interview.

    Without it if they met everything else we could have been required to hire them then supply a helper for any of the common work as reasonable accommodation.



    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk

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    Hiring an additional employee is not a reasonable accommodation. In addition if the conditions you required are not part of the job then you have violated the law. Some day you may have a disability that might require a reasonable accommodation. I hope.

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    Before working in a shop (not even a machine shop technically) I had no idea it was this difficult to find decent employees. Everybody's is either slow or can't even put a sticker on straight. One guy couldn't turn a machine off (a switch and an air line) properly.

    For a machinist position, I would lay out a job using a simple sketch and have all the tools required for the job. Nothing crazy, and stay close for any questions that may arise.

    Also supply deburring tools with the test project. Nobody wants to work with a guy that can't deburr his own parts.

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    Maybe start with the " can you piss in this cup " test.

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    You can have them agree to a 60 day probational period that you can use to determine if the applicant has the skill sets they said they have for the job. We do this all the time, we only do this if the applicant has a decent work history working for other companies in the same field. A test doesn't really measure anything most new hires tend to be nervous at first and then they start to shine once they feel comfortable.


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    Quote Originally Posted by JS View Post
    A pump jack shaft or head shaft , using a 4 jaw chuck

    It has both RH & LH threads, A key-way and a turn down if so desired.

    It's simple and should take 2 hrs max. on good manually operated equipment

    measure the threads over wires, make the applicant tram the mill and cut the key-way.
    Meh... For relevance, I am 43 and started my (official, school) apprenticeship at 20 and I think I only have manually turned threads once or twice. As wes said, I don't think a 'specific' test is a great indicator of anything, especially on unfamiliar equipment.

    Now if I (the applicant) says "ya I can manually turn threads with my eyes closed" and you are looking for 'that' guy, by all means, have him turn you something and see what you get.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    I dunno about a machining test. Have you ever walked into a foreign shop and tried to machine something? Good luck. Machine shops are all like labyrinths and it takes years to learn where things are. You won't be able to find a sharp drill or a usable insert. The lathe and mill will have some stupid quirk that everyone is used to working around, but you have no idea how to deal with.

    I've walked into the toolroom at fortune 500 companies and been amazed they could make anything. Asking a guy to make a complex part on the spot is not a good test IMO.

    I can't answer for machining specifically, but I've seen some neat tests for technicians and engineers. One was a packing assembly with maybe 25 parts. You were given a super crappy copy of an old drawing and asked to put it together correctly. At another company, they had a crazy machine with cams and gears and levers. They would disable it in various ways and ask you to tell them how to fix it.
    On that note, perhaps it is also a test to see IF the applicant wants to work there, after seeing the condition of the machines and tooling...

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    Quote Originally Posted by tdmidget View Post
    Hiring an additional employee is not a reasonable accommodation. In addition if the conditions you required are not part of the job then you have violated the law. Some day you may have a disability that might require a reasonable accommodation. I hope.
    The tasks we posted were the job and that is the point, you list what is expected to perform the job so you can filter out those who are not able to do the tasks required.

    We have arthritis in our feet and walking is painful but we are able to do the above with no assistance but with great pain...It was our job and this was expected.

    We would not consider leveraging any personal handicap to get extra points to get a job...If our limitations prevent us from meeting the job requirements then so be it.

    Yes one must use tasks that are part of expected work otherwise they can get in trouble.

    In example above you would not hire a helper but would send a second person to help which would effect their productivity.

    If it wss seldom then maybe but the example used was common almost weekly work sometimes daily when we were building the network.

    Nothing against hiring folks with a handicap as long as that person meets ALL listed job requirements and can perform the job.

    We had a guy that was colorblind and was punching telco cables and we still cannot figure out how he got them done correctly .
    a person in a wheel chair may not be suitable as a ups driver.

    In a past life we maintained the transit system for a local city where the dispatcher was blind but required to answer phone and dispatch busses and vans while logging in the computer and he was amazing as he recognized everyone by their voice.

    Doubt he could have performed component level repairs though.

    Back to thread...

    If the job requires handling material of certian weight then list that as requirement.

    If one needs to perform a level of math then list it.

    One makes a job description that includes as many skills as are needed to fill the job as this is the gateway.

    If no hr screener then you simply review this list and their resume then in the interview go down the list asking confirmation of each skill.

    If they need to pick up a 50 pound box as a shipping clerk have one ready.

    If they need to be able to layout lines on a sample part or perform some quality control measurements then go out on the floor in the product in area and. Have them demonstrate their skills if they claim they have them.

    A simple help wanted gets many job hungry folks that clog up your system while posting a requirement set usually filters out many unqualified folks making the selection process much easier.

    Bottom line is you get the candidates you ask for so ask for what you need.

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    Probably the best way to ensure a better class of machinists would be a state mandated machinist education.

    As things are it seems to be up to companies how good an education future machinists get. Some companies do an excellent job while too many others just seem to look for cheap labour and cross their fingers that they get lucky.

    In most of Europe to become a machinist requires a form of apprenticeship lasting at least 4 years.

    If I was hiring I'd start with one simple question. "Where's the last place you worked and do you mind if I phone them?"
    Not my only question but a good start.

    Why Germany Is So Much Better at Training Its Workers - The Atlantic

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Quiring View Post
    One needs to clear in the job posting that a certian set of skills must be known and the applicant will be expected do demonstrate knowledge of them as part of the interview.

    List some but not all.

    Reason for this is if a person shows up and has some sort of handicap you could be in trouble.

    But having things listed in the job advertisement sets up a gatekeeper function to block certian folks.

    We had a line something like this,
    Must be able to transport a rack mount equipment weighing 75 pounds from warehouse to site via company supplied vehicle then get it from vehicle across as much as 200 ft of loose gravel and or up 3 flights of stairs and into a position 5 feet above the floor without any assistance at any time of the day or night.

    This prevented folks who are in a wheel chair from getting to the interview.

    Without it if they met everything else we could have been required to hire them then supply a helper for any of the common work as reasonable accommodation.



    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk
    So your add dicriminates against the handicapped.

    I once bought a lathe at a university auction. The department head with all his great wisdom proceeded to face plant the lathe with a fork lift. Lucky no one got hurt, there were bystanders and a few had to jump out of the way. I told department head to go find someone who knew how to drive one of those things. A few minutes later a kid with one arm and a stub, with the fork lift, picked the lathe and proceeded to load it expertly like I've never seen before or since.

    Most handicapped just want to be treated fairly. Many can do more with one arm than the rest of us can do wit two.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mach2 View Post
    So your add dicriminates against the handicapped.

    I once bought a lathe at a university auction. The department head with all his great wisdom proceeded to face plant the lathe with a fork lift. Lucky no one got hurt, there were bystanders and a few had to jump out of the way. I told department head to go find someone who knew how to drive one of those things. A few minutes later a kid with one arm and a stub, with the fork lift, picked the lathe and proceeded to load it expertly like I've never seen before or since.

    Most handicapped just want to be treated fairly. Many can do more with one arm than the rest of us can do wit two.
    That is true but not really relevant.

    EVERY ad discriminates against a wide range of people. That's the entire point, otherwise you'd just say 'Warm body wanted. Start tomorrow'.

    I once used to employ marine engineering & electronics techs. An absolute requirement was the ability to climb vertical steel ladders, be able to work at heights, carry components up to 15kg unassisted and not suffer from motion sickness. Ships are unforgiving places.

    A one armed person simply could not perform those tasks in any manner that would satisfy OH&S, if at all.

    I got a really bad break in my left elbow from a fall while building my house & was banned from going back to sea until I could pass a fitness test that included climbing a net-based ladder for a vertical distance of 9m while carrying a 10 kg backpack. Took quite a bit of physiotherapy and time before I could pass.

    PDW

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    Quote Originally Posted by PDW View Post
    That is true but not really relevant.

    EVERY ad discriminates against a wide range of people. That's the entire point, otherwise you'd just say 'Warm body wanted. Start tomorrow'.

    I once used to employ marine engineering & electronics techs. An absolute requirement was the ability to climb vertical steel ladders, be able to work at heights, carry components up to 15kg unassisted and not suffer from motion sickness. Ships are unforgiving places.

    A one armed person simply could not perform those tasks in any manner that would satisfy OH&S, if at all.

    I got a really bad break in my left elbow from a fall while building my house & was banned from going back to sea until I could pass a fitness test that included climbing a net-based ladder for a vertical distance of 9m while carrying a 10 kg backpack. Took quite a bit of physiotherapy and time before I could pass.

    PDW
    True regarding the add. Tony Quiring clearly states in his post that the ad is written to discourage wheelchair applicants. It is the employer who is discriminating.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SND View Post
    Maybe start with the " can you piss in this cup " test.
    Talk about "weeding" out the applicants ... ! But I'm curious: would the test be based on aim, volume, or content?



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