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  1. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by jancollc View Post
    The outbreak in Washington was not discovered by testing....
    Exactly. There weren't no testin'.

    It's more than speculation but less than scientific certainty. IOW, it's based on the modeling. Predicted course of the epidemic with no interventions, with 40% of the country practicing social distancing, with 60% of the country practicing social distancing, etc. Not perfect, but not a complete guess either.
    I'll accept that. (A reference could illuminate me.) It's only modelately speculative.

    It's not going to be uniform. The various clusters have not developed at the same rate. It will be NY peaking in 2 weeks, New Orleans a week past that, etc.
    You're a lot more confident and optimistic than I am. No one knows till afterward, and maybe not even then.

    This hits every city on the planet sooner or later. ... 100K deaths in the US is well within the range of possibility for this cycle.
    Agreed. Or more. There are still governors scoffing at restricting movement.


    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post
    Because they got out ahead of it.

    We did not

    Because, you know, it was nothing, one guy, totally under control
    Yup. Cheap measures done early = expensive ones done late, at best. But to be fair, South Korea and Japan have more centralized health care, and their experience with SARS was a wakeup call. They had something of a system in place. I hope that the US will pay more attention and be better prepared next time around.

  2. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    Not sure where you get your news, but I have been reading maybe ten articles a day, on a half dozen different news sites about this. The general scientific reaction is- Horseshit. One doctor in France gave this to 24 people. Many studies that used far more people, over far longer than 15 days, have shown that chloroquine has serious side effects, and very spotty results when used against viruses.
    The French guy is a real doctor, but also a huge publicity hound, he has "co-signed" over 3000 medical studies, almost all done by others.

    The chinese actually did some testing of this drug in wuhan, and found it didnt work.

    here is a scientific response- Could Chloroquine Treat Coronavirus? - Scientific American

    That's kind'a what I was finding on search this morning, but couldn't understand how it seemed to work so great for the Frenchie, and then ... nothing....


    ----------------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox

  3. #263
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    It will not actually be known if it works or does harm until there's been a longer controlled test. A very real problem in medicine in general and with covid-19 in particular is that people often get better regardless of treatment (and some die regardless of treatment - ventilators are FAR from a panacea.)

    The only good news is there is, and will be, huge pressure on this, now.

  4. #264
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    My girlfriend has been on Plaquenil (Prescription name for Hydroxychloroquine) since she was 15 or so.

    We are now seeing reports (only two that I've seen, but I won't be surprised if there's more) of people not being able to fill valid prescriptions due to the insurance providers forecasting an increased demand for this drug.

    It makes her day to day life less miserable, helps keep her immune system from trying to kill the cartilage in her joints.

    If we get denied for a refill, someone is getting reamed.

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  6. #265
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    ... helps keep her immune system from trying to kill the cartilage in her joints.
    Not sure if it was the same pharma or not, but multiple MILLIONS of GI's were on it, 'nam and not-only as an anti-Malarial.

    We were careful. More likely to go light on the dose than heavy. It did have unwanted side-effects, and we knew that.

    But there you have it. "Immune system" it affects.

    So far as I've read, no MD is claiming it cures or prevents COVID-19 at all.

    What they THINK it has done is lessen the severity and reduce the mortality whilst the virus goes ahead and takes its course. Hopefully a shortened course and earlier recovery, too.

    That off the back of the immune system regulating better, not going beserker and doing more damage than the virus itself.

    Which WAS the case, 1918 flu pandemic.

    Hopefully, there will be more "half-vast" pharma partial solutions found.

    If all that does is improve the odds of survival by five percent - or fifteen percent, or shorten the course of the virus by a few days? It slows the spread and lightens the healthcare load.

    So even the smallest increment of advantage or good news we can GET will be better than nothing.

    Al Peyser's way of running a fast-moving bizness applies:

    "Try it. If it doesn't work? FIX it. But fix it FAST!"
    Last edited by thermite; 03-31-2020 at 11:06 AM.

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  8. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ox View Post
    That's kind'a what I was finding on search this morning, but couldn't understand how it seemed to work so great for the Frenchie, and then ... nothing....


    ----------------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox
    the french "test" had one person die from CV19, and three more go into the hospital with it. And one person quit because the side effects were so bad. The doctor had a simple solution- drop all those patients from his statistics- they made him look bad.

    It seemed to work so great only when you left out all the bad parts.

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  10. #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    the french "test" had one person die from CV19, and three more go into the hospital with it. And one person quit because the side effects were so bad. The doctor had a simple solution- drop all those patients from his statistics- they made him look bad.

    It seemed to work so great only when you left out all the bad parts.
    Not sure it was the same test. The first "hopeful" one I read about used the anti-Malarial WITH a previously-approved two-component "cocktail" developed to treat the HIV virus.

    Didn't CURE nor prevent COVID-19. Was not ulitimately so-credited.

    MIGHT HAVE mitigated the duration, severity, and mortality rate.

    Then again, we do already know the immune system is under a form of conscious control.

    Could was even coloured water might help if it gave the patient the calm confidence they could beat the bug?

  11. #268
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    the french "test" had one person die from CV19, and three more go into the hospital with it. And one person quit because the side effects were so bad. The doctor had a simple solution- drop all those patients from his statistics- they made him look bad.

    It seemed to work so great only when you left out all the bad parts.
    I took that stuff for 7 years. It's a relatively mild drug, not sure what side effects would be so bad, unless it's the antibiotic they are combining with it, rather than the Plaquenil.

  12. #269
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fish On View Post
    I took that stuff for 7 years. It's a relatively mild drug, not sure what side effects would be so bad, unless it's the antibiotic they are combining with it, rather than the Plaquenil.
    The "usual" side-effect. Human stupidity.

    As-in "if some if good, more is better". So some folk WILL gobble.

    And THEN yah have a problem. Most any drug .. or even foodstuffs, spices, or Vitamins, actually.

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  14. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    Uhh.... Doesn't sound a whole lot different from what we've been working towards for the last 40 years...
    Are you old enough to have experienced this?

  15. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by EmanuelGoldstein View Post
    That's indeed appalling

    What else is funny is all the reporters etc who are horrified ! horrified, I tell you ! that this data is available. What did they think Google and Facebook do with their telephone numbers ? Why do they think google and the rest so desperately try to trick/force you into handing that information over ? "Emergency account recovery" my rosy red ass.

    Talk about naive ....

    And then they think it's awful that the government might (ha ha ha) be able to access this, but it's fine for faceblob and google and tweeter ... as if for-profit companies controlling what you see, hear, read and know is somehow better than a totalitarian government ? Fricking unelected unaccountable google is more powerful than the government where it counts.
    Very true it is the private outfits doing this.

  16. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trueturning View Post
    Are you old enough to have experienced this?
    82.5% of 'em, yes.

  17. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newman109 View Post
    Not worried about TP here. We get the Sacramento Bee newspaper. I never read it 'cause it's totally left-wing, but it's the last paper around and it has a good crossword puzzle. I also save about a month's worth. Soak 'em with some water and they make a great substitute for real TP.

    Lends a new meaning to the term "yellow rag".
    LOL! Usta whinge only when both sets of Sears-Roebuck and Monkey-Ward catalogs ran-out and we had to revert to stripped corn-cobs. Never wonder where the term "rough as a cob" or "corn-hole" originated? Or why Mountaineers tend to be hard-ass folk?

    NOW? Most of us git so many "dream books" in the postbox from vendors of anything from shite tooling to new custom-made windows?

    The only reason to avoid use of them is that printing-ink irritates the arse easily as much as their bullshit sales claims irritates the eye!

    "Back in the day.." I onct bought a gadget called a "log roller" as could turn newsprint into a fair-decent fuel for a Timberline woodstove.. then proved that the 12-month "free delivery" of junk mail could heat a 5 BR home through our mild NOVA winter months for no more cost than dealing with the tending to it.


  18. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    LOL! Usta whinge only when both sets of Sears-Roebuck and Monkey-Ward catalogs ran-out .....
    That brings a big smile, both standard stock in the out-house.
    The days when you dug a hole in the ground and put a small building over it. Then a new hole and you moved it.
    My "storage shed" up north still has a seat. Wife found it and "what the heck, there is a toilet in our shed."
    Once upon a time...
    But it is new world with things like indoor plumbing and so scary to them. We should not discount their fears even if it may seem silly.
    Corncob better than straw?
    Bob

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  20. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    That brings a big smile, both standard stock in the out-house.
    The days when you dug a hole in the ground and put a small building over it. Then a new hole and you moved it.
    My "storage shed" up north still has a seat. Wife found it and "what the heck, there is a toilet in our shed."
    Once upon a time...
    Bob
    Had an ancestor, up-hollow WEST By God Virginia, sort of "suicided" over an outhouse.

    Had gotten mostly bedridden, was told he would have to use a bedpan, being too old and shakey to make it barefoot to the outhouse and back over ice and snow, dead of winter.

    Said he'd do no sech of a thing. S**ting in the HOUSE was dirty!

    Told he had no choice, said he surely DID have. Too old to go for a shit, too old to live, so he just figured it was time to quit shittin' at all.

    Turned his face to the wall, refused food and drink, died three days later.

    I'm told he was only a hundred and three at the time, but wot the hey. Most of us don't make it past 96, and NONE of us have gotten out of life alive yet, so all we can do is keep tryin'.

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  22. #276
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    Neighbor is 98 and approaching another birthday, still has lively sense of humor, cooks and gives food to neighbors, and prior to this virus thing went out to eat and other places with friends fairly regularly. These eye-talians was made tough and more than a few go well into their 90s. An uncle went well into his 90s despite multiple health issues. They built em tough in the old days.

  23. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    Maybe the people around you are lesser idiots than the people around me.

    But around here, after they closed the beaches, they had to dedicate an officer to each public beach access to stop people from crossing the "DO NOT CROSS" police tape over the entrances.

    Over 400 people turned away from ONE beach in a 2 hour period....
    I thought you might still be at work. Are you essential like everybody? Seems they could really get serious about hunkering down and socially distancing. If people have a boat docked up right on the water I bet they will not be stopped if a family or close friends decide on a boat trip. Fishing is essential right?

    If anyone tries to sneak past the guards They will surely be at least fined or fined and incarcerated. The jails need more people to replace the batch they just released.
    Last edited by Trueturning; 03-30-2020 at 09:16 PM.

  24. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trueturning View Post
    I thought you might still be at work. Are you essential like everybody? Seems they could really get serious about hunkering down and socially distancing. If people have a boat docked up right on the water I bet they will not be stopped if a family or close friends decide on a boat trip. Fishing is essential right?

    If anyone tries to sneak past the guards They will surely be at least fined or fined and incarcerated. The jails need more people to replace the batch they just released.
    Medical OEM... Essential. Doesn't matter, our county voted against closing non essential business because the neighboring county did; They figure if we close and they don't, everyone will just go there and spread it around anyway.

    Boating is OK, as long as you don't tie off to other boats, maintain a distance of 50ft between boats, and have no more than 10 people on one boat, per the local Sheriff's office. They did however close all county boat ramps, so you have to have private access to the water. Same with beaches, lots of people still congregating in areas where they have private beach access. As is typical in my area, the rules apply differently, depending on how much money you have.

    Breaking the do not cross line at the beach is a $500 fine and/or up to 60 days in jail.

  25. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    My girlfriend has been on Plaquenil (Prescription name for Hydroxychloroquine) since she was 15 or so.

    We are now seeing reports (only two that I've seen, but I won't be surprised if there's more) of people not being able to fill valid prescriptions due to the insurance providers forecasting an increased demand for this drug.

    It makes her day to day life less miserable, helps keep her immune system from trying to kill the cartilage in her joints.

    If we get denied for a refill, someone is getting reamed.
    That crap is $1100 for 100 pills, holy Toledo. Glad I don't need that stuff as I don't have insurance to cover prescriptions. I take quite a few meds but luckily they are cheap ones, 5 of them plus insulin run just a little over $200 a month.

  26. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    My girlfriend has been on Plaquenil (Prescription name for Hydroxychloroquine) since she was 15 or so.

    We are now seeing reports (only two that I've seen, but I won't be surprised if there's more) of people not being able to fill valid prescriptions due to the insurance providers forecasting an increased demand for this drug.

    It makes her day to day life less miserable, helps keep her immune system from trying to kill the cartilage in her joints.

    If we get denied for a refill, someone is getting reamed.
    My wife takes it also..............needs to take it. As we have no insurance, we can get prescriptions filled anytime. As soon as she started seeing headlines for hydroxychloroquine she got the next nine months of scripts filled................

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