Stainless steel from the UAE, any opinions?

Guest · Feb 26, 2020

Since only recently have I got a hold of crappy stainless 303, 304, and 416 and have been asking for certs, even if the customer does not require them. Common sense tells me Chinese crap has invaded the stainless market. By crappy I am making turned parts only and have got 303 that has to run at lower than 304 speeds and feeds or it turns brown, tears, and has a mottled finish. I have gotten 416 with deep pits in the surface. I have to run what I consider 45 second parts in 3 minutes plus.

Anyway I have grown to trust domestic material or material sourced from Europe. Today I asked for a quote and a cert and it came back as being from the UAE, KHK Scaffolding & Formwork to be exact. Anyone have experience using metal from the middle east?

SND · Feb 26, 2020

From their website it sounds like they do drawing of wire & bars, not an actual mill that melts it, so who knows where the raw material is really from?
I've never seen a cert with their name or from that country.

Guest · Feb 26, 2020

Here is a Jpeg scan of the cert, the PDF was too big to attach.

SND · Feb 26, 2020

Ah ok, melted in Taiwan.
Could be ok, being 3/16 its largely gonna depend on how good a job they do with the HT I guess.
Hard to believe they have to go that far to find 3/16 bars, surely someone in the US still makes that...

guest · Feb 26, 2020

Is it melted in Taiwan? I buy my stainless tubing from Ta Chen. The certs always say Ta Chen on the top.

Ta Chen International is the customer on that cert- they are a US subsidiary of the Taiwan parent company. It looks like they sourced the long product from the UAE.

I have bought 303 rod from Ta Chen that was great. It also said Ta Chen on the letterhead of the cert.

I'm not sure if they really make rod or flat stock in Taiwan. It might only be tube and pipe products, and the rest is outsourced?

Ta Chen Stainless Pipe Ltd. is the parent company in Taiwan.

edit: just saw the note. So it is melted in Taiwan, and drawn in the UAE.

Should be good, assuming it's the same quality I usually get from Ta Chen.

@OP- did you mention NAS in a prev post? I use a lot of their stainless too, I prefer Ta Chen for consistency.

DDoug · Feb 26, 2020

Watch out for SAND inclusions.....

Guest · Feb 26, 2020

guest said:
@OP- did you mention NAS in a prev post? I use a lot of their stainless too, I prefer Ta Chen for consistency.

The NAS was 303, it ran really good.

BT Fabrication · Feb 28, 2020

I see it was from a place in burlington, you buying it From ASA alloys?

Rapid_Tech · Feb 28, 2020

BT Fabrication said:
I see it was from a place in burlington, you buying it From ASA alloys?

Different Burlington buddy.

EmGo · Feb 29, 2020

guest said:
edit: just saw the note. So it is melted in Taiwan, and drawn in the UAE.

I hate to tell you this, but a lot of Taiwan companies have ... errr ... "subsidiaries" across the straits. And they understand psychology.

Street · Feb 29, 2020

Yes sure as sh..t that would happen and from what i hear some Chinese are trying to buy business in the country to convert them......to the mainland.

try this place they have a presence in China but they have a plant in the USA as well check it out
here

Calvert stainless steel plant in AL, USA | Outokumpu

Guest · Feb 29, 2020

Just got some 304 SS from Online Metals it was from North American Stainless looks like if you specify domestic from Online that is what you will get. Looks like NSA melts stainless in the USA, Japan, Spain or South Africa looking at the certs. Since most of my stainless parts are small with quantities 2k or less no big deal paying high per pound prices at Online Metals. I could have saved $72 will calling that UAE material compared to Online , but since it was too little to qualify for free delivery I would have had a 90 mile round trip which would have killed 2+ hours to pick it up.

DanASM · Feb 29, 2020

Dualkit said:
Just got some 304 SS from Online Metals it was from North American Stainless looks like if you specify domestic from Online that is what you will get. Looks like NSA melts stainless in the USA, Japan, Spain or South Africa looking at the certs. Since most of my stainless parts are small with quantities 2k or less no big deal paying high per pound prices at Online Metals. I could have saved $72 will calling that UAE material compared to Online , but since it was too little to qualify for free delivery I would have had a 90 mile round trip which would have killed 2+ hours to pick it up.

I know you are in the middle of no where and shipping can be a pain. I had a rep from SCHMOLZ + BICKENBACH USA: SALES + SERVICES USA stop by a month ago and tell me they would sell me any quantities. Either use a common carrier or send it in tubes through ups or another shipping company.

He said they are the worlds 2nd biggest SS mill. I believe they stock swiss grades as well.

After I was having a problem breaking a ton of taps I was thinking I should have used the same SS supplier as last time. I feel now that I should stick to 1 SS supplier and get used to the way it machines and base any future quotes on that suppliers prices.

I have not used Schmolz yet and I may not ever but I feel like they can be trusted for quality. Its more German/American products as opposed to southeast Asia.

Guest · Mar 1, 2020

Definitely going to stick with one supplier from now on. I am driving myself crazy monkeying around with feeds, speeds, and tooling. Small diameter 303 and 304 seem to run differently every time. Right now I am turning 3/16" 304 at 3,000 rpm and and .001 IPR. Kennametal KCU010 grade 80 degree diamond with a .008 radius. Seems to be holding up, so NAS from Kentucky better run the same next time. I honestly have turned the same size 304 recently from feeds from .0002-.002 and rpms from 1000 to 4000 using at least a half dozen different inserts. It is crazy when everything is the same as last time and it doesn't work.

Gordon B. Clarke · Mar 1, 2020

Why would the UAE or any other rich oil producing company have a steel producing company?

United Arab Emirates - Wikipedia

Some of you should stop looking for "cheap" when you buy.

The companies and countries with good reputations for manufacturing high quality products don't start with "cheap crap". They all add value to quality material.

guest · Mar 1, 2020

Dualkit said:
...Small diameter 303 and 304 seem to run differently every time. Right now I am turning 3/16" 304 at 3,000 rpm and and .001 IPR.

That's pretty slow going.

I find the same thing on the small diameter 300 series. Besides the general unpredictability of 300 series, I think it work hardens it when they draw it.

Stick a magnet on it and see if it's slightly magnetic. The more it's cold-worked, the more magnetic it gets.

Guest · Mar 1, 2020

Gordon B. Clarke said:
Why would the UAE or any other rich oil producing company have a steel producing company?

United Arab Emirates - Wikipedia

Some of you should stop looking for "cheap" when you buy.

The companies and countries with good reputations for manufacturing high quality products don't start with "cheap crap". They all add value to quality material.

Go away, you are a jackass troll. Go insult someone else. No one said anything about shopping for cheap.

Guest · Mar 1, 2020

Dualkit said:
Right now I am turning 3/16" 304 at 3,000 rpm and and .001 IPR. Kennametal KCU010 grade 80 degree diamond with a .008 radius.

guest said:
That's pretty slow going.

I find the same thing on the small diameter 300 series. Besides the general unpredictability of 300 series, I think it work hardens it when they draw it.

Stick a magnet on it and see if it's slightly magnetic. The more it's cold-worked, the more magnetic it gets.

That may be slow but that is the fastest I have been able turn the 304 I have been getting lately without turning it brown or getting a mottled finish. I have a feeling with this material and turn tool I could go faster, but since I have made 300 good parts out of the needed 1500 with the same insert without an offset and no signs of breaking down I will stand pat. I only have one insert left of the type I am using. No one sells turning inserts in my whole state, so if I need some it is a 2-4 day wait. Standing pat is 100% against my nature, I usually always push the limits.

guest · Mar 1, 2020

Dualkit said:
That may be slow but that is the fastest I have been able turn the 304 I have been getting lately without turning it brown or getting a mottled finish.

I wasn't critiquing- I assumed you were running there because that's where it runs.

I find the same thing with the 300 series I get, with the exception of the mill I already mentioned. My experience with NAS has been hit and miss...

I have one part that is 5mm 304. Gets a 3/32 thru. Sometimes I will get 2 holes and the drill is dead. Sometimes I get 100 holes. Just no predicting it.

Guest · Mar 1, 2020

guest said:
I wasn't critiquing- I assumed you were running there because that's where it runs.

I find the same thing with the 300 series I get, with the exception of the mill I already mentioned. My experience with NAS has been hit and miss...

I have one part that is 5mm 304. Gets a 3/32 thru. Sometimes I will get 2 holes and the drill is dead. Sometimes I get 100 holes. Just no predicting it.

So far I am 2 for 2 with NAS, looks like the recent 303 was decent and this 304 is. I will continue to get certs I will try that Tai Chen or whatever it was sometime also. This customer wanted domestic. Interesting you should mention drilling 304 as the same thing happened to me. It was tubing with a .250 O.D. & .084 hole. 4 inch long part that needed two counter bores for a total of 2" and the last 2" left at the .084 stock I.D. With customer supplied stock I used 3 pairs of drills to make 15 parts progressively slowing the feeds and speeds. The next time I got some tubing from McMaster Carr. I ran 30 parts on the same pair of drills and took 90 seconds for the drilling instead of the previous 5 minutes. Fortunately for me most of the bad 303 and 304 has been on short run jobs I can get a decent hourly rate on.

Stainless steel from the UAE, any opinions?

Guest

Guest

Diamond

Guest

Guest

Attachments

Diamond

guest

Guest

Diamond

Guest

Guest

Titanium

Aluminum

Diamond

Hot Rolled

Guest

Guest

Hot Rolled

Guest

Guest

Banned

guest

Guest

Guest

Guest

Guest

Guest

guest

Guest

Guest

Guest

Similar threads