what happens if someone dies in an accident in your shop.
Close
Login to Your Account
Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 78
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    tucson arizona usa
    Posts
    5,047
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    2164
    Likes (Received)
    4679

    Default what happens if someone dies in an accident in your shop.

    The steel yard that I purchase all my metal from had an accident and one of their employees died in the accident. I do not have all the details but it involved an overhead crane. Does workmans comp cover situations like this and what are the liability issues. I hope to never be faced with this, losing a person in an accident would be a horrible experience I hope to avoid.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    1,262
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    738
    Likes (Received)
    388

    Default

    Your insurance agent would know both the long and short answers. And he would most likely offer a walk-through to point out risks.

  3. Likes kpotter, Spinit liked this post
  4. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    11,709
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    18360
    Likes (Received)
    6173

    Default

    You send everyone home for the rest of the day, sometimes the whole week.

    A price will be assigned to the person (gross...yes, I know) there are charts
    and graphs.

    The next of kin is brought in (if they insist) to see the accident scene.

    Have seen it happen a few times (never seen it myself, just the aftermath, not good at all.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    South Central PA
    Posts
    12,922
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    1818
    Likes (Received)
    3003

    Default

    Workers Comp does cover it. OSHA does too, They quickly muster a huge force of inspectors and investigators to examine EVERYthing the company does and doesn't do, especially the documentation, then they assign an enormous fine. Then the real agony begins for the employer and management team, so I hear

  6. Likes Newman109, Oldwrench liked this post
  7. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    2,985
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    4382
    Likes (Received)
    1494

    Default

    Employee....

    Our plant manager came in and made a formal announcement that we had a fatality and asked if everyone was Ok? Everyone was kinda shook up and in disbelief about what happened. Basically he got pinched by a 600ton die cast machine.

    Plant manager said we could stay and finish our shift in the cafeteria or leave and it wouldn'tbe held aagainst us.

    Emergency folks roped off and secured the area pending a investigation. Actually the area was guarded by uniformed city police officers.

    Happened at around 3:45am I left somewhere around 6am. Day shift was scheduled to start a 7:30am. As far as I know except for the direct vicinity of the accident everyone else had a regular day after a group meeting with the plant manager. Although I don't think much got done that day truth be known.

    I never did hear what his wife ended getting out of it. All I know is my wife and kid looked awfully good that morning.

    Brent

  8. Likes digger doug liked this post
  9. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Virginia
    Posts
    22,395
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    7561
    Likes (Received)
    6960

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mud View Post
    Workers Comp does cover it. OSHA does too, They quickly muster a huge force of inspectors and investigators to examine EVERYthing the company does and doesn't do, especially the documentation, then they assign an enormous fine. Then the real agony begins for the employer and management team, so I hear
    By comparison, a GI gets hiself cooked when a 20 Ton Rough Terrain crane's boom draws arc off an 8800 Volt overhead powerline, one lone Company-Grade Officer from some unrelated unit as has had no contact with his unit gets orders cut as Investigating Officer.

    That crane class was on my own Military "Heavy" License, so I were he. The Army Medical Corps Autopsy was not an easy read.

    The poor sod had been where he was MEANT to be - out in FRONT of the crane directing his operator after first eyeballing about FOR such dangers as overhead power lines... instead of leaned up against the spade at the other end of it smoking a joint, he'd not have died.

    Up to his own CO to sugar-coat that one in the letter to his family. The Investigator's report may NOT whitewash a damned thing, no matter who's ox gets gored, US Gummint included..

    Your bigger worry? Someone maimed for life, and NOT kilt. Ask your underwriter.

    Then go and run the safest shop you know how, or can find out how.

    Best any of us can do.

  10. Likes tdmidget, Oldwrench, Spinit liked this post
  11. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    4,954
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    2929
    Likes (Received)
    3244

    Default

    Its an owners worst nightmare, thinking of someone getting badly hurt or killed, a nightmare both at the person level and for the business. Just thinking about it should get you going on practicing good safety procedures, equipment, training and its an ongoing effort, from inspections to toolbox talks.

    As for liability, here it could severe fines even jail if there was a high level of negligence. We try to be by the book, no diy lifting devices unless we have a stamped drawing, annual cert on the cranes, daily inspection of cranes, chains and slings (each on a checklist in a binder), annual stress test on chains, training of each person and so on. All this costs money, its a burden, probably excessively so for a small shop and frankly if you are the owner and on the on tools everyday you know if things are ok or not.....but the gov wienies will go by the paper work/record keeping of above list

  12. Likes Spinit liked this post
  13. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    11,709
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    18360
    Likes (Received)
    6173

    Default

    I get pushback on some of my designs (to make them cheaper), even had a supervisor substitute a material I spec'd without my knowledge (or permission).

    I tell them "It's not your name on the drawing, you won't be sitting in
    the witness box, 'splaining it to a judge."

    It is a constant concern with me, and I take it very seriously.

  14. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    ny usa
    Posts
    319
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    216

    Default

    Anytime someone dies from a fuck up, it's no good. The shittiest part being, even if the deceased was negligent and was the cause, there will always be someone digging for gold.

    I wish all of us the best of luck, and best judgement, as to avoid any tragedies, no matter the cause. We all know the effect.

  15. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Virginia
    Posts
    22,395
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    7561
    Likes (Received)
    6960

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    It is a constant concern with me, and I take it very seriously.
    Once, the unit President, the second time, the founder and Chairman, I had to respond to a direct order with an offer to train my replacement so that they could have a second chance of their will being obeyed, but I could not, would not, had MADE my decision, and it was their turn now.

    Both backed down. Both apologized the same 3 days later for ever asking.

    Rich or poor, the most valuable property a man ever owns is his integrity.

    Ever let them take that, there ain't much left, is there?

  16. Likes Ox, pressbrake1, Oldwrench, Spinit, jariou and 1 others liked this post
  17. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Washington
    Posts
    92
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    23
    Likes (Received)
    33

    Default

    This happened at the company that I work for. There was an OSHA investigation that lasted for years, along with a fine in the millions of dollars,and a settlement with the guys family. Part of the OSHA settlement was a huge change in safety training and company policy.

  18. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Madera county california usa
    Posts
    2,212
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    19
    Likes (Received)
    536

    Default

    Things like accidents get interesting.

    The investigators report is step one.

    There are many private companies that also investigate things with very elaborate equipment like you see on tv.

    When the lawsuit starts it gets real interesting.

    Lesson learned...make your facility safe.

    OSHA gas non-enforcement inspections where you invite them to inspect your facility to look for stupid things.

    They assist in reducing accidents and do not cite you, if they just show up they do.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

  19. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Abingdon, VA
    Posts
    3,192
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    4062
    Likes (Received)
    2633

    Default

    Accidents happen when you least expect it!

    So I always talk safety, diligence, awareness, think, take your time.

    When you stop thinking about safety, and what could happen with what you're doing or going to do, you're opening the door to trouble.

    The first priority in any industrial activity is safety...without it you have nothing.
    Make it a cornerstone of your own thinking, and of your company's culture.

  20. Likes Mcgyver, RJT, Spinit liked this post
  21. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    6,898
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    373
    Likes (Received)
    3025

    Default

    You can preach safety all you want, cover the walls with posters, and hire the most expensive consultants available. But if you, the leader, cut corners when you are in a hurry, think you are alone in the shop, or when safety just gets in the way of production all that training expense just got flushed down the drain.

    You must set an excellent example for your employees, regardless of the cost. Your employees will rarely perform tasks more safely than you do them yourself.

    Safety is as safety does.

  22. Likes charlie gary, Steven-Canada liked this post
  23. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    11,709
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    18360
    Likes (Received)
    6173

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thermite View Post
    Once, the unit President, the second time, the founder and Chairman, I had to respond to a direct order with an offer to train my replacement so that they could have a second chance of their will being obeyed, but I could not, would not, had MADE my decision, and it was their turn now.

    Both backed down. Both apologized the same 3 days later for ever asking.

    Rich or poor, the most valuable property a man ever owns is his integrity.

    Ever let them take that, there ain't much left, is there?
    Got called in to "Help" an outside vendor do a job, making a copy of my existing
    fixture....No skin off my back, but I'm not helping them much.

    Big multinational (that will not be named here) integrating the fixture into a cell.

    i told them "You've got the part 180 backwards, simply switch the program,
    and everything will work much better" As there was in process machined surfaces
    not on the drawing, used for the fixture.

    They refused to simply mirror the program, "No need to" and I explained
    how in addition, unloading the part would be very hard for the operator,
    and could drop & hurt someone.

    They held firm.

    I wrote it all up, my concerns for safety, and ran it up the flagpole, to no avail.

    A few years go by, and lo & behold, in the morning safety report
    is a "near miss" on the exact job, just as I had warned of.

    I quickly made a call, and found out that no one was hurt.
    Even though it was not my design, and I warned of this, I don't want
    to see ANYONE (not even a vendor) get hurt.

  24. #16
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Country
    DENMARK
    Posts
    18,100
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3729
    Likes (Received)
    14154

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kpotter View Post
    The steel yard that I purchase all my metal from had an accident and one of their employees died in the accident. I do not have all the details but it involved an overhead crane. Does workmans comp cover situations like this and what are the liability issues. I hope to never be faced with this, losing a person in an accident would be a horrible experience I hope to avoid.
    I think that any accident at a work place resulting in death would vary depending on:

    1. Carelessness by the person dying

    2. Malpractice by the company

    Of course in both instances proof is crucial. The size (number of employees) of the company is also relevant as it becomes a question of how many knew or worked with the deceased.

    Re insurance then there is both the company insurance policy and any personal insurance. Both my wife and I have personal insurance so neither of us would have financial problems to deal with as well as the tragedy.

    As has been suggested then probably best to talk to an insurance company (or two) for advice. No two incidents (deaths) will require the same actions.

  25. Likes converterking liked this post
  26. #17
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Country
    DENMARK
    Posts
    18,100
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3729
    Likes (Received)
    14154

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    Got called in to "Help" an outside vendor do a job, making a copy of my existing
    fixture....No skin off my back, but I'm not helping them much.

    Big multinational (that will not be named here) integrating the fixture into a cell.

    i told them "You've got the part 180 backwards, simply switch the program,
    and everything will work much better" As there was in process machined surfaces
    not on the drawing, used for the fixture.

    They refused to simply mirror the program, "No need to" and I explained
    how in addition, unloading the part would be very hard for the operator,
    and could drop & hurt someone.

    They held firm.

    I wrote it all up, my concerns for safety, and ran it up the flagpole, to no avail.

    A few years go by, and lo & behold, in the morning safety report
    is a "near miss" on the exact job, just as I had warned of.

    I quickly made a call, and found out that no one was hurt.
    Even though it was not my design, and I warned of this, I don't want
    to see ANYONE (not even a vendor) get hurt.
    I'm trying to figure out if there was any reason you wrote "(not even a vendor)". It reads wrong - at least to me.

  27. Likes converterking liked this post
  28. #18
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Country
    SWITZERLAND
    Posts
    907
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    108
    Likes (Received)
    357

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kpotter View Post
    The steel yard that I purchase all my metal from had an accident and one of their employees died in the accident.
    The way you’re expressing yourself bothers me. The steel yard had an accident? The employee had an accident, I’d say. Humans are the actors, not the things. Probably exactly the cause for the accident, things got more important than humans, to humans. It’s not the coupon clippers who work under a crane. The old disgrace

  29. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    11,709
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    18360
    Likes (Received)
    6173

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechanola View Post
    The way you’re expressing yourself bothers me. The steel yard had an accident? The employee had an accident, I’d say. Humans are the actors, not the things. Probably exactly the cause for the accident, things got more important than humans, to humans. It’s not the coupon clippers who work under a crane. The old disgrace
    If the crane failed (and the employee was not the one responsible
    for having it inspected)
    It was the Yard.

    Who said anything about working under a crane anyways ?

    The OP says "Steel Yard" and "Overhead Crane" and off we go down the road.....

  30. Likes Mud, Newman109, Mcgyver liked this post
  31. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Pacific NW
    Posts
    5,028
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    7
    Likes (Received)
    794

    Default

    OSHA versus WISHA? In the state of Washington we have WISHA. Being in Seattle I never had anything to do with OSHA. When I started in business I called WISHA, not OSHA, for a voluntary inspection prior to hiring employees.

    Until reading this thread I never gave much thought to OSHA. Here's a site explaining the situation.

    About WISHA, DOSH, and OSHA

    Apparently Washington is among only 26 states having their own workplace safety administrations. Now I wonder why Washington set up their own safety bureaucracy when the feds might have done it for us.

    Interesting to see on that site an historical calendar from January 1907 that 60 workers were killed in Pittsburg factories in one month. Kinda makes you wonder if that was a good or bad month.


Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
2