10K Saddle rebuild
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  1. #1
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    Default 10K Saddle rebuild

    I’m rebuilding a 1959 10K bought from an estate sale. (110V back motor) I have the ILION book. Now working on saddle. Mine seems different in some ways from the ILION example. For instance, the 'cross feed screw' had no blind hole for pin wrench – I had to drill one.
    I have some questions/problems -

    1. How do you remove the brass crossslide nut? Mine looks pretty rough
    2. Can’t remove compound from crossslide – one of the locking ‘shoes’ is stuck in there and will not drop out – probably congealed/crystalised lube from the look of encrustations on the gib etc – like shellac. I poured a bunch of PB blaster in the hole and let it sit. Also Acetone. No dice. What deadly solvent is recommended to soften/dissolve congealed oil?
    3. I can’t get the compound to unscrew off its thread – I loosened gib screws, pulled out gib. The ILION book says use a pin wrench, but I see nowhere to use it (lathe has many coats of paint, its possible its painted over (see pics)
    4. Inside faces of compound gauge are finely scored – see pic – should I polish?

    FYI - pic of my slotted wrench for compound ball crank nut – made from a broken spade drill.

    thanks for any advice

    compound-underside.jpgcompound.jpgcompound-wear.jpgslotted-wrench.jpg

  2. #2
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    Keep using Pb Blaster, but you'll probably want to tighten and loosen the set screw repeatedly, rocking the compound if you can, etc.. It may take a whole to get it to break free, but the rust penetrate is only going to be part of it.

    You have to unscrew the compound completely. Once it is out, you have to remove it from the underside, but since you can't get to the underside, you're going to have to get that shoe out.

    I put the compound dial and bushing in the lathe and faced them off. Mine were way worse than that.

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    The nut for compound rest is attached to lower section of compound rest. Its a bit of a rube goldberg to get apart, because the end of the screw is real close to a back wall. So close to the wall, that the nut can't slip between end of screw and that wall.

    I can't find an exact pic, but here's a screw and nut. Note the threads in nut that are perpendicular to the screw. When mounted those threads point down, and the bolt holding it goes up through lower housing of compound.

    Once that is separated, the bushing for screw must be removed to get it out. I used a nylon strap filter wrench to loosen mine.

    53.jpg

    When assembling, you want to leave the bushing and gib out until last to give you play to work the parts.

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    Found a pic. You can see the nut, then a bolt hole where it mounts in lower housing.

    227.jpg 228.jpg

    You can't tell from second pic, but the bushing is out, that's how nut is off the threads with a space in between. Nut must be on screw to start the bushing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by texasgunsmith View Post
    Found a pic. You can see the nut, then a bolt hole where it mounts in lower housing.

    227.jpg 228.jpg

    You can't tell from second pic, but the bushing is out, that's how nut is off the threads with a space in between. Nut must be on screw to start the bushing.
    Thanks for going to the trouble
    this is helpful
    A

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    I seem to recall separating the two halfs requires removing the gib - You can unscrew the entire screw assembly (screw, bushing, dial, handle) from this in the same way the crossfeed assembly unscrews from the saddle. Eventually you'll want to cleanup the grooves on the bushing/dial interface.

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    Default STILL trying to get a locking shoe out.

    Some weeks ago, I posted about a stuck locking shoe. One fell out easily. The other seems to be glued in. I left it soaking. Life got in the way for a while.
    A couple of weeks later - I tried rocking the set screw back and forth, with penetrant - nothing. while wiggling compound - nothing. A friend suggested pulling it out with a strong magnet- no dice. I though perhaps I'd try to glue a shaft on the end of it, but the idea of getting threadlocker in the thread scared me. The obvious if unpleasant idea is to drill a hole in the end of the shoe, deep enough to get a metal-thread screw to bite, So I tried that but - damn thing is hard! Blunted my center punch. I can hardly dent it with a cobalt drill bit.
    ILION book blithely says push it out with a punch !?! Unless I've missed something, there's no way to do that - with the compound still in.
    Not sure what my next move is - I can't service the compound unless its out. Any suggestions gladly received.
    A

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anatol View Post
    Some weeks ago, I posted about a stuck locking shoe. One fell out easily. The other seems to be glued in.
    Please be more specific on your descriptions. Also, post photos of what you are talking about. What is a "locking shoe"? Are you talking about a dial shoe? If so, they shouldn't be hard (actually, they should be brass). If it is a dial shoe, then it shouldn't interfere with you removing a dial if it is still in the hole, provided it isn't jammed against the spindle (if the dial will free-wheel, then it should be able to be removed). Once the dial is off, you can now use a punch to remove it from the hole.

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    Maybe this is a dumb question - but do you have the cross slide off? Can you see anything from the underside? I can't remember what mine looked like when it was apart.

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    @ SLK "Please be more specific on your descriptions."

    I am speaking of the locking shoes (2) (named the way in the ILION book, pt 75, p56) that are pushed against the cylindrical compound base. They are held there by (2) set screws (5/16?)threaded into the cross slide casting, at about 90 deg opposed. Not easy to post useful pics as the stuck shoe is about an inch down threaded hole.
    Last edited by Anatol; 08-27-2021 at 02:54 PM.

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    Oh, you're talking about the compound locking shoes (SB only calls it a "shoe"). It has an angled surface that engages the circular dovetail on the bottom of the compound. You should be able to release it by rocking the compound up and down. As the compound moves, it will slowly push the shoe out of engagement - it may require a LOT of rocking to dislodge it. Also, this part is HARD, as you have found out.

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    @ SLK "it may require a LOT of rocking to dislodge it"

    a lot of rocking has already been done

    Judging from the crystallized shellac looking crud that has accumulated on other parts where oil had sat, the previous owner used some kind of oil that oxidised or otherwise solidified. So its effectively glued in. What fierce solvent is likely to dissolve that? I'm thinking some kind of auto-engine varnish removing fuel additive?
    Its not just a matter of softening it because I can't grab it

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    MyLilMule
    Cross slide is off - and screw and dial removed. Underside of crosslide casting shows the ~1 3/8" round 'foot' of the compound casting, and two ~1/4 threaded holes (purpose unknown). One is half obscured by what would be the left side sliding surface of the crosslide casting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anatol View Post
    What fierce solvent is likely to dissolve that?
    Acetone may work, or you can try soaking the assy in gasoline.

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    I would try soaking the whole thing in kerosene or diesel fuel for a couple days. Break up some of that junk.

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    Thanks guys
    I've got the piece in a vise (soft jaws) in a hot shop, with the hole up, full of PB laster. I'll try that for a few days. If that doesn't work, I'll try the total immersion solution. maybe with gumout or carb cleaner. I suspect PO used engine oil on it.


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