My First South Bend Lathe

Hello everyone. New to this forum, also new to lathes. I have spent most of my adult life as a diesel engine mechanic, predominately in the commercial marine field. I have done some machine work in relation to this, with boring cylinder blocks, line bores,etc, but I am not a machinist by trade. On the side, as well as a hobby, I do some work on firearms, mostly euro com block stuff like AK's and such.

To go with my side projects I thought I would get a lathe to help with turning some barrels for fitment in the euro com block firearms, as well as maybe trying to learn threading and some interesting aspects of lathe work.

Forgive me if some of my terminology is off. Well as I began looking and doing some research and I thought I would prefer an old style lathe, the kind I remembered from some old high school workshops or you might see in old naval tool or machine rooms. I decided on a South Bend lathe, and was hoping for a tool room or engine lathe.

In looking around I found an old South Bend Lathe on a farm here in Texas. Considering the cost these days I got it at a reasonable price, though it needs a lot of work, some pieces are missing, and I am thinking to do a full restoration on it. Also it has a turret type tail stock, I was hoping for the more simple tail stock of a tool room lathe.

I will pick it up in a couple of days. I don't know the serial number yet. But I got some pics of it and some of the tags on the machine. I have what I am sure are very amateurish questions and probably have been answered a million times, haha. I have been doing my best to research on my own, but there is such a wealth of information I may not learn it all in this life.

Once I have the serial number I plan on ordering the serial number card from South Bend, as well as any other literature I may be able to acquire. I understand that turret lathes were meant more for production work.

I guess my first questions would be:
1. Is there a big difference between this lathe and a tool room lathe ?
2. Is there any advantages to me leaving the turret tail stock on, could I/should I replace it with the simpler tool room tail stock ?
3. It is 3 phase, I see people using phase converters. Could a single phase motor be installed, and would that be available from south bend or an outside vendor ?
4. I really like the semi/high gloss battleship gray color I think of for these. Any recommendations on the paint type or where to get it ?

More pics:

Its a Turret Lathe - a 16" - never was an engine lathe. You can tell by the "production" cross slide and no compound rest. The model tag says it all - 2C - though I do not know what the W might be for

The gear box at rear (or right end) provides the ram under the turret with power feed

I had one of similar vintage - the spindle ran in the cast iron of the head stock.

Here is some handy reading material of a general nature

http://campkahler.com/files/How_to_Run_a_Lathe_SB_1of2.pdf

http://campkahler.com/files/How_to_Run_a_Lathe_SB_2of2.pdf

Hmm- powered turret, spindle brake, and coolant system. This might have been the most expensive SB made at that time. Unfortunately, I think lack of tailstock and compound are negatives for your intended use. But, you might be able to work around them.

allan

I see old stuff like this, with "war" placards, and I always wonder what parts they made.

texasgunsmith said:

1. Is there a big difference between this lathe and a tool room lathe ?

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Indeed. Your lathe is setup for "production work", where the lathe is changed over to make high quantities of one part. An ordinary, non turret lathe, or "tool room lathe" to you, is more suitable for one-off's and maintenance/repair work.

texasgunsmith said:

2. Is there any advantages to me leaving the turret tail stock on, could I/should I replace it with the simpler tool room tail stock ?

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Not unless you're opening a museum or planning on doing production runs of single items. Otherwise, a traditional tailstock is probably going to be more useful to you. You can get by with what you got, to be sure, but it's like cleaning the kitchen with a fire hose. Myself, I'd worry more about trying to adapt a CXA toolpost on that somehow, and worry less about the tailstock. The lack of a compound,and how to get one, should rightly be your primary focus as you tear into this project.

texasgunsmith said:

3. It is 3 phase, I see people using phase converters. Could a single phase motor be installed, and would that be available from south bend or an outside vendor ?

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There's an argument for either, but I'd stick with the 3-phase motor and either power it with 3-phase, buy a phase converter, or power it through a VFD. The two big advantages to 3-phase powered lathe are the ability to have (present or future) speed control through a VFD,and your surface finishes are better. In simple terms, the 3-phase motor gets "three pushes" per revolution, and the speed is more consistent, which can help surface finishes.

texasgunsmith said:

4. I really like the semi/high gloss battleship gray color I think of for these. Any recommendations on the paint type or where to get it ?

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South Bend changed the paint color slightly over the years, and there's a dozen opinions on what "South Bend Grey" really is. Google around a bit and you'll find, for instance, a Sherwin Williams industrial enamel paint formulation called 'South Bend Grey'. Others report satisfaction with gloss grey implement enamel from places like Tractor Supply.

I'd like to congratulate you on being the owner of this lathe. This has certainly got to be one of the most highly optioned SB's of its vintage I've seen lately. If you restore it, do the community a big favor and document the process in pictures and videos. Successes and failures.

kitno455 said:

Hmm- powered turret, spindle brake, and coolant system. This might have been the most expensive SB made at that time. Unfortunately, I think lack of tailstock and compound are negatives for your intended use. But, you might be able to work around them.

allan

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No spindle brake. What's on top of the headstock is the switch lever(forward fast-forward slow-off-reverse). The switch itself is behind the machine.
If the lever is in any position other than off, you can't open the cone cover.
Ted

Thanks for the info Ted- I stand corrected!

allan

You guys rock ! I love the input, appreciate it, really. Barring any complications I will pick it up tomorrow and post the serial #.

kitno455 said:

Hmm- powered turret, spindle brake, and coolant system. This might have been the most expensive SB made at that time. Unfortunately, I think lack of tailstock and compound are negatives for your intended use. But, you might be able to work around them.

allan

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I saw a guy on youtube build a compound from scratch, I'm not that talented, but it gives me hope it can be done, haha.

mdshunk said:

. . .but it's like cleaning the kitchen with a fire hose.

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This cracked me up so much I had to comment on it, haha. But in all seriousness you gave some very useful info, thanks.

mdshunk said:

I'd like to congratulate you on being the owner of this lathe. This has certainly got to be one of the most highly optioned SB's of its vintage I've seen lately. If you restore it, do the community a big favor and document the process in pictures and videos. Successes and failures.

Click to expand...

My plan at the moment is to do exactly that,with pics and vids, barring anything catastrophic. I do already have a modest youtube channel which primarily has gone over firearms, and mostly of the AK variety, though I thought I would post any vids of the lathe there also. You can find the youtube channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8ujyzv2z54hBh5ra7FXEDg

I guess my next question would be to do it in this thread, maybe rename it, or make a new thread in the reconditioning section ?

The CXA series toolpost is a little tall if you end up with a compound for the lathe. A BXA series will give you more height adjustment with a compound bit it will need a shim under it. That's what I did when I had one.

Got it home, still got to get it off the trailor, argh. . . but I got the serial#:
Edit: i think the serial number is just the 130568, is that correct ?

I wouldn't worry too bad about finding a compound, there out there, you could even fit a compound from a totally different lathe, like get one from a 9 or 10 and a lantern tool post, make a block to adapt it so it will bolt in place of your tool post, this can be easily done in the lathe its self. You will have something now that you can use for threads and short tapers, etc... and you can take it off easily and put your tool post back on the cross slide for regular turning, which is a very rigid setup if you wish to take a lot of metal very quickly.

your turret tailstock can do most anything a regular tail can do, you can make use of it by just keeping common tools in it, maybe have a center drill in one hole, a drill chuck or two, a dead center, a live center, and perhaps even throw a pipe center in there, it functions to keep these tools in place and where you need them when you need them, with with such a setup you'd rarely ever have to change out tools. turrets also usually have a longer travel than a standard tailstock so thats nice if your going to be doing deep drilling.

good luck, you got a lot of work ahead of you taking on that beast of a machine.

Well I got the serial card and figured a few things out in the mean time I guess, haha. I will probably make a new thread to go through the restoration and try to be a little organized with pics and links and such.

In the mean time I figured I'd post the serial card, and thanks for the help. The basic gist is this: 16"x6' SBL. Serial# 130568. Catalog# 2-CW. Date Shipped: 09-08-1942. Set up as a turret lathe from factory, 2 speed & reversing 3 phase motor 1800 & 900 RPM 440v 60hz. Also came with coolant pump from factory. Customer was Electric Auto Lite Co. Plant 2 Dept 108 (5-13) Toledo, Ohio.

Serial Card: