Soutbend 2-H rest/carriage question
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  1. #1
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    Default Soutbend 2-H rest/carriage question

    Let me say up front that I am very new to machining/turning, so please be tear me up too fast. I have a SB 2-H (16" swing with a turret). This lathe has a straight T slot carriage and I am investigating how to thread on the machine. I notice that most lathes have compound rests and I think pretty much every video I have watched on threading shows using a compound. I have searched for a compound for my machine but have not found anything specific to a 2-H or 16" SB. My questions are;

    1. do I need a compound? I am sure I could thread without one, however it does seem a lot harder w/o one.
    2. where would I get a compound?
    3. Are there other models that are compatible? I have found quite a few 9" and 10" bases on eBay, but not a lot of the actual compound (top).

    Thanks in advance for any responses.

  2. #2
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    Get a 16" cross slide and its compound rest from the same serial range - or learn to thread straight in - which is some what tough - depending on coarseness of thread

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    That would be good if I could find one. I guess I thought about trying to make something but haven't thought about it all that much.

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    I almost always thread straight in, at least for finer threads.

    allan

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    I have a 2H like you. I havent tried threading with it yet though. I did however pick up a regular toolroom type compound rest off ebay a couple years back, and they do pop up from time time. I still use the original as it suites most of my personal needs. You could also keep your eye out for a complete taper attachment, which the compound would do the same as the regular type.

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    Thank you, thats encouraging. I would really like a compound if I could find one. I have to be honest and admit that I really do not know what I don't know when it comes threading (barely know how to turn down metal). So, in saying that I am not sure exactly what all I need (for the lathe itself). Point being, there is someone on eBay that has 3d printed a threading dial for te 16" (which I also don't have), I am assuming I need one of those?

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    A thread dial provides a way of measuring for running multiple passes, no major strain on it, so plastic is probably fine. The original metal ones pop up on ebay as well usually run $100-$150.
    There's a bunch of tricks and operational stuff to read when you start googling. Start and stop points for length of thread, also depth of thread. As you run multiple passes, getting point of cutting tool exactly in the bottom of cut is one key.

  8. #8
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    Good reading here

    http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/1617/17726.pdf

    Quote Originally Posted by 70chall440 View Post
    Thank you, thats encouraging. I would really like a compound if I could find one. I have to be honest and admit that I really do not know what I don't know when it comes threading (barely know how to turn down metal). So, in saying that I am not sure exactly what all I need (for the lathe itself). Point being, there is someone on eBay that has 3d printed a threading dial for te 16" (which I also don't have), I am assuming I need one of those?

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    So I am wondering if there us any alternative to vintage SB parts to put a compound onto this lathe?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 70chall440 View Post
    So I am wondering if there us any alternative to vintage SB parts to put a compound onto this lathe?

    Thumbnail shows my rig for using a non machine tool slide to do some angular work in my B&S grinder. Its way small, so sits up on the round aluminum riser I made for it

    (The slide is an accessory for my K&E Jig Transit)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails p1000669sm.jpg  

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    Thanks for posting that. I am seeing similar units on eBay for C2/C3 lathes but I cannot discern how they attach to the carriage, I suspect they are for a specific machine. They have a drawing and the base height isn't too far off, they have a 4 tools holder which I would try and ditch for a QCTP (which I already have). I just need to figure out if I can make it work before spending a $100+ on it.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails s-l1600-3-.jpg   s-l1600-4-.jpg  

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    It seems like someone would make an aftermarket compound rest for a lathe, if they do I am having issues finding them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 70chall440 View Post
    It seems like someone would make an aftermarket compound rest for a lathe, if they do I am having issues finding them.
    You're not going to find an aftermarket compound rest directly, think of all the variety of dovetails and such it'd have to mate to, plus not a high market.

    I can think of a couple options though. One, make it yourself if you have a decent mill and other machines available. Or pay a machine shop to make one for you, they could copy your dovetail on current compund, prolly make it as nice as you want, but this may get a little costly.

    Two, cheap way. Use what you have for most things its fine. But for the specialty cuts your looking for maybe mount a multi directional drill press vice directly on your compound. Your compound already has tee slots. I'd secure up how vice might hold cutting tool, but I think its doable. Not a long term solution or permanent,just special cuts. Use your regular tool holder the rest of the time. There's all kinds of varieties of those vices, some swivel or tilt as well:

    Sorry! Something went wrong!

    6" Cross Slide Vise

    Probably enough height left before you pass center of work to make spacers that may swivel or do what you want, if you get creative. Just everything needs be pretty firm, might need modify or improve hardware to deal with stress. I'd try going easy, not hogging off too much lol.

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    Outstanding information/suggestions, I appreciate you taking time to write it. I agree with what you are saying and am going to investigate both ideas. I would like to have a compound rest on the lathe but it is what it is. The driving force on this entire issue is the desire to thread; that said obviously I can use dies and thread that way which is what I have been doing. However, since I have a lathe I would like to learn how to do it.

    It seems like the biggest issue as it relates to threading is the angle of the tool holder/tool (29 or 30 degrees). I can rotate my tool post 360 degrees as it is right now so angling it 30 degrees is not an issue. Now with that said, I will admit that my cross slide does not seem to very finite or actually real precise and perhaps a compound rest would address this part; basically I don't know what I don't know.

    Thanks again

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    I've had no problems threading straight in without a compound slide on a southbend 9 with a turcited saddle and turcited compound slide, but it will leave a torn finish for sure on hot rolled steel. i mostly use neutral rake tooling.. probably above center, and have not cared enough to get a clean finish. so when threading straight in while boring an internal thread, turning the cross slide a tenth of a turn while watching the whole tool post slip a bit as it rotates away from the work. (which should have corresponded to taking .024" off the diameter and finishes the thread in just 6 passes but instead it takes 10 because the whole tool post rotates away.


    btw from personal experience, a dull 8 flute dovetail cutter, cutting cast iron is like butter compared to milling steel with a helical endmill. if you can figure out how to cut two parallel paths on your lathe or mill with a cutter of any type of any material, you can cut a new compound slide from durabar with a cheap dovetail cutter.

    right now there is a southbend 9 with missing handle for 100$

    i made my own compound slide that is just over 1" thick using a mixture of cast iron scrap and a dovetail cutter in a miling machine that cannot be mentioned. i then turcited it with 1/32" inch thick turcite to make up for my bad calculations regarding the gib thickness etc. the end result is that the tool post is bolted to the top of the compound slide but there is only 1/4" of thread engagement between the cast iron and the bolt holding the tool post on it, so i can't tension it beyond about 2000 pounds which results in about 100-200 pounds or so of force at the tool post before it rotates out of the way.
    Southbend lathe 9" Compound slide/Toolrest | eBay

    i mention the turcite because it is allegedly a pretty effective vibration dampener and may explain why i can do this: https://i.imgur.com/N8kFvAe.jpg without chatter, on a southbend 9 with a tool post that is overhung the compound fairly far. the blue is because the chip is from this: https://i.imgur.com/cQU0SWj.jpg and the inside diamter is half the surface speed the outside diameter was.

    i was cutting the top off off a weldable steel concreet anchor, so, rebar mystery meat so to speak.

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    Very interesting, I cannot say I 100% understand everything you are saying but I think I have the concept. Do you have any pictures of your compound?

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    Imgur: The magic of the Internet
    Imgur: The magic of the Internet
    Imgur: The magic of the Internet

    its about a 1.025" thick compound slide and it works just fine

    i bored out the the cross slide to accept a tapered roller bearing, what you see in the second photo is the cut down head of a bolt, so when i want to change the angle of the compound slide i just give it a whack with a hammer and hope friction holds it at the new angle. or back the compound all the way out and loosen the bolt that sucks it down to the cross slide and then tighten it again.

    so what's actually holding the compound down to the cross slide is a tapered roller bearing, and the head of the cap screw has threads cut on the outside of it. so you have to think left handed. the original intent here was i could leave the bolt slightly lose and use the compound slide to cut a radius on the lathe spindle, using a long lever to rotate the compoundslide.. instead i found that i don't need to do that, except in rare cases.

    i bought this lathe for 200 $ and it didn't come with a compound slide which is why i made my own.

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    Adapting a compound from another lathe will always be easier than making a compound from scratch or converting something else into a compound. What does the top of your cross slide look like? show us pics.

    allan

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    Quote Originally Posted by kitno455 View Post
    Adapting a compound from another lathe will always be easier than making a compound from scratch or converting something else into a compound. What does the top of your cross slide look like? show us pics.

    allan

    You have to understand turret lathe cross slide is some higher than "normal" 16" - they were partially accommodating lack of compound rest

    My 16" TL cross slide had cross tee slots towards rear and a pair of long wise up front

    PDF page 33 here has some detail

    http://www.wswells.com/data/catalog/100B/cat_100B.pdf

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    My 2-H looks like this, guessing 70chall440's is the same:

    46.jpg49.jpg54.jpg


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