South Bend 9a tailstock dial

mace2364 · Feb 24, 2020

Hi all,

I’m slowly restoring a South Bend 9a. While I have it apart, I’d like to add a dial to the tailstock, since it obviously has no accurate means of measurement as is. I have not had much luck turning up any info on this, but I can’t be the only one to want a dial on the tailstock.

Has anyone here added a dial to theirs? Better yet, does anyone have a source for parts to do this?

Thanks in advance.

Dobermann · Feb 24, 2020

Obviously there are accurate means of measuring the extension of the tailstock ram--a dial indicator for example. But I need to ask what application requires a measurement more accurate than the "ruler" markings on the ram itself? Relying upon some sort of measurement relative to the tailstock could be quite misleading since the tailstock is not always firmly locked down on the bed. For example, heavy drilling using the tailstock can often result in slight movement of it due to the fact that it's sometimes difficult to lock it down positively.

The Heavy 10 (or 10L) tailstocks have an indexed collar at the handwheel but I never trust it if the movement of the ram relative to a workpiece is critical.

Some indication of what you're trying to accomplish would help in finding a solution for you.

mace2364 · Feb 24, 2020

Chamber reaming requires more precise measurements than the “ruler” on the tailstock barrel. I also seem to find a bunch of little things that aren’t as precise as that but still more so then the 1/16” graduations I have on the tailstock barrel.

SLK001 · Feb 24, 2020

mace2364 said:
Chamber reaming requires more precise measurements than the “ruler” on the tailstock barrel. I also seem to find a bunch of little things that aren’t as precise as that but still more so then the 1/16” graduations I have on the tailstock barrel.

1/16"? Are you sure that it isn't even coarser than that, like 1/10"? And what chamber are you trying to ream on a 9"? Isn't the spindle bore around 3/4"?

Anyway, the TS spindle thread is 10 TPI, so all you need is a collar with 100 graduations on it mounted at the rear of the TS. If you can't squeeze one in, you'll have to make a longer TS spindle so one can be mounted.

tommy1010 · Feb 24, 2020

Get an electronic indicator similar to one used on a bridgeport quill. They are all over Youtube. Lookup tailstock DRO.

SBLatheman · Feb 24, 2020

mace2364 said:
Hi all,

I’m slowly restoring a South Bend 9a. While I have it apart, I’d like to add a dial to the tailstock, since it obviously has no accurate means of measurement as is. I have not had much luck turning up any info on this, but I can’t be the only one to want a dial on the tailstock.

Has anyone here added a dial to theirs? Better yet, does anyone have a source for parts to do this?

Thanks in advance.

I have dials for the 10K and 10L tailstocks.
Send me an email.
Ted
[email protected]

tobnpr · Feb 25, 2020

SLK001 said:
1/16"? Are you sure that it isn't even coarser than that, like 1/10"? And what chamber are you trying to ream on a 9"? Isn't the spindle bore around 3/4"?

Anyway, the TS spindle thread is 10 TPI, so all you need is a collar with 100 graduations on it mounted at the rear of the TS. If you can't squeeze one in, you'll have to make a longer TS spindle so one can be mounted.

Well...

Gunsmiths are aware that chambers can be cut between centers in a steady, still done this way by several major builders. You don't need to chamber with the barrel through the headstock, it's just one of the methods used.

Dumpster_diving · Feb 25, 2020

+1 to Tommy1010's suggestion of a tailstock DRO.

Simple aluminum split-collar on the ram. Cheap 8" caliper with one jaw fixed to the split-collar and the other fixed to the tailstock housing.

Dumpster_diving · Feb 25, 2020

Or even simpler...an aluminum split-collar on the ram and a $10 mag-backed indicator on the top of the tailstock housing with the indicator tip following the split-collar.

20 minute DIY lathe job and you've got a precision tailstock.

M.B. Naegle · Feb 25, 2020

I'm not a gunsmith, but anytime I've needed more guts or more precision out of my tail-stock... I just load the tool up on my tool post and use the carriage. Then you can use whatever DRO or trav-a-dial set-up you typically use for your Z-X positioning.

Dobermann · Feb 25, 2020

I always thought that chambering a firearm was a pretty critical and precise operation. "Chambering between centers with a steady rest?" On a South Bend 9" lathe? Yikes!! Please stand well away from me when you touch that thing off! I think you may need a different machine.

mace2364 · Feb 25, 2020

Dobermann said:
I always thought that chambering a firearm was a pretty critical and precise operation. "Chambering between centers with a steady rest?" On a South Bend 9" lathe? Yikes!! Please stand well away from me when you touch that thing off! I think you may need a different machine.

You can indeed chamber a barrel in a 9” South Bend. A chunk of the lathes in the machine shop at Trinidad State’s gunsmithing department are 9” South Bends. I don’t know how many barrels are chambered on them every year, but suffice it to say that it’s a lot.

Regardless, while I do have a larger lathe in my shop as well, I’m restoring this South Bend 9a. I fully intend on adding an indicator setup like folks here have mentioned. But I would like a dial as well. I use the one on my other lathe all the time. I didn’t realize something so simple would be that controversial, haha!

QuickChange · Feb 25, 2020

Dobermann said:
I always thought that chambering a firearm was a pretty critical and precise operation. "Chambering between centers with a steady rest?" On a South Bend 9" lathe? Yikes!! Please stand well away from me when you touch that thing off! I think you may need a different machine.

Aww, come on, Doberman, where is your sense of adventure

? Seriously, it is fairly straight forward to do this IF you have a 9" with a 4 ft. bed (barely adequate for this work), or better yet, a 4.5 foot bed. Muzzle in the 4-jaw and the breech end supported with a steady rest. Reamer held in the tailstock, preferably with a floating reamer holder. Obviously, all needs to be CAREFULLY dialed in to obtain a satisfactory result. It can be done, I reckon there are countless barrels chambered in this manner.

coyotechet · Feb 25, 2020

Here is a picture of my 9A tail stock with the dial I installed.
The installed dial body is 1.250" Dia. Bought the dial off eBay. All I can remember is I made know changes to the tail stock other the drilling a pin hole to attach it crank/handle.

Chet

jim rozen · Feb 25, 2020

coyotechet said:
Here is a picture of my 9A tail stock with the dial I installed.
The installed dial body is 1.250" Dia. Bought the dial off eBay. All I can remember is I made know changes to the tail stock other the drilling a pin hole to attach it crank/handle.

That's an amazingly cute setup. I do notice however you did what I would have done first, namely installed a dial on the tailstock handwheel, as the original
poster was asking about.

The reason the 9" machines never had that from the factory was, they were built to a price point. The more expensive lathes had one from
the git-go.

I suggest the first thing that he should do is, get a graduated dial and install that where he needs it.

lugnard · Feb 26, 2020

coyotechet said:
Here is a picture of my 9A tail stock with the dial I installed.
The installed dial body is 1.250" Dia. Bought the dial off eBay. All I can remember is I made know changes to the tail stock other the drilling a pin hole to attach it crank/handle.

Chet

View attachment 279953

Chet: Looks like you have a few more interesting things going on other than the really nice dial setup. Thumb locks on the gibbs and what is that down on the saddle? Stop of some sort. Would like too see more pics of the mods to your lathe!!

Harry

tobnpr · Feb 26, 2020

QuickChange said:
Aww, come on, Doberman, where is your sense of adventure? Seriously, it is fairly straight forward to do this IF you have a 9" with a 4 ft. bed (barely adequate for this work), or better yet, a 4.5 foot bed. Muzzle in the 4-jaw and the breech end supported with a steady rest. Reamer held in the tailstock, preferably with a floating reamer holder. Obviously, all needs to be CAREFULLY dialed in to obtain a satisfactory result. It can be done, I reckon there are countless barrels chambered in this manner.

I started with a 9A with a 4-1/2' bed. Roughly the same between centers- I can push it to nearly 36"- same as my bigger Sheldon. IMO, those who mock these small lathes have never run one. In good condition, they're capable of excellent accuracy. Mine is fitted with a DRO on both axes and I have no problems holding one thou tolerances.

I chambered barrels for two years for customers with it- all shot very well commensurate with the quality of the blank used. Those that think a barrel can't be chambered correctly except through the spindle are either misinformed or ignorant. Good enough for McMillan and many others...

YouTube

Anyway, I generally chamber now in my larger Sheldon, through the spindle due to using a pressure flush system.

I do get less chamber runout through the headstock, but I would have no qualms about using my SB if I had to again, it just takes a lot more time.

As anyone knows that's experienced with riflesmithing, there are many ways to accomplish the task at hand- same as in many machining operations. Sometimes I'll use a Grizzly rod, sometimes I'll direct dial the bore. As long as the bore is concentric to the spindle axis, it matters not what method you use to achieve it.

coyotechet · Feb 26, 2020

Some time's I still use the little 9" to do some barrel work between centers. Then some I do small barrel job's using 9" going through the headstock with a cat's head on the out broad end of the spindle.
Most of the time I use my Heavy 10 working through the headstock.
Chet

Got a couple of picture's of the 9" setup.

Heavy 10 setup.

tobnpr · Feb 28, 2020

^^^
Great idea using the dauber hole in the tailstock to hold the indicator!

Looks like you modified an endmill holder to be a floating reamer pusher of sorts?

steve-l · Feb 29, 2020

Dobermann said:
I always thought that chambering a firearm was a pretty critical and precise operation. "Chambering between centers with a steady rest?" On a South Bend 9" lathe? Yikes!! Please stand well away from me when you touch that thing off! I think you may need a different machine.

I have a 10K , same as a 9. Very easy job. Works perfectly.

South Bend 9a tailstock dial

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