Belle large 1 ph motors---- anyone use one?

ChipSplitter · May 12, 2020

Belle Motors is selling this motor/starter package from 30 to 100 hp that runs on single phase.
Does anyone here have any experience using one of them?
I am thinking about using a 40 hp for a hydraulic power unit instead of using a phase converter.
Not spam, BTW....

Rob F. · May 12, 2020

Havn't used one but I did talk to them about their single to three phase generator run off the big 1ph motors. 30 hp motor was around $10k IIRC.
Sales guy did mention electronics and capacitors to get it started. Could those be an added failure point?

Jraef · May 12, 2020

What they are using is called a "Written Pole" motor design. In a nutshell, the rotor has permanent magnets and as such, "creates" the 3rd phase, then uses it. These motors are VERY expensive and once you go that route, you don't have an "off-the-shelf" motor that can be replaced in a hurry. But if that's not a problem for you, then the technology itself works well.

Details if interested.
https://pdhonline.com/courses/e299/e299content.pdf

ChipSplitter · May 12, 2020

Rob F. said:
.....30 hp motor was around $10k IIRC.

Wow, I could get a Phase Perfect and a 3 phase motor for that kind of money.

Rob F. · May 12, 2020

ChipSplitter said:
Wow, I could get a Phase Perfect and a 3 phase motor for that kind of money.

With the genny head attached was closer to $15k, but it might not burn out all the electronics in you house when it fails, like wheeliekings phase perfect....

SomeoneSomewhere · May 13, 2020

Interesting that they're commenting on the low starting current, long start times, low starting torque, and high power factor and efficiency. Apart from being synchronous, it sounds an awful lot like a permanent split motor.

DDoug · May 13, 2020

Jraef said:
What they are using is called a "Written Pole" motor design. In a nutshell, the rotor has permanent magnets and as such, "creates" the 3rd phase, then uses it. These motors are VERY expensive and once you go that route, you don't have an "off-the-shelf" motor that can be replaced in a hurry. But if that's not a problem for you, then the technology itself works well.

Details if interested.
https://pdhonline.com/courses/e299/e299content.pdf

Instead of permanent magnets, why not just a externally excited field ?

Phil in Montana · May 13, 2020

Then it would be a synchronous motor, with a split field for starting...A good Idea...Phil

johansen · May 13, 2020

Phil in Montana said:
Then it would be a synchronous motor, with a split field for starting...A good Idea...Phil

but no way could you get the starting current down to just 1.8 times the full load running amps, while providing 112% full load starting torque.. which sounds like that torque is flat all the way up to pull in speed which is why this motor takes triple digit seconds to start up in stead of double or single digits...

ChipSplitter · May 13, 2020

I'll admit you guys are kinda going over my head.
I'm used to making chips, not move electrons from point A to B.

What's a synchronous motor, pray tell?

SomeoneSomewhere · May 14, 2020

Synchronous = runs at exactly the supply frequency, or a divisor thereof. So a 2-pole motor on 60Hz runs at 3600RPM, 4-pole at 1800RPM. These tend to have issues getting up to speed - sometimes started unloaded and spun up by another motor. Generally only either very large or very small. Used to be used for clocks.

Asynchronous = runs at less than the supply frequency, generally refers to induction motors. So a two pole might run at say 3450RPM.

Then you have DC motors and their cousins, the universal motors, which spin at a speed unrelated to the supply frequency.

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Belle large 1 ph motors---- anyone use one?

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