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dang! How is a guy supposed to learn this stuff..

C

CalG

Diamond
Joined
Dec 30, 2008
Location
Vt USA
Trying to salvage a older Reliance Electric SP600 AC drive

The thing won't boot up. (fans run, whoopee! ;-\)

Took a chance and purchased the control board off ebay.

It BOOTS UP NOW! Just enough for the auxiliary display to tell me, "The Product is not compatible with the host'.

WTFWT!

I knew going in that the rev level of the cards were at odds. I had hoped that a newer card would be backwards compatible. So much is the same, but the difference....ahh.. too great.

They can't teach a fellow this stuff in college! A $50 education. ;-)
 
You've been here way to long to not know your thread title is retarded. :toetap:

Your first sentence in your post should have been the thread title. :)
 
I left it, because it IS kind of a specific topic.... it's not in the same category as a "Help, please" title....

As for the question, the best advice is to not try to repair any VFD that is replaceable with a different one. Only in the case of one that you just have to have the same exact unit is it worth messing with. I say this as one who has designed several VFDs that are in production.

First, the only practical way for most repairs is a board swap. Component level repair is for cases where a board is not available, you need it badly, and the unit cannot be replaced.

Second, with software changes, and hardware changes, you run into just what you found, not all parts work together, even if they appear to be the same. You really need a chart of the revision compatibility to decide what you need. And sellers often have no clue at all, and they may damage the boards they are selling as they scuff around on the carpet getting charged up and drawing sparks from anything grounded.

What you found is actually a GREAT result.... it TOLD you it was not going to work. The other choice was that it might have just tried to work anyway, with the potential result of damaging one or both parts.
 
CalG said:
Trying to salvage a older Reliance Electric SP600 AC drive

The thing won't boot up. (fans run, whoopee! ;-\)

Took a chance and purchased the control board off ebay.

It BOOTS UP NOW! Just enough for the auxiliary display to tell me, "The Product is not compatible with the host'.

WTFWT!

I knew going in that the rev level of the cards were at odds. I had hoped that a newer card would be backwards compatible. So much is the same, but the difference....ahh.. too great.

They can't teach a fellow this stuff in college! A $50 education. ;-)
Click to expand...

on anything like this, first read the mfg book about replacing boards and whatnot. second call mfg and find out the exact series/revision control card you need. you guess and assume, you pay. no they dont teach stuff like this at college, the military used to but now contracts it all out.
scott
 
If you give up I would be interested in the keypad thing. I have bought and sold hundreds of VFDs and I am still end up spending hours to figure out how the set the parameters on certain models.

Stan
 
scott.livesey said:
on anything like this, first read the mfg book about replacing boards and whatnot. second call mfg and find out the exact series/revision control card you need. you guess and assume, you pay. no they dont teach stuff like this at college, the military used to but now contracts it all out.
scott
Click to expand...

Software biz larns a body. Really fast, too. We call it 'Version Hell'. 'libs' as much as anything else.

Oracle Revs vs <=> various OS'en + libs revs among the worst major-vendor mixtures on-planet for many a year.

Not really a surprise to find it in hardware/firmware, either.

Bill
 
JST said:
I left it, because it IS kind of a specific topic.... it's not in the same category as a "Help, please" title....

As for the question, the best advice is to not try to repair any VFD that is replaceable with a different one. Only in the case of one that you just have to have the same exact unit is it worth messing with. I say this as one who has designed several VFDs that are in production.

First, the only practical way for most repairs is a board swap. Component level repair is for cases where a board is not available, you need it badly, and the unit cannot be replaced.

Second, with software changes, and hardware changes, you run into just what you found, not all parts work together, even if they appear to be the same. You really need a chart of the revision compatibility to decide what you need. And sellers often have no clue at all, and they may damage the boards they are selling as they scuff around on the carpet getting charged up and drawing sparks from anything grounded.

What you found is actually a GREAT result.... it TOLD you it was not going to work. The other choice was that it might have just tried to work anyway, with the potential result of damaging one or both parts.
Click to expand...

Yes, the result was a pleasant surprise. That is why it was written in all caps ;-) Such thoughtful engineering. Way better than the exploded capacitors ;-)

Would you care to take a guess as to the likely hood of a Serial Flash RAM (AT45D011) on the control board needing to be "factory programmed' If replaced". IT could hold changed parameters, or it could hold a lot of other things ;-0
 
No real info on that one. But it might contain calibration factors, and other factory data in it, yes.

If the same physical board is used in a line of drives of varying sizes, which is entirely possible for a control/interface board, such a chip might be used to tell the drive what it is supposed to be, what options are allowed, etc, as well as calibrations, display factors so volts and current are shown correctly, etc, etc, etc.
 
Yes, It very well may be that this chip held the drives identity, All up in smoke, I can see where it leaked out with the microscope ;-)

Allibabba or whatever that "buy anything" site is called, shows a source for the chip for less than 50 cents and $2 shipping.

No identity would come with however,,,ahh obsolete electronics are such dead ends. ;-)
 
The problem with fixing VFDs is the fact that the power section and the controls are so linked up that in many cases you cannot be sure where the damage stops.

For instance, ALL failures of power devices should be assumed to at least have taken out the driver chips. Maybe more, depending. Fortunately those are usually all on one PWA. Problem is then with the communications from the controller. That may be on a separate PWA, and now the question is whether the opto isolators are damaged, and if they are on the power board or the control board, or maybe somewhere else. That determines whether more boards need replaced.

Power stuff often fails in such a way that the PWB is damaged, so fixing the board is not always possible, if you even want to try..
 
CalG said:
Trying to salvage a older Reliance Electric SP600 AC drive

"The Product is not compatible with the host'.
Click to expand...

From the manual:

Fault 106 - Incompat MCB-PB

Drive rating information stored on the power board is incompatible with the Main Control board.

Action:
Load compatible version files into drive. (can this only be done by a service tech using a magic wand).
 
Interesting that Rockwell lists the drive as "current" with limited parts availability but a search of the site for parts, updated, downloads etc. information comes back empty.
I'll give the distributor a call Monday to see what they say.
 
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