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I need some help converting A/C current to D/C current.

gorrilla

Stainless
Joined
May 2, 2007
Location
Central Texas, West and North of Austin
I was able to scavenge an electric motor from a treadmill. 2.8 HP Treadmill Duty@ 130 VDC. 2.0 HP continuous@115 VDC/1492 Watts.
Unfortunately, the circuitry internal to the treadmill that converted 110 VAC to the 115VDC was already destroyed by the ham handed individual that wrecked out the motor and treadmill. I'm interested in building my own belt sander with this motor. As of yet, I haven't found a means of converting the current in sufficient amperage. At any price. Nobody seems to be interested in doing this. I've checked with Grainger, and a few electrical suppliers on line. No luck. The treadmill circuitry didn't appear to be all that complicated.
Does anybody have any ideas?
 
I'm no electrical engineer, and I even have a hard time with electrical tape at times.

But AC to DC is incredibly simple.. Its 4 diodes. As far as I can tell 4 diodes hooked
together the right way is called a rectifier.. Radio Shack used to sell one for $5 that
took every bit of 115Vac I could throw at it.

As far as getting proper voltage and speed control, I have NO idea.. But AC to DC is easy.
 
DC treadmill motor? and you wish to run is from AC? Here's a drink from the fire hose.

Quite simple: find a full wave bridge rectifier. This will start and run your motor at full speed only. AC in and DC out. Pick a rectifier having about 2-3 times the motor name plate Amps. Lots of them on eBay.'

If you wish to vary the speed of the motor, connect a variac to the AC and run the rectifier from the variac's output You can dial he motor to any speed you wish for a mere crawl to full at the turn of the knob.

Here's a page of variacs:

variac variable transformer | eBay

Or use a solid state motor controller. This is a unitized box of tricks that offer smooth running, variable speed, fairly high efficiency, good speed regulation, and some measure of motor protection.

Dart or KB controls are the go-to resource for small DC motor controls.

Analog DC Speed Controls | Dart Controls

and

https://www.kbelectronics.com/Variable_Speed_DC_Drives.html

eBay usually has long listings of DC motor controls and drives. Search under DC motor controls, SCR controls, etc.

Spend a little time learning about this topic. The information you learn from this project will come in handy for future projects.

Beware of motor controls based on lamp dimmers, resistors, and vent and ceiling fan controls. These have very poor speed regulation. If constant speed is required on varying loads - as on your sander, you need a motor control with good speed regulation. You don't want your sander if adjusted to low RPM to nearly stall under moderate load.
 
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Watch it with the bridge rectifier also. Rectifying 120VAC full bridged will give you quite a lot more than 115VDC depending on how you do it. Large enough smoothing capacitors will raise the effective voltage by 1.414x, producing about 170VDC. No capacitors will give you very uneven voltage but most motors don't mind this.
 
Variac and a wheatstone bridge?

I think you mean a rectifier bridge.

You could put something together with four diodes, some large capacitors, and a thermistor. But this is probably a bit crude. You can buy motor power supplies, but here is a link to a home brew (160v, 3A, using 220VAC) that a guy used to run his lathe.

There's also a guy that's in your exact situation who builds a AC/DC variable speed motor controller.

Low Cost DC Motor Controller For Treadmill - YouTube
 
You will not find anything off the shelf as most all DC drives are either 90 volts DC 110 Ac input and 180 volts DC with 220 volts input. Yes at one time some guys used treadmill motors for the belt sanders build's but I do belive the motors where not that large or have a special DC input voltage as your seems to have. If it was me I would use an ac motor that is sealed/tefc and a vfd. The treadmill motors are an open frame and will draw in your grinding dust while running.

A large 220v variac and bridge rectifier is gonna be about as close to getting what you want/need to do. That said that variac will be a spendy one.
 
THAT's what I was looking for. Electrical is NOT my forte, as I'm sure is evident. But this sounds exactly like what I was looking for. I will check into the solutions you have mentioned deeper.
I do need the variable speed option to function. If possible. And I want to set all this up to where I can get repalcement parts if I ever need them. This should accomplish that. Thanks.
 
I am not sure if your warning is for safety concerns or for properly driving the motor.

AC Voltages are commonly, almost universally measured in RMS values. RMS stands for Root Mean Square which means you take a number of intervals over each cycle, square the value at each, average them (the Mean), and then take the square root. This is done with calculus so the effective number of samples over that cycle is infinite. Anyway, the RMS value is the effective DC equivalent value of that AC waveform in terms of power or heating effect.

When you rectify an AC Voltage, you get what is called pulsating DC. If you use a full wave rectifier to get a positive Voltage, then the positive half cycles will be the same value after the rectifier as they were before it. And the negative half cycles will appear as additional, positive going half cycles between the original positive going ones. There will be no negative going half cycles. But, this pulsating DC waveform is still not a true, constant value DC: it goes from zero Volts to the maximum Voltage at a rate (frequency) that is twice the rate (frequency) of the original AC. Actually there will be a small Voltage drop in the rectifiers so the DC pulses will be a little lower than the original AC by that amount but this is frequently neglected at higher Voltage levels (115 V - 2 V = 113 V). Due to this pulsating nature of the pulsating DC, we need to use the same RMS value of that DC to find it's effective heating or power capability. Thus if we have a 115 VAC, which is a RMS value, input to the rectifier, we will have about a 113 VDC RMS value at it's output: virtually the same thing. And BOTH of these will have a PEAK value that is around 1..4 times the RMS value or around 160 Volts.

The point is this, a DC motor that is rated at 115 VDC will work with a constant DC Voltage of 115V. But it is the RMS value that counts here and motor ratings are always in RMS values. Since a constant DC Voltage will have the same peak and RMS values the RMS value of that 115 VDC will be exactly that or 115 VDC. Now the output of our full wave rectifier is also 115 V RMS so it will be exactly the same when running that 115 VDC motor as the constant 115 V DC Voltage was. They are exactly equivalent, neglecting the small loss in the rectifiers of course. So, if no filtering capacitors are used, then there is no need for any caution when powering a DC motor that is rated for 115 VDC with a DC Voltage that is derived by a full wave rectifier from the 115 VAC line.

On the other hand, if you were concerned with safety, there still is little need for additional caution. In fact, as the Edison vs. Westinghouse debate on DC vs AC, with equal (RMS) Voltage values, AC is actually more deadly than DC. So, more caution would be in order when working with an 115 VAC motor than when working with a 115 VDC motor that used filtered, non pulsating DC. The 115 V AC Voltage would have a significantly higher peak value than the constant DC would.

I would suggest that roughly equivalent safety precautions be taken with either one.

As one of my favorite authors* said, TINSSAAFL (There Is No Such Thing As A Free Lunch). When rectified DC is filtered, you do get a higher Voltage: about 1.4 times higher or about 160 Volts from a 115 VAC line before the rectifier. But, you do not get more power that way. In fact, due to circuit losses, the available DC power will be less. What happens is as you try to draw more and more current from that filtered 160 V supply, the capacitors will start to discharge after the peaks of the AC line and their Voltage level will drop. They will charge up again when the next half cycle comes along, but for part of the half cycle the actual Voltage will be less than that peak value of 160 V. So, you wind up in effect having a lower value of DC Voltage. Again, it will be the RMS value that counts. The more the current drawn, the lower the DC Voltage will drop between half cycles and hence, the lower the RMS value of that DC. How much it will drop will depend on the value of the filter capacitor(s). This could be self regulating if the filter capacitors are small or if they are larger, the AC current draw could increase to keep them charged to near the full value. This is where it would be possible to damage a DC motor with rectified AC. If you keep the value of the filter capacitors low, then this should not be a problem.

* Author reference = L. Ron Hubbard



Watch it with the bridge rectifier also. Rectifying 120VAC full bridged will give you quite a lot more than 115VDC depending on how you do it. Large enough smoothing capacitors will raise the effective voltage by 1.414x, producing about 170VDC. No capacitors will give you very uneven voltage but most motors don't mind this.
 








 
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