looks like it has potential:
UPDATE: Infinitum Electric Creates Printed-Circuit-Board-Stator Motor
UPDATE: Infinitum Electric Creates Printed-Circuit-Board-Stator Motor
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thoughts on this new motor design?
- Thread starter tomjelly
- Start date
- Replies 8
- Views 1,664
9100
Diamond
- Joined
- Nov 1, 2004
- Location
- Webster Groves, MO
There is no explanation of how it works and the photos are blurred.
Bill
Edit- I did some Googling and found more of the same BS. "Our motors are wonderful" but no real explanation. Sounds like the real product will be defrauded investors.
Bill
Edit- I did some Googling and found more of the same BS. "Our motors are wonderful" but no real explanation. Sounds like the real product will be defrauded investors.
Ziggy2
Stainless
- Joined
- Jun 22, 2013
- Location
- Northern Il
I assumed snake oil due to the presentation. No facts but a lot of hype.
gustafson
Diamond
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2002
- Location
- People's Republic
funny seems they should show itdoing something like rotating
9100
Diamond
- Joined
- Nov 1, 2004
- Location
- Webster Groves, MO
I got the pictures to come in focus and went through the whole presentation. Either I am too stupid to understand the technology or it is nonsense.
The problem with this sort of thing is that historically there have been people who had revolutionary ideas that no one accepted. A prime example is FM radio. I met an engineer who was with a group at a demonstration by inventor Edwin Armstrong. He had AM and FM transmitters and an artificial static generator. The static drowned out the AM and the FM came through clear. One of the group was Claude Shannon, who originated information theory and one smart dude. On the way home, he said "I don't understand it. Armstrong is deceiving himself somehow." Once you get a few things straight in your head, the principle of FM is easy to see, but back then no one could make the intellectual leap.
Nevertheless, until I see a real explanation for the motor's principles or a real demonstration, I am going to stay with the scam contingent.
Bill
The problem with this sort of thing is that historically there have been people who had revolutionary ideas that no one accepted. A prime example is FM radio. I met an engineer who was with a group at a demonstration by inventor Edwin Armstrong. He had AM and FM transmitters and an artificial static generator. The static drowned out the AM and the FM came through clear. One of the group was Claude Shannon, who originated information theory and one smart dude. On the way home, he said "I don't understand it. Armstrong is deceiving himself somehow." Once you get a few things straight in your head, the principle of FM is easy to see, but back then no one could make the intellectual leap.
Nevertheless, until I see a real explanation for the motor's principles or a real demonstration, I am going to stay with the scam contingent.
Bill
Ziggy2
Stainless
- Joined
- Jun 22, 2013
- Location
- Northern Il
I also dug through the info some more. I do see that they have been issues several patents on the stator design. I'm not so sure if the motor is as revolutionary as the hype article claims.
Basically it appears to be a brushless DC motor configured for a pancake profile.
The appear to be using some sort of ferrous and or nickel coatings on the stator windings. I was wonder ing how they could claim to have a "printed circuit stator" and yet get past the lack of iron core for the magnetic field. I don't think an air core motor would be very usable unless you were operating at some fairly high frequencies.
Bridgeport used to use an almost identical motor for raising and lowering the knee. Motor controller was a printed circuit board with a similar coil configuartion. Don't have a picture of one. What I did not like about the Bridgeport motor was that the sucker was all soldered to together and if you had a problem with the keypad such as coolant on it, the whole thing was basically toast. Looks like they were wave soldered together.
One thing that I found rather deceiving in the pictures is that there actually is what does appear to be a rather traditional stator that does solder to the circuit board. They just do not show it in most of the pictures. There is also a rather traditional armature but again, not really shown properly in the pictures.
Maybe I'm not seeing it but the claims do not appear to necessarily match up with physics and EM theory as we currently understand it. To me it looks like they have come up with a more compact motor configuration for using in wheels.
Basically it appears to be a brushless DC motor configured for a pancake profile.
The appear to be using some sort of ferrous and or nickel coatings on the stator windings. I was wonder ing how they could claim to have a "printed circuit stator" and yet get past the lack of iron core for the magnetic field. I don't think an air core motor would be very usable unless you were operating at some fairly high frequencies.
Bridgeport used to use an almost identical motor for raising and lowering the knee. Motor controller was a printed circuit board with a similar coil configuartion. Don't have a picture of one. What I did not like about the Bridgeport motor was that the sucker was all soldered to together and if you had a problem with the keypad such as coolant on it, the whole thing was basically toast. Looks like they were wave soldered together.
One thing that I found rather deceiving in the pictures is that there actually is what does appear to be a rather traditional stator that does solder to the circuit board. They just do not show it in most of the pictures. There is also a rather traditional armature but again, not really shown properly in the pictures.
Maybe I'm not seeing it but the claims do not appear to necessarily match up with physics and EM theory as we currently understand it. To me it looks like they have come up with a more compact motor configuration for using in wheels.
Bill Simmons
Cast Iron
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2006
- Location
- Auburn CA
I'll admit total ignorance to how a motor works but obviously there needs to be a magnetic force between the stator and the rotor. And this usually requires some iron and some windings to create a magnetic field. Ignoring that minor inconvenience, how does the stator in this motor, a pc board, mechanically transfer the forces between the rotor and stator to the housing with out breaking?
Obviously I don't understand the pictures and illustrations. Until I do I am in Bills (Diamond) camp. Buyer and investors beware.
They say they have all this ability by investing $12.5M in a new production facility. That seems a bit light on the cost of a factory unless they sub every thing out.
Obviously I don't understand the pictures and illustrations. Until I do I am in Bills (Diamond) camp. Buyer and investors beware.
They say they have all this ability by investing $12.5M in a new production facility. That seems a bit light on the cost of a factory unless they sub every thing out.
It appears to shift the iron to the rotating parts, and to rely on the thin-ness of the PCB to essentially replace the air gaps and magnetic reluctance of the iron in regular motors. Think of a pancake motor.... it is what they seem to have, but they turned the motor inside out, in a way. I am not clear as to whether it is a "PMAC" (permanent magnet AC ) motor.
It looks as if the PCB is sandwiched between two rotating discs (that may carry magnets if it is PMAC).
The PC board has to take all the reaction of the torque produced, so I would expect a high HP motor to have a number of PCB sections, and maybe to stack them axially.
The PCB traces have to carry the current in the motor, which means the spacing needs to be small to get the cooling required, since the traces may have higher resistance per unit length than wires in regular motors.
It looks as if the PCB is sandwiched between two rotating discs (that may carry magnets if it is PMAC).
The PC board has to take all the reaction of the torque produced, so I would expect a high HP motor to have a number of PCB sections, and maybe to stack them axially.
The PCB traces have to carry the current in the motor, which means the spacing needs to be small to get the cooling required, since the traces may have higher resistance per unit length than wires in regular motors.
